Exactly Karen a hand dance. Yes I would say give caps lock vo a try. I am for sure going to pick up a full size keyboard with the numpad as soon as I can. Especially if that can help with interacting.
On 9/10/23, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote: > I agree that interaction makes working with the Mac much more efficient. > Having to navigate through every individual item would be unbearable. > > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> on > behalf of Brad Snyder <wb...@swbell.net> > Date: Sunday, September 10, 2023 at 09:05 > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > Subject: Re: Concerned about the future Mac accessibility > If you find Interacting so annoying, you can turn it off in VoiceOver > Utility, under the Navigation category > Grouping Behavior. > There are 4 options to choose from: Standard, Bookend Groups, Announce > groups, and Ignore groups. > Also, you can use the Tab key to enter and exit areas that require > interaction, without using VO + Shift + Up/Down Arrow keys. > > Personally, I find using standard grouping with interacting to be a highly > efficient method of navigating. > It allows for skipping over regions such as Toolbars, and tables when I > don’t need to interact with these regions. > I have been using a Mac for over 10 years, and this has been one of my > favorite features of using a Mac with VoiceOver. > > - Brad - > > > On Sep 10, 2023, at 04:57, lenron brown <lenro...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Interacting is one of the most annoying things, look for some using > the vo key along with another key can be much if I have to hold the vo > key and do other stuff. I made my vo key caps lock. Because there is > no way I am using 3 keys buy using option and the command key, then > whatever other key I need to press. Also Safari seems to be fine but I > am not testing the beta. I do however prefer chrome or firefox. > > On 9/9/23, Jonathan C. Cohn <jon.c.c...@gmail.com> wrote: > > There is a toggle command for VO keys but it is not used much and its > functionality has decresed now that the rotar and quicknav keys are > available. The quicknav keys work like JAWS virtual cursor, but are only > toggled manually by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same > time. > Personally I like using a keyboard with a numpad and turning on numpad > commander then 2, 4, 6, and 8 do the VO commands up, left, right and down. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Sep 9, 2023, at 7:56 AM, Tom Rash <dadnthed...@gmail.com> wrote: > > I’m still new whe it comes to the Mac. Is this a toggle command? > > > On Sep 8, 2023, at 9:40 AM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries > <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > That must be exactly why I don’t encounter the issue. I always use VO > commands when reading text (either via keyboard or the braille display). > So far as I remember, this is what the documentation recommends. > > Also, the command to move keyboard cursor to VO cursor is VO-Command-F4, > just to be sure you’re trying the right function. Moving the mouse > pointer there won’t do it. > > > > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > on behalf of Brad Snyder <wb...@swbell.net> > Date: Friday, September 8, 2023 at 09:35 > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > Subject: Re: Concerned about the future Mac accessibility > > You can avoid this issue by, after navigating to a Heading in an email > message, rather than using arrow keys, use VO navigation to navigate from > that point onward. > > > > - Brad - > > > On Sep 8, 2023, at 07:50, 'Andrew Lamanche' via MacVisionaries > <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > In Apple’s mail app, oftentimes in newslettters, when I jump to a > heading or link using voiceover commands and then attempt to read the > content underneath the heading with arrow keys, I find myself > frustratingly at the beginning of the newsletter again. Even when I > route mouse to voiceover I still don’t seem to be able to read from a > particular heading onwards using arrow keys. > > > > Andrew > > > > > On 8 Sep 2023, at 12:27, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries > <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > > I’ve successfully navigated headings, links, etc., in e-mail messages on > the Mac, suing the usual Voiceover commands. So I don’t know what is > causing your problems here. > > I agree that such navigation works well under Windows, until Microsoft > Outlook crashes – then of course, one loses time restarting it, in some > cases, having to repair the data file corruption, which is the very > annoying aspect. > > Mozilla Thunderbird under Linux performs quite well for e-mail reading. > > > > From: 'Andrew Lamanche' via MacVisionaries > <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > Date: Thursday, September 7, 2023 at 15:18 > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > Subject: Re: Concerned about the future Mac accessibility > > I agree and I use the same tactic: Windows is superior on web navigation > and even email when it comes to newsletters where you can swiftly and > reliably navigate through headings and links and activate them - a > difficult if not impossible task in Apple mail. > > > > Andrew > > > > > > On 7 Sep 2023, at 18:32, lenron brown <lenro...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > I hate web Browsing on the mac. Most other things I am good with. I > use both platforms for different reasons, even having a 2023 MBP 14 > with max chip. I still use my windows computers as my daily drivers. I > like my mac for vocr and logic, and a few other things. Some things > can just be slower on a mac when it comes to page navagation and a > couple other things, I just would rather not deal with it. > > On 9/7/23, Mohamed Fayed <m10fa...