On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 07:29:38 -0600, Mark A. Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Gilberto, > At 09:25 PM 1/24/2005, you wrote: > >>I would probably prefer to discuss this point with an issue that wasn't so > >>emotionally charged because because it can be sensitive for alot of folks. > >>But I would say, no. I think that tastes and expectations can change over > >>the years, norms of behavior. But that doesn't make them moral issues, no.<<
> If an adult marrying a child in 21st c. Kansas (or NYC) is not a moral issue, > then > what *is* a moral issue? I'm not certain how to articulate it but I think that the rules of morality would be more or less deducible from certain basic principles or axioms through some kind of moral reasoning process. So for example, actually harming and abusing a child (or anyone else) is definitely a moral issue. But if its not a case of abused and if you are just talking about people getting married at ages atypical for 21st century Kansas, I don't think that's a moral question. . > > However, perhaps you mean something different by morality than myself. I am > using the term with its usual sociological definition (esp. from Emile > Durkheim). In that context, morality is a neutral, culturally relative > concept which understands "morals" as norms and values. Gilberto: So what is the difference between ettiquette and morality? Gilberto: > >>I think there is a difference between saying something is immoral and > >>saying that something is popularly perceived to be wrong or disgusting.<< Mark: > I suppose you regard morality as an unchangeable absolute. Gilberto: Something like that. I would want to be sensitive to the specific nature of a situation and realize that there are extremes and exceptions. I ithink I'm kind of a pragmatist. And I don't necessarily think that all the morally relevant factors will be adequately captured by a verbal formulation (like the 10 commandments of Moses or the 7 Noachide commandments) and in any given situation there might be more than one moral choice. But I don't consider myself a moral relativist. To me, morality is always relative, whether to a particular Revelation or culture. The first expresses God's standards, which change. The second involves human standards, which both change and vary from place to place. > > >>Maybe a decent example would be the kind of stuff people do on Fear Factor. > >>It's basically a game show where part of the competition might include > >>dares to eat some kind of disgusting substance. Even though most people are > >>on a very visceral level disgusted by the act of eating bugs or horse > >>intestine or whatever, it's not clear that its a moral question.<< > > Well, now I suppose I do not understand you at all. Are you saying that > Muhammad's marriage to Khadija, while disgusting by contemporary standards, > would not be immoral? Wow, that's the first time I've heard anyone call Muhammad's marriage to Khadija disgusting. Demi Moore and Ashton Kutcher don't look THAT bad. And "How Stella got her Groove Back" was more popular than contraversial. You probably meant Aishah. Here is the best article piece I've seen discussing the issue: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Polemics/aishah.html > > >>So, if someone unearthed persuasive evidence which proved that Bahaullah > >>had been involved in certain kinds of unsavory and conventionally immoral > >>behavior it wouldn't play a role in or affect whether you believed in him?<< > I would hope not. Really? Why not? What if it turned out that the Bahai Writings actually came from someone like Charles Manson or Jeffery Dahmer ? And you thought the writings were pretty but they came from a serial killer/serial rapist. Could a person like that really be a Manifestation? Peace Gilberto "My people are hydroponic" __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:archive@mail-archive.com To unsubscribe, send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, use subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu/read/?forum=bahai-st News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
