date:20080731

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Somebody in the thread at some point said:

| and a negative - I moved the maps in tangoGPS from /tmp to the (orig
| freerunner) sdcard and it only works partially or not at all.  This is
| offline usage.  If I am online and I delete the map cache so tango
| starts clean, it loads the maps fine - probably caches them in ram.  If
| I go offline to move around, only the maps cached in ram are displayed.
| I can see the files on the sd card so that part is ok.
|
| If I use /tmp tango is fine.

Sorry when you say works partially or not at all, what is the symptom?
~ Is that a GPS issue or a maps on SD Card data retrieval issue?  Which
kernel?

- -Andy
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Re: minimo (browser on freerunner)

2008-07-31 Thread Robert William Hutton

Charles-Henri Gros wrote:
 Brian C wrote:
 henrikz wrote:
 arne anka wrote:
 does it happen with the charger only or everytime you connect usb?

 It happens both with the AC charger and the usb-cable.

 Intrestingly it doesn't freeze the keyboard when using i.e. the terminal,
 however it messes up the key-bindings e.g.:

 With usb plugged in:
 the minus key - outputs a backslash \
 the } outputs a ∼

 with usb unplugged the signs are output correctly!

 seems that the usb port/drivers are interfering with the matchbox-keyboard
 :) 
 I experienced the - outputting \ a few days ago and didn't realize it
 was related to the cable being connected, but I'm sure I had the cable
 connected at the time.  Nice find.
 
 Interesting, I had the same problem but fixed it by replacing
 keyboard.xml with a symlink to another version (in my case, the dvorak
 version, which worked)

I had the same problem as this, but it seems to be working now.  I'll 
let you know if I see a predictable pattern on this one.

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Re: numptyphysics ipk

2008-07-31 Thread Jay Vaughan

 Responsibility ;) I did it once. Take it, submit patches. Talk to the
 author :) Have fun. The port is not 'mine'. We should just sync what  
 we do so
 that we don't waste resources by having two people working in  
 parallel fixing
 the smae things twice. But I will not fix things the next two weeks  
 as I am
 on a camp ground.


okay then i'll have a bash at it, then .. i love numptyphysics, its a  
great game, and with fixed to the UI so it works smoother, i think  
it'll be a great 'here let me demo the freerunner' app to tag along ..

;
--
Jay Vaughan





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Re: Errors compiling with toolchain

2008-07-31 Thread Robert William Hutton

Steven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I think these errors are generic, even though I get them when trying
 to compile openmoko-panel-alarm (since I don't see an ipkg available).
 
 When I run om-conf I get the following errors:
  checking for GTK... configure: error: Package requirements
 (gtkmm-2.4 = 2.8) were not met:
 
  Package pthread-stubs was not found in the pkg-config search path.
  Perhaps you should add the directory containing `pthread-stubs.pc'
 to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable
  Package 'pthread-stubs', required by 'XCB', not found
 
 
 I think my system has a newer version of gtkmm, but om-conf is using
 the toolchain's version.  Or am I misunderstanding?  How do I fix
 that?  Same for pthread-stubs.  It's installed on my system.

I've also tried to build openmoko-panel-alarm and I ran into the same 
problems.  I don't think the build environment includes gtkmm, and there 
certainly isn't a gtkmm package in the default repositories either.

Does anyone know of a gtkmm package?  Otherwise I guess I'll try 
compiling and installing gtkmm from the upstream sources.

Haven't looked at pthread-stubs yet.

 Any help would be greatly appreciated.  I use my cellphone as my alarm
 and really want on working on my FreeRunner.

Yeah, me too.  This is the last killer feature the lack of which is 
stopping me switching over to the freerunner as my everyday phone.

Cheers,

Rob

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Re: Errors compiling with toolchain

2008-07-31 Thread Robert William Hutton

Steven [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I think these errors are generic, even though I get them when trying
 to compile openmoko-panel-alarm (since I don't see an ipkg available).
 
 When I run om-conf I get the following errors:
  checking for GTK... configure: error: Package requirements
 (gtkmm-2.4 = 2.8) were not met:
 
  Package pthread-stubs was not found in the pkg-config search path.
  Perhaps you should add the directory containing `pthread-stubs.pc'
 to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable
  Package 'pthread-stubs', required by 'XCB', not found
 
 
 I think my system has a newer version of gtkmm, but om-conf is using
 the toolchain's version.  Or am I misunderstanding?  How do I fix
 that?  Same for pthread-stubs.  It's installed on my system.

I've also tried to build openmoko-panel-alarm and I ran into the same 
problems.  I don't think the build environment includes gtkmm, and there 
certainly isn't a gtkmm package in the default repositories either.

Does anyone know of a gtkmm package?  Otherwise I guess I'll try 
compiling and installing gtkmm from the upstream sources.

Haven't looked at pthread-stubs yet.

 Any help would be greatly appreciated.  I use my cellphone as my alarm
 and really want on working on my FreeRunner.

Yeah, me too.  This is the last killer feature the lack of which is 
stopping me switching over to the freerunner as my everyday phone.

Cheers,

Rob

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Re: trying to buy a freerunner in taipei?

2008-07-31 Thread Harry

Any body interested become reseller and provide service to Taiwanese
community ?
At least, any one can acting order collector, like 10packs order list
from community, help to contact people whom want to order Freerunner.

you can send email to me, I can tell you how to become a reseller in Taiwan.

BR

Harry


Lin Mac 提到:
 I'm surprised too, especially here in Taiwan, where openmoko is located.
 Steve said that Or become a disty and turn a problem into prosperity, but 
 there is no information about how to.


 Best Regards,
 Mac Lin


   
 Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 23:16:03 -0400
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: community@lists.openmoko.org
 Subject: Re: trying to buy a freerunner in taipei?

 On Thu Jul 31, 2008 at 10:31:29AM +0800, MKL23 wrote:
 
 What is the requirements to become a distributor?
 A firm? Or personal workshop?
   
 you know how in a major city you can find a handful of little stores usually 
 operated by someone from China or Taiwan, and grab the latest ASUS, or MSI 
 (or FIC) mobo?

 itd be great if those places had some openmoko stock

 im pretty shocked there isnt one in Taipei?