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hi, > > I’ve lately switched from 2016 15” MBP to 2023 M2Max 16””. The gain in > performance is tremendous and you will notice it. > > For issues related to “mail is not responding”, it occurs when you > make the > exact keystrokes, but Voiceover continues within a significantly > shorter > duration. > > For web browsing, Safari nowadays is pretty bad. This is not related > to VO. > You may try Google Chrome or MS Edge instead. > > Windows on Apple Silicon is significantly faster. If there is a chance > to > get to Apple Silicon device, and try it yourself, that would be great. > > The issue that annoys me the most is VO stops talking. It is on Mac > and iOS. > I hope they fix it soon. > > Hope that helps, > > Mohamed E. Fayed > > > > > > On 7 Sep 2023, at 8:01 PM, Dave Carlson <dgcarlson0...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > My biggest gripe with Mac OS and VO is web browsing. It’s awful > compared > to Windows with JAWS or NNVDA. It is the main reason I would > seriously > consider going back to Windows if/when it’s time to get a new laptop. > I use DuckDuckGo as my browser now to get away from that annoying > “Safari > is Busy” message that cripples my productivity. > > So I’m on the fence about switching back to Windows, but if VO on the > Mac > does not improve over time (and I doubt that it will) I might just > flip a > coin on the decision. > > Dave Carlson > Woodworker, Musician, Oregonian, Engineer, Farfar > dgcarlson0...@gmail.com > > > > On Sep 7, 2023, at 9:23 AM, Traci Duncan <our4p...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi all, it seems like we are having more than a few messages on this > list > about the disappointment in Mac’s VoiceOver performance. > > Are quite a few of you thinking of switching back to windows? Or are > a lot > of you overall still happy with the VoiceOver experience? > > I think I am mostly curious about this, because I have been talking > about > updating my MacBook Eyre. I guess part of me is beginning to wonder, > should I get a Windows laptop instead? I would be very disappointed > to > spend $900 on a MacBook Air, and still have a lot of performance > issues. > > What are your guises thoughts? > > Thank you, > From Traci's MBA20. > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, > or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach > mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara > at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/1B0EC27E-B19C-4661-B8FC-8B1DB2953F0D%40gmail.com. > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, > or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach > mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, > send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/A5DBBA06-E437-4155-882D-E7D4E91D0C82%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/A5DBBA06-E437-4155-882D-E7D4E91D0C82%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, > or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach > mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/178A95BC-8F87-49DA-A6FD-7095AC00DDA0%40gmail.com. > > > > -- > Lenron Brown > > > Skype: ron.brown762 > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, > or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact > the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list > itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara > at caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web > visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/CAA86uUQmLki%2B3SagH3UF8Pq%2BSZtwJfZfUJS%3D6V0yy%2B3BO5Ax5Q%40mail.gmail.com. > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara > at caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web > visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/0B26A207-4B83-472F-8738-07A71AE132E7%40me.com. > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara > at caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web > visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/MN2PR20MB3383148E21492FBF89AF977ECFEDA%40MN2PR20MB3383.namprd20.prod.outlook.com. > > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/1B79C8BF-75C2-4D12-AD32-89CA06E918DA%40me.com. > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/C62DA365-2A08-4A7F-B71B-85F360FE9E54%40swbell.net. > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark > at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/MN2PR20MB3383D69E1DD6D2CB72A85F79CFEDA%40MN2PR20MB3383.namprd20.prod.outlook.com. > > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the > owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/3BE87F25-DC02-4B2F-A772-05F555F0CB25%40gmail.com. > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners > or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/5B245BBE-93EE-4E89-80FA-C7516D2042BC%40gmail.com. > > > -- > Lenron Brown > > > Skype: ron.brown762 > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/CAA86uUSUP4e7rN7bKQpJ3WS_VJvG5hz00RcNEnKdPS2neLJH_g%40mail.gmail.com. > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/FDA7B40C-997B-4186-B319-0C1CEA81073C%40swbell.net<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/FDA7B40C-997B-4186-B319-0C1CEA81073C%40swbell.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the Mac > Visionaries list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: > mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at > caraqu...@caraquinn.com > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/MN2PR20MB3383021586374E7680CDC26CCFF3A%40MN2PR20MB3383.namprd20.prod.outlook.com. > -- Lenron Brown Skype: ron.brown762 -- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at: mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com The archives for this list can be searched at: http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/CAA86uUR%2BW_h%2BXW8dTWJpNiSpPwtF%2BThN46-KVWWdV_qh_WHFmw%40mail.gmail.com.