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Re: GSM detection/identification

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 09:57:01PM -0400, Paul Buede wrote:
 Dimitri wrote:
  Are you able to make and receive calls?
 
  If not, perhaps the sim isn't touching all the phone's connections.
 
  At least, that's the problem I had when I tried to connect to ATT. It would
  show that I had 5 bars, but it would always say Registering
 
  I was able to wiggle the sim a little, reboot the phone, and have it
  properly connect to the ATT network (i.e., it changed from Registering...
  to ATT and I was able to make/receive calls and text messages).
 
  D
   
 
  Paul Buede wrote:

  So, I picked up a tmobile sim, and signed up with them (I have another
  week to cancel), and so the phone registers with tmobile.  I am finding
  the coverage isn't great in the rural areas I find myself.  When driving
  around, if out of reach of tmobile, it will say registering as if
  there is no sim card.  But, on the little image of the antenna, that
  shows how strong my connection is, I still have 2 bars.  Is that a bad
  guage of connectivity?  Is it wrong?  Or does that maybe tell me that it
  has 2 bars of strength with some sort of other gsm network?  Is there a
  way I can query the phone from the cli to have it show me the different
  carriers it can sense network for?  I am interested in running a little
  cron to pipe all carriers it detects into a file every minute as I drive
  around the countryside, so I can see  who i will get the best coverage
  with.
 
  Thanks
 
  
 
 Yes, I am able to make and receive calls when it reads T-Mobile in the
 upper left. But then, as I get further away from civilization it
 switches to Registering, but a bar or two remain in the upper right.

Hmm. Has anyone ported Kismet to the OpenMoko yet?

Also, has anyone created a GSM Kismet, or some kind of tool that will list all 
carriers and their relative signal strengths.

Since the phone has a built in GPS, it seems like it would be the absolutely 
ideal Kismet platform, and also for something similar to map cell phone signal 
strength and coverage.

With GPRS, it could also upload that coverage data to a public site somewhere 
and create nice interactive maps. Could be helpful for people choosing which 
carrier to use: you could see who's got what coverage where in places that you 
commonly travel to, live in, and work in.

The carriers would hate it, but so what. The people might find it useful.

-ken

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Re: Which ATT data plans are compatible?

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 02:05:53PM -0700, ian douglas wrote:
 Just don't try tethering (using your phone as a modem) on their cheap
 data plan, or they'll hit you with overage fees or tell you to convert
 to the smarthphone plan.
 

Is there a specific limit? How do they *know* you are tethering? What are the 
overage fees and where are they detailed?

Thanks.

 
 
 Steven ** wrote:
  My understanding is that it's marketing BS and there isn't much (if
  any) difference between those unlimited data plans.  The difference
  seems to be what ATT is willing to sell you.  If you have a crappy
  old phone, they'll sell you a cheap data plan because they figure you
  won't use it.  If you have a smartphone, they figure you might
  actually be able to and want to browse the web and therefore charge
  you more.
  
  What I'm thinking of trying is taking my old, crappy flip-phone into
  the store when asking about data plans.  That should get me the cheap
  plan.  Then just pop the SIM card back into my Neo.  I'm betting I'll
  have full internet.  Worst case scenario: I'll have to tunnel
  everything through port 80.
  
  -Steven
  
  On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:55 AM, Dimitri [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  I've set up an ATT pay-as-you-go plan, and I'm able to send/receive calls 
  and
  text messages.
 
  (I had to wiggle the sim card for the phone to recognize the att network: a
  hardware flaw that's been discussed to death.)
 
  Which ATT data plans are compatible with the Freerunner?
 
  There's a ton of them available, with radically different pricing for
  unlimited.
 
  I see names like PDA Personal, MediaNet, DataConnect, and a bunch of
  others.
 
  Which ATT data access plans are compatible with Openmoko?
 

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Re: ASU as daily phone, someone ?

2008-07-31 Thread Benedikt Schindler

Jacob Peterson schrieb:
 On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 6:56 PM, Marco Trevisan (Treviño) 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Xavier Cremaschi ha scritto:
  I am currently using Qtopia on Freerunner as my main/daily
 phone, but
  could someone tell me if ASU would be usable too ? What will I
 loose (in
  usability/functionality) with ASU ?


It's working fine. ... just takes your time to get it installed right :) 
 the maintained rootfs wasn't working out of the box


 Well, I'm trying to do that but it's not easy... Actually I
 neither can
 make my freerunner ring on calls (just vibrate installing the
 ringprofiles packages). I've made a script for that (that reads the
 modem output, but it's not exactly what we whould expect from a
 daily use :P



 I have been using a FreeRunner with ASU as my main phone for the past 
 couple of weeks and it has been working out well once I managed to 
 find the right combination of kernel and packages.  It is really fun 
 to show it off to people and everyone is rather impressed by it. 

I just managed to install ASU so it works fine for all normal phone 
stuff.  (Call/SMS/Conntacts/GPS/GPRS)
I will set up/update a wiki-page for the ASU installation i have done.
And maybe i am also able to create a rootfs with my packages. so that 
the first
installation of a working ASU would be easyer for the beginning.

But first i have to clean up some things.  btw could someone please 
send me a fresh ASU- /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89qtopia ? ;)



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Re: wrong offset of mouse in landscape mode (and scummvm)

at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Scummvm there is a pre-built image

On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Iker Berasaluce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 2008/7/30 Evan [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 dumb question, but just out of curiousity, what version of scummvm are you
 guys installing? is it one of the binary packages from the scummvm website?
 i'm not sure what packaging formats the freerunner can handle, and wasn't
 sure if it could take deb or rpm files, or which package i should download
 (or if i'm on the completely wrong track and there is an opkg install
 package for it). even if it isn't working perfect, i'd like to check it out.

 One of the first things I want to do when I get my FR is installing scummvm,
 so I don't think its a dumb question and I'm interested in the answer too.

 --
 Iker Berasaluce
 Departamento de Informatica
 Fulcrum SA

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Re: ASU - startup broken by upgrade?

 only problem was if i had already used opkg to upgrade i could not get  
 it to
 install the older packages

have a look at
opkg -h
there should be something like --force-downgrade or so

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Re: wiki database error

2008-07-31 Thread Alexander Köb

BrendaWang schrieb:
 Hi, Guys:
 Our IT already fix this.
 Does it still happened?
 
 Brenda
 
works fine with me...

thanks
alex

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Please confirm - i doubt my msgs are reaching properly or not

2008-07-31 Thread Pritam, Ghanghas (IE10)

 

 

Hail Moko,
Pritam Ghanghas



 

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Re: Mokomakefile on Debian on PowerPC64/G5

2008-07-31 Thread Robert Schuster

Hi,
I am building OpenEmbedded stuff (OpenMoko for FreeRunner, Angstrom for
BeagleBoard) on my Fedora G4 iBook all day and it works.

Please paste your error message to a pastebin service and provide the
URL here.

Regards
Robert

Christ van Willegen schrieb:
 Hi,
 
 I guess I'm the first one to try this...
 
 Because there is no (native) support for building OpenMoko software on
 an iMac (G5, rev c with iSight), I decided to see if installing Debian
 would work.
 
 Following the instructions on [1] I was able to install Debian 'just
 fine'. In short, you don't get X and gdm...
 
 Then, I followed the usual instructions about Mokomakefile and its
 prerequisites.
 
 Building the OE environment gave me an error - powerpc64 architecture
 not supported (or something close to that). If this doesn't ring any
 bells, I'll check and get the exact wording later.
 
 Is that something that can be fixed by me, or is it simply impossible
 to do this on a powerPC64 architecture? I don't need Qemu, I'll have
 my Freerunner soon, but probably no working ways to build software for
 it...
 
 Regards,
 
 Christ van Willegen
 
 [1] http://www.justlinux.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-150809.html




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Re: ASU as daily phone, someone ?

2008-07-31 Thread Wilkinson, Alex

0n Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 10:37:46AM +0200, Benedikt Schindler wrote: 

I will set up/update a wiki-page for the ASU installation i have done.

That would be handy!

 -aW

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Re: Suspend / Resume

2008-07-31 Thread Ole Kliemann

On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 04:42:52PM -0400, Matthew Lane wrote:
 When suspending, GSM calls DO wake the phone up, but SMS does not?  
 Also, when I resume from a suspend, I cannot send/receive SMS?  Qtopia 
 also seems to have this problem..once I suspend I cannot receive SMS, 
 and I'm not even sure if sending works either.  Is this common?

On Qtopia SMS do not wake up my phone. I haven't noticed that SMS is
broken completely after resume, but SMS that were send to me during
suspend I often received hours later. That was probably then, when I
rebooted the device. So I guess I can confirm SMS is broken after
resume.


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Re: ASU as daily phone, someone ?

2008-07-31 Thread Jacob Peterson

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:37 AM, Benedikt Schindler [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 Jacob Peterson schrieb:
  On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 6:56 PM, Marco Trevisan (Treviño)
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  Xavier Cremaschi ha scritto:
   I am currently using Qtopia on Freerunner as my main/daily
  phone, but
   could someone tell me if ASU would be usable too ? What will I
  loose (in
   usability/functionality) with ASU ?
 

 It's working fine. ... just takes your time to get it installed right :)
  the maintained rootfs wasn't working out of the box
 
 
  Well, I'm trying to do that but it's not easy... Actually I
  neither can
  make my freerunner ring on calls (just vibrate installing the
  ringprofiles packages). I've made a script for that (that reads the
  modem output, but it's not exactly what we whould expect from a
  daily use :P
 
 
 
  I have been using a FreeRunner with ASU as my main phone for the past
  couple of weeks and it has been working out well once I managed to
  find the right combination of kernel and packages.  It is really fun
  to show it off to people and everyone is rather impressed by it.
 
 I just managed to install ASU so it works fine for all normal phone
 stuff.  (Call/SMS/Conntacts/GPS/GPRS)
 I will set up/update a wiki-page for the ASU installation i have done.


If you do find/start a wiki page let me know, I would be interested in
helping with that.



 And maybe i am also able to create a rootfs with my packages. so that
 the first
 installation of a working ASU would be easyer for the beginning.

 But first i have to clean up some things.  btw could someone please
 send me a fresh ASU- /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89qtopia ? ;)


Below is my 89qtopia file.   Good luck :)

-Jacob

/etc/X11/Xsession.d/89qtopia:

#!/bin/sh

# xmodmap to allow the soft-menu to work
xmodmap -e keycode 180 = 0x11000601
xmodmap -e keycode 181 = 0x11000602
xmodmap -e keycode 182 = 0x11000603
xmodmap -e keycode 183 = 0x11000604
xmodmap -e keycode 184 = 0x11000605
xmodmap -e keycode 185 = 0x11000606
xmodmap -e keycode 186 = 0x11000607
xmodmap -e keycode 187 = 0x11000608
xmodmap -e keycode 188 = 0x11000609
xmodmap -e keycode 189 = 0x1100060A
xmodmap -e keycode 190 = 0x1100060B
xmodmap -e keycode 191 = 0x1100060B
xmodmap -e keycode 192 = 0x1100060A
xmodmap -e keycode 193 = 0x1100060C
xmodmap -e keycode 194 = 0x1100060D
xmodmap -e keycode 195 = 0x1100060E
xmodmap -e keycode 196 = 0x1100060F
xmodmap -e keycode 197 = 0x11000610
xmodmap -e keycode 198 = 0x1008ff26

# path setup
export QPEDIR=/opt/Qtopia
export PATH=$QPEDIR/bin:$PATH
export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$QPEDIR/lib:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH

export QTOPIA_PHONE_VENDOR=ficgta01
export QTOPIA_PHONE_MUX=ficgta01

QTOPIA_MESSAGE=The qpe process vanished. This is bad.
This is not meant to happen and is likely a sign of
a bug in Qtopia. Please try to reproduce it and
report the issue to http://docs.openmoko.org.

To be able to use your phone as a phone again you
will have to restart Qtopia.





# Now start Qtopia
echo 1  /sys/devices/platform/neo1973-pm-gsm.0/power_on
/usr/bin/app-restarter $QTOPIA_MESSAGE qpe 21 | logger 


89qtopia
Description: Binary data
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Re: Please confirm - i doubt my msgs are reaching properly or not

see for yourself:
http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-July/024567.html

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 10:50 AM, Pritam, Ghanghas (IE10)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




 Hail Moko,
 Pritam Ghanghas



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Re: Please confirm - i doubt my msgs are reaching properly or not

2008-07-31 Thread Federico Lorenzi

Consider the message recieved.

On 7/31/08, Pritam, Ghanghas (IE10) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:




 Hail Moko,
 Pritam Ghanghas







-- 
Sent from Gmail for mobile | mobile.google.com

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Re: Openmoko on Design

On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 11:38:07AM +0800, John Lee wrote:
 On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 01:47:29AM +0100, Al Johnson wrote:
  I'll snip most of it to keep the length reasonable.
 
 same here :)
 
  On Tuesday 29 July 2008, William Lai wrote:
  
   It already is.
   We've offered a couple of different solutions to community requests that
   were declined by, well, engineering.  One of them was:
  
   * create a package to be installed through installer adding manual
   qwerty button to illume theme.
  
  The only suggestion I remember was that the community fork illume. Is this 
  a 
  different take on the same suggestion, or a different suggestion? What was 
  the other option? And what was the objection to providing it as a 
  configuration option with the default being off, as proposed on this list?
 
 
 What we are trying to do:
 
 provide a OM repository and a community repository.  in this
 particular case, if in the end the illume still shipped without kbd
 button, then the community will very likely provide another version of
 illume called illume-kbd in the community repository.  thus you can
 replace the shipped illume with illume-kbd, and the next upgrade will
 get the new version of illume-kbd instead of illume, so you don't need
 to change it again after upgrade.
 
 
 Where we are right at the moment:
 
 illume is there.
 
 the community repository is not ready yet but we're working on it.
 
 the dependency handling of replacing the shipped illume with
 illume-kbd is not ready yet but we're working on it.
 
 
 My personal comment on this:
 
 if the illume is so much more popular then illume-kdb (theoretically
 we can know that from the repository log) or the other way around then
 you bet that fact will be very effective in OM.  ;)
 

I bought the FreeRunner in order to:

1) Use for remote system administration, via a terminal and onscreen keyboards, 
via SSH over WiFi and GPRS.
2) Browse the web via WiFi and/or GPRS
3) Read/write email using some kind of IMAP mail app, and send/recieve SMS
4) Make and receive calls via VOIP and GSM
5) Play media (Vorbis, MP3, FLV's, MP4's) and record audio
6) Write a custom touchscreen UI app for a linux-based music synthesizer 
(connecting to the synth via Bluetooth)
7) Maybe run some simple synth applications on the FR, using the USB host mode 
to connect it to a MIDI keyboard.

So far, not even the first 5 of those are complete and reliable enough for me 
to actually use without hassle, and based on what I've read here, I'm 
estimating about 2 years before they are.

In the meantime, however,  I've realized that I can probably get through the 
rest of my life happily without *any* of the above features, and I should have 
waited a few more years before spending so much money.

-ken

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Re: GSM detection/identification. Kismet on Freerunner

2008-07-31 Thread Stroller


On 31 Jul 2008, at 09:31, Ken Restivo wrote:
 ...
 Hmm. Has anyone ported Kismet to the OpenMoko yet?
 ...
 Since the phone has a built in GPS, it seems like it would be the  
 absolutely ideal Kismet platform, and also for something similar to  
 map cell phone signal strength and coverage.

Hi there,

I don't think the Freerunner's wifi driver (chip firmware?) will do  
passive mode. I think you may be able to run Kismet without this, but  
if so it is MUCH less useful.

 Also, has anyone created a GSM Kismet, or some kind of tool that  
 will list all carriers and their relative signal strengths.
 ...
 With GPRS, it could also upload that coverage data to a public site  
 somewhere and create nice interactive maps. Could be helpful for  
 people choosing which carrier to use: you could see who's got what  
 coverage where in places that you commonly travel to, live in, and  
 work in.

I think this idea was suggested a while ago, with some positive  
responses.

Stroller.


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Re: [openmoko-announce] Openmoko on Design

2008-07-31 Thread papa-piet

 It seems to me from my former-product-mananger perspective that OpenMoko 
 doesn't really want to be in the software business. 
 
 I'm sensing a business model that has OpenMoko focussing on selling 
 general-purpose computing hardware (like Dell or ASUS). but in a handheld 
 format, and letting the community or some third party (like 
 Trolltech/Nokia) deal with the software issues, for the most part. 
 
 Obviously they need to ship the phone with *something*, so they're betting on 
 Qtopia-over-X11, which seems a solidly good choice.
 
 The one very big problem with this model, is that Dell and ASUS have very 
 mature, end-user-ready software suites (Ubuntu, Windoze, etc.) to ship with 
 their hardware or for users to add on their own, and the OpenMoko doesn't 
 really have that yet.
 
 This will get sorted out though. I'd bet on about two years from now it'll 
 all be squared away.
 
 -ken
 
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Hey Ken, Hey Community,

this is also my interpretation, Openmoko is trying only to to open up a
building site, *WE* have to build our houses and factories, anybody
expecting more than infrastructure is still bound to products before NEO
and before Openmoko.

freeyourphone.de

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Re: numptyphysics ipk

i get these errors:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# opkg install libsdl-1.2-0
Package libsdl-1.2-0 (1.2.9-r5) installed in root is up to date.
opkg install libsdl-image-1.2-0
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# opkg install libsdl-image-1.2-0
Installing libsdl-image-1.2-0 (1.2.3-r0) to root...
Downloading 
http://rabenfrost.net/celtune/ipk/armv4t/libsdl-image-1.2-0_1.2.3-r0_armv4t.ipk
Configuring libsdl-image-1.2-0
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# opkg install 
http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphys
ics_0.2_armv4t.ipk
Downloading http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphysics_0.2_armv4t.ipk
Installing numptyphysics (0.2) to root...
Collected errors:
 * ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for numptyphysics:
 *  libsdl *  libsdl-image *

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 9:45 AM, Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Responsibility ;) I did it once. Take it, submit patches. Talk to the
 author :) Have fun. The port is not 'mine'. We should just sync what
 we do so
 that we don't waste resources by having two people working in
 parallel fixing
 the smae things twice. But I will not fix things the next two weeks
 as I am
 on a camp ground.


 okay then i'll have a bash at it, then .. i love numptyphysics, its a
 great game, and with fixed to the UI so it works smoother, i think
 it'll be a great 'here let me demo the freerunner' app to tag along ..

 ;
 --
 Jay Vaughan





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Re: So what should I learn and develop for?

2008-07-31 Thread Gothnet




Matthew Lane wrote:
 
 It looks like future frameworks are heading towards the ASU or FSO?  I'm 
 not really sure, although ASU seems to be a merge of 2007.2 and 
 Qtopia, so perhaps that direction is what you're looking for?
 

Perhaps, though I have my doubts about running a full X server on neo
hardware, Qtopia's framebuffer approach might be a little more resource
friendly.

Guess I'll have to try a couple of them.
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Re: [openmoko-announce] Openmoko on Design

2008-07-31 Thread Clemens Kirchgatterer

Ken Restivo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 It seems to me from my former-product-mananger perspective that
 OpenMoko doesn't really want to be in the software business. 

why would they do ASU/FSO then? i don't buy this.
 
 I'm sensing a business model that has OpenMoko focussing on selling
 general-purpose computing hardware (like Dell or ASUS). but in a
 handheld format, and letting the community or some third party
 (like Trolltech/Nokia) deal with the software issues, for the most
 part. 

if that was true, they would just throw some money at trolltech/nokia
and ship qtopia, not needing to bother with anything else. for sure
would be much cheaper (at least i think).

best regards ...
clemens

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Re:

2008-07-31 Thread Al Johnson

On Thursday 31 July 2008, Lynn Nguyen wrote:
 Hmm are there any benefits to booting from an sd card? I think I would
 prefer not to if possible.

With the SD you can dual-boot, triple-boot or whatever. This lets you keep a 
stable system and a testing system, or to pick whether you want to boot into 
2007.2, ASU, FSO or Qtopia. If you need more space than the internal flash 
then SD may be good, and you might prefer it if you worry about write cycles 
on the internal flash. OTOH SD (on the Freerunner) uses the limited bandwidth 
to the Glamo. 

 Where do you guys get your snapshots? I think I would like to just reflash
 the openmoko. These are the steps I originally took... Does anyone know if
 I am actually doing it right?

 1. download images from
 http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/?C=M
;O=D

 2. flashing kernel:
 # sudo su
 #  ./dfu-util -a kernel -d 0x1457:0x5119 -R -D
 /home/lynn/moko/flash/uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3238-r8-neo1973.bin

 3. flashing rfs
 # sudo ./dfu-util -a 5 -d 0x1457:0x5119 -R -D
 /home/lynn/moko/flash/OpenMoko-openmoko-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-2007112
1-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2

Couldn't say - I've only used the Freerunner.

 I noticed that on this, the time is never right, could it be because of the
 images I got? Where can get the correct images if this is the case?

Not sure what you mean by this. That time isn't set on your phone? Timezone 
not set? Or timestamp of the files looks wrong?

 Also, where do people get their ipkg feeds? Like, what sources are listed
 in your /etc/ipkg.conf and /etc/ipkg/*.conf files?

The default ones, plus my own as generated by mokomakefile


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Re: numptyphysics ipk

  * ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for numptyphysics:
*  libsdl *  libsdl-image *

try --force-depends

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Re: numptyphysics ipk

2008-07-31 Thread Olivier Migeot

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:39 AM, Yorick Moko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~# opkg install 
 http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphys
 ics_0.2_armv4t.ipk
 Downloading 
 http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphysics_0.2_armv4t.ipk
 Installing numptyphysics (0.2) to root...
 Collected errors:
  * ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for numptyphysics:
 *  libsdl *  libsdl-image *

If you're sure that libsdl is installed (which is the case in your
example), you can try to force numpty's installation :

opkg instal -force-depends
http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphysics_0.2_armv4t.ipk

Worked here.

-- 
Olivier
 M.

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Re: numptyphysics ipk

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:44 AM, arne anka [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  * ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for numptyphysics:
*  libsdl *  libsdl-image *

 try --force-depends

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I was just going to post that opkg install
http://wwwpub.zih.tu-dresden.de/~mkluge/numptyphys
ics_0.2_armv4t.ipk -force-depend works :)

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Re: GPS application (was: Request for help: Would like community applications to show anddiscuss at LinuxWorld)

start-up solved:
[Desktop Entry]
Encoding=UTF-8
Name=Navit
TryExec=navit
GenericName=Navit
Comment=GPS Navigation
Exec=navit
Icon=diversity-nav
Terminal=false
Type=Application
Categories=Network;GPS;
StartupNotify=true
SingleInstance=true

solved it

but the destination screen crashes

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Yorick Moko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 that page seems very out-dated...
 I modified the desktop file and it still won't start, what am I doing wrong?
 the file looks like this:

 Encoding=UTF-8
 Name=Navit
 TryExec=navit
 GenericName=Navit
 Comment=GPS Navigation
 Exec=navit
 Icon=diversity-nav
 Terminal=false
 Type=Application
 Categories=GPS;
 StartupNotify=false

 What am I doing wrong?
 Also I could not find any info about the known workaround for crashing
 when opening the destination screen


 On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 4:49 PM, Tilman Baumann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 arne anka wrote:
 Navit works supprisingly well.
 Very well with 'stolen/misused' MapRoute maps.

 got wherefrom, ie what kind of maps work with it?
 http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Main_Page#Maps

 But i have to say, the navit build for openmoko is in bad condition.
 (easy to fix)

 care to elaborate?
 The version from Alessandro (ipkg tree linked on his wiki site) is very
 old, has no .desktop file and icon and crashes when you open the
 destination screen (known workaround).

 Details here
 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Navit
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Re: Openmoko on Design

2008-07-31 Thread Jacob Peterson

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 4:27 AM, Ken Restivo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 11:38:07AM +0800, John Lee wrote:
  On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 01:47:29AM +0100, Al Johnson wrote:
   I'll snip most of it to keep the length reasonable.
 
  same here :)
 
   On Tuesday 29 July 2008, William Lai wrote:
   
It already is.
We've offered a couple of different solutions to community requests
 that
were declined by, well, engineering.  One of them was:
   
* create a package to be installed through installer adding manual
qwerty button to illume theme.
  
   The only suggestion I remember was that the community fork illume. Is
 this a
   different take on the same suggestion, or a different suggestion? What
 was
   the other option? And what was the objection to providing it as a
   configuration option with the default being off, as proposed on this
 list?
 
 
  What we are trying to do:
 
  provide a OM repository and a community repository.  in this
  particular case, if in the end the illume still shipped without kbd
  button, then the community will very likely provide another version of
  illume called illume-kbd in the community repository.  thus you can
  replace the shipped illume with illume-kbd, and the next upgrade will
  get the new version of illume-kbd instead of illume, so you don't need
  to change it again after upgrade.
 
 
  Where we are right at the moment:
 
  illume is there.
 
  the community repository is not ready yet but we're working on it.
 
  the dependency handling of replacing the shipped illume with
  illume-kbd is not ready yet but we're working on it.
 
 
  My personal comment on this:
 
  if the illume is so much more popular then illume-kdb (theoretically
  we can know that from the repository log) or the other way around then
  you bet that fact will be very effective in OM.  ;)
 

 I bought the FreeRunner in order to:

 1) Use for remote system administration, via a terminal and onscreen
 keyboards, via SSH over WiFi and GPRS.
 2) Browse the web via WiFi and/or GPRS
 3) Read/write email using some kind of IMAP mail app, and send/recieve SMS
 4) Make and receive calls via VOIP and GSM
 5) Play media (Vorbis, MP3, FLV's, MP4's) and record audio
 6) Write a custom touchscreen UI app for a linux-based music synthesizer
 (connecting to the synth via Bluetooth)
 7) Maybe run some simple synth applications on the FR, using the USB host
 mode to connect it to a MIDI keyboard.

 So far, not even the first 5 of those are complete and reliable enough for
 me to actually use without hassle, and based on what I've read here, I'm
 estimating about 2 years before they are.


2 years?  At the rate I am seeing progress, I would bet closer to two
months, as it seems the ASU and eventual FSO images are coming along quite
nicely.



 In the meantime, however,  I've realized that I can probably get through
 the rest of my life happily without *any* of the above features, and I
 should have waited a few more years before spending so much money.

 -ken

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Re: GPS application (was: Request for help: Would like community applications to show anddiscuss at LinuxWorld)

my apologies for the spam,
i didn't read the wiki good enough, the fix is there

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:36 PM, Yorick Moko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 start-up solved:
 [Desktop Entry]
 Encoding=UTF-8
 Name=Navit
 TryExec=navit
 GenericName=Navit
 Comment=GPS Navigation
 Exec=navit
 Icon=diversity-nav
 Terminal=false
 Type=Application
 Categories=Network;GPS;
 StartupNotify=true
 SingleInstance=true

 solved it

 but the destination screen crashes

 On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Yorick Moko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 that page seems very out-dated...
 I modified the desktop file and it still won't start, what am I doing wrong?
 the file looks like this:

 Encoding=UTF-8
 Name=Navit
 TryExec=navit
 GenericName=Navit
 Comment=GPS Navigation
 Exec=navit
 Icon=diversity-nav
 Terminal=false
 Type=Application
 Categories=GPS;
 StartupNotify=false

 What am I doing wrong?
 Also I could not find any info about the known workaround for crashing
 when opening the destination screen


 On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 4:49 PM, Tilman Baumann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 arne anka wrote:
 Navit works supprisingly well.
 Very well with 'stolen/misused' MapRoute maps.

 got wherefrom, ie what kind of maps work with it?
 http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Main_Page#Maps

 But i have to say, the navit build for openmoko is in bad condition.
 (easy to fix)

 care to elaborate?
 The version from Alessandro (ipkg tree linked on his wiki site) is very
 old, has no .desktop file and icon and crashes when you open the
 destination screen (known workaround).

 Details here
 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Navit
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Re: Openmoko on Design

2008-07-31 Thread Jay Vaughan

 7) Maybe run some simple synth applications on the FR, using the USB  
 host mode to connect it to a MIDI keyboard.


this is what i'm doing this weekend .. ;)

;
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Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Marcel MadJo de Jong


Hello all,

I got my Neo Freerunner yesterday in the mail (yay!). 
After turning it on, I plugged in the wall-charger.
I saw no leds turn on, but I did see the icon in the screen change from a
green battery to a battery with a lighting icon in it. So I figured it was
charging.
The same was true when I plugged in the USB cable to connect it to my
computer. No LEDs blinking or burning, but it did show the battery icon with
lightning.

However, when I unplugged it this morning, after a few seconds being green,
the battery icon became red. Which led me to believe that it wasn't charged.
So I left it at home, tethered to the wallcharger.

I did reflash the device a few times last night. (First a version of FSO and
later a version of Scaredycat) Not sure if that's relevant.

But now my questions:
1) should there be a led indicating it's charging?
2) and is it normal for the icon to appear red after it had a chance to
charge overnight? (about 7hrs of charge time)
3) or should I leave it in longer for the first time?

---
Marcel MadJo de Jong
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Questions: Daily Use, Community stability?

2008-07-31 Thread Shawn Thompson

Hello Community,
   This is my first time starting a new thread in the mailing list and I
felt that before investing $400 on something I should really think it out
and ask a few questions. I will start with the questions regarding use as a
day to day device. I need a minimum of two things from a phone: the ability
to make and receive phone calls reliably and the ability to send and receive
SMS messages reliably. From what I have read this is not always the case
right now. If someone can verify that they have been using the device for
this purpose for a matter of time I would really appreciate that. I have
been waiting, patiently, for almost 3 years for this phone, since about the
time that the 1973 sold out for the last time. I really do want to purchase
a freerunner but unless I will be able to make it work as a phone I think I
may be tied to my low end POS samsung t409 for the time being.

  My second set of questions revolve around the recent storms brewing in the
community list. There has been a lot of fighting going on over ONE feature,
the toggle option on the keyboard. Personally I would prefer to toggle mine
myself but I am NOT going to get into arguments over that right now. What I
would like to know is that if a major usability problem is reported by
members of the community that we will not be placing information upon deaf
ears. I am NOT a programmer but I love playing with anything Linux so the
freerunner really looks like it would be fun to have. So long as I know that
major problems (echo, the GPS issue, keyboard toggle option, etc) are going
to at least be heard I will be willing to take some minor usability problems
while a resolution is in the works.

Thank you for taking the time to read and respond.

-Shawn Thompson
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Phonecalls hanging up

2008-07-31 Thread Kalle Happonen

Hi,
I just got out of a lengthy call which got hung up 4 times during the 
call. It seemed like it went to powersave mode. It might just be that 
the audio died, and the remote person hung up and called again. I did an 
upgrade to the newest 2007.2 today. I use the dim-first-then-lock 
option. Is the phone going to suspend even if a call is active?

Kalle

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Re: Freerunner not charging?

 1) should there be a led indicating it's charging?

nope.

 2) and is it normal for the icon to appear red after it had a chance to
 charge overnight? (about 7hrs of charge time)
 3) or should I leave it in longer for the first time?

there have been several reports of the fr discharging when connected to  
usb (incl charger) for a long time. so that bug might have bitten you as  
well. the flash from green to red might be due to an additional bug in  
redrawing the icon correctly (i recall at least one posting, i think).
i am absolutely not sure how a fresh li-ion battery likes to be handled --  
some manuals say you need to discharge and recharge a few times to get the  
full capacity, others do not. stroller announced a well thought strategy  
how to handly his freerunner's battery -- but that was before he got his  
fr, so no clue what to do :-)
did you flash your u-boot, too?
what image (rootfs, kernel) do you use right now?

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Re: Phonecalls hanging up

2008-07-31 Thread Jeffrey Ratcliffe

2008/7/31 Kalle Happonen [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 option. Is the phone going to suspend even if a call is active?

It also seems to suspend even if you are logged in over ssh.

There needs to be an option not to suspend if
a. There is external power
b. You are in a call

Regards

Jeff

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Re: Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Marcel MadJo de Jong




 1) should there be a led indicating it's charging?

 nope.

Ok, then I don't have to worry about that. (would be nice to have though)


 2) and is it normal for the icon to appear red after it had a chance to
 charge overnight? (about 7hrs of charge time)
 3) or should I leave it in longer for the first time?

 there have been several reports of the fr discharging when connected to  
 usb (incl charger) for a long time. so that bug might have bitten you as  
 well. the flash from green to red might be due to an additional bug in  
 redrawing the icon correctly (i recall at least one posting, i think).
 i am absolutely not sure how a fresh li-ion battery likes to be handled --  
 some manuals say you need to discharge and recharge a few times to get the  
 full capacity, others do not. stroller announced a well thought strategy  
 how to handly his freerunner's battery -- but that was before he got his  
 fr, so no clue what to do :-)

But wasn't it so that the freerunner can't recharge the battery if it's
completely empty?

 did you flash your u-boot, too?
 what image (rootfs, kernel) do you use right now?

Yes, I flashed the uboot, the kernel and rootfs.

Uboot is: 
(u-boot-gta02v5-1.3.1+svnr4297+gitb29661fc115106454288051bc9a488351ce8-r3.bin)

Rootfs is:
(scaredycat-openmoko-devel-image-om-gta02.jffs2)

And I believe (but I can only check that when I get home tonight) that I
used this for the uImage:
uImage-2.6.24+git20080507-r0-om-gta02.bin 
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Freerunner group sales in TAIWAN!!

2008-07-31 Thread Lin Mac


hi,

Thanks to the generosity of Harry of openmoko, there will be a group sale in 
Taiwan for sure.

If we can collect 10 piece, then we could have the 10-pack price. But even if 
we can't , they would still accept the order.

One that are interested in Taiwan, please send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], 
and specify the amount of the phone, debug board(DBoard), and spare packs that 
you want, along with your name and phone number.

I hope it could be done fast, so the due date will be 8/17. Than I'll send the 
order to openmoko.

I don't have such group sale experience yet, so mail me if you have any concern 
or question want to ask.

Best Regards,
Mac Lin


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Re: Freerunner not charging?

 1) should there be a led indicating it's charging?

 nope.

 Ok, then I don't have to worry about that. (would be nice to have though)

well, you can fiddle with /sys/, but it does not work reliably.

 But wasn't it so that the freerunner can't recharge the battery if it's
 completely empty?

yeah. that's what makes the bug so ... dear.


 did you flash your u-boot, too?
 what image (rootfs, kernel) do you use right now?

 Yes, I flashed the uboot, the kernel and rootfs.

 Uboot is:
 (u-boot-gta02v5-1.3.1+svnr4297+gitb29661fc115106454288051bc9a488351ce8-r3.bin)

boy, i hope these things get a humand readbly name soon.
maybe andy cann say from looking at what birthday this thing has.

 Rootfs is:
 (scaredycat-openmoko-devel-image-om-gta02.jffs2)

 And I believe (but I can only check that when I get home tonight) that I
 used this for the uImage:
 uImage-2.6.24+git20080507-r0-om-gta02.bin


i'd think rootfs and uImage should match -- else you might get annoying  
effects with modules not loading (the uImage only flashes the boot-area,  
if the kernel of uImage and the kernel/modules of rootfs do not match,  
things may not work as expected).

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Navit and the ASU

I'm trying to get Navit to work but it does not get a fix. All my
other apps do get a fix (agpsui, tango gps, diversity) almost
instantly.
I've also tried to type /etc/init.d/gpsd start when ssh'd in to the
FreeRunner but status stays: GPS 00/0 .N .E.

Does anybody have a clue what to do about this?


Thanks
y

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Re:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Somebody in the thread at some point said:
| Just following the steps that were on the wiki hehe. I didn't know you
| could do that. So apparently there are 3 different images that we can
| have on the phone, the GTK, ASU, and FSO. What is the most stable one
| and what do most people use to develop on? What do people prefer?

There's also a Debian port available.

These are good reasons for SD Card boot, you can try out these other
things while leaving your core phone stuff intact and available at any time.

- -Andy
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we need updates

2008-07-31 Thread Flyin_bbb8

guys it's been a week the openmoko.com says
Sold Out? Neo FreeRunner is currently *SOLD OUT*.
The next batch of shipments are scheduled to arrive on July 25th.

can we have an update on this, or can someone please update the website?
IIRC there are 2 people who went to the website on the 23-rd and purchased
freerunners... so it's been a week i go everyday every 4 hours to the
website ... or at least if we can have an estimation?
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Re: Navit and the ASU

2008-07-31 Thread Tilman Baumann

Yorick Moko wrote:
 I'm trying to get Navit to work but it does not get a fix. All my
 other apps do get a fix (agpsui, tango gps, diversity) almost
 instantly.
 I've also tried to type /etc/init.d/gpsd start when ssh'd in to the
 FreeRunner but status stays: GPS 00/0 .N .E.
 
 Does anybody have a clue what to do about this?

I thought ASU uses gypsy? Navit has a gypsy module. (At least a more 
recent version  of Nvit i have here on my pc)

-- 
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Re: Updating freerunner to latest snapshot (WAS: Re: )

2008-07-31 Thread Christopher White

On Thu, 2008-07-31 at 15:06 +1000, Robert William Hutton wrote:
 Then upgraded all the packages:
 
 # this has to be done on the terminal on the openmoko
 opkg update
 opkg upgrade dropbear 

So, I never had to do that -- or more precisely I have never done that.
*Should* I be doing it, or is that only if you are not able to ssh in?

I've just been connecting by USB, ssh in, and then opkg update and
upgrade from there.  I've done next to nothing in the openmoko terminal.

...cj



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Re: Updating freerunner to latest snapshot (WAS: Re: )

 So, I never had to do that -- or more precisely I have never done that.
 *Should* I be doing it, or is that only if you are not able to ssh in?

if your upgrades go smoothly, no need.


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Re: Mokomakefile on Debian on PowerPC64/G5

2008-07-31 Thread Russell Steicke

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 10:56:23AM +0200, Robert Schuster wrote:
 Hi,
 I am building OpenEmbedded stuff (OpenMoko for FreeRunner, Angstrom for
 BeagleBoard) on my Fedora G4 iBook all day and it works.

Like the OP, I am attempting to build OM with MokoMakefile on debian
powerpc (a PowerMac G5).

 Please paste your error message to a pastebin service and provide the
 URL here.

The output from my attempted build is at http://pastebin.com/m19248e62

I did:

  make clean
  rm -rf build/conf/
  make setup
  make setup-machine-freerunner 
  make openmoko-devel-image

(Download of stuff isn't in this output because I've run this several
times before.)

setup-env contains:

export OMDIR=/home/russells/omdir
export BBPATH=${OMDIR}/build:${OMDIR}/openembedded
export PYTHONPATH=${OMDIR}/bitbake/libbitbake
export PATH=${OMDIR}/bitbake/bin:${PATH}


build/conf/local.conf contains:

MACHINE = om-gta02
DISTRO = openmoko
BUILD_ARCH = ppc64
INHERIT += rm_work


The third NOTE in the output at http://pastebin.com/m19248e62 is

  Information not available for target 'ppc64-linux'

which I think is partly gathered from `uname -m`.  On my system:

  [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ uname -m
  ppc64

Is this different from what uname -m says on Fedora?  I notice that
there is a powerpc* target in some of the .bb files.

I don't know anything about bitbake, and its output seems unconducive
to casual debugging in that there is not a lot of context for the
messages.

Any ideas?



-- 
Russell Steicke

-- Fortune says:
By nature, men are nearly alike; by practice, they get to be wide apart.
-- Confucius

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Re: Where is FSO Milestone 2 for FreeRunner

Maciej Piechotka schrieb:
 1. On http://downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone2/ there is no jffs2
 image for FreeRunner. Is there any?

There's a .jffs2.summary file, which is the one you're supposed to use.

Summary is a jffs2 feature that improves performance.  For more 
information, see http://www.inf.u-szeged.hu/jffs2/mount.php .

 2. Can I expect that I'll be notified by system if I'll recive an SMS or I 
 need
 to wait on M3?

There's no notification yet.  The focus of M2 is on the framework APIs, 
the UI (zhone) only does a minimum, and is more to be understood as an 
example of using the API.

Andreas

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Re: Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Scott


Marcel MadJo de Jong wrote:

Hello all,
However, when I unplugged it this morning, after a few seconds being green,
the battery icon became red. Which led me to believe that it wasn't charged.
So I left it at home, tethered to the wallcharger.


Same thing happened to me yesterday, I have the latest stable 2007.2 
installed.  Haven't touched uboot.


FR was on a 500ma charger all night.  While driving to Albuquerque, I 
turned it on verified it was booting and set it down while it booted. 
Picked it up 5 minutes later and it was off?  Thats odd I thought?



Then it wouldn't turn on.  I plugged it into my car charger and it 
started to boot, hmmm   Set it down for 15 seconds and it was off 
again!!  Now it wouldn't boot on the car charger!  shit!


Got home, plugged it into the wall charger and it turned on and booted 
up! WHew!!!  Batter icon showed low red level. I charged it for a few 
hours and it then showed full


I have noticed that sometimes when I plug it in the icon doesn't change 
to the lightning bolt!  Stays green.  Why is that?  Update problem?


Scott



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Re: Importing contacts in FSO

Marco Trevisan (Treviño) schrieb:
 After the infos written about Qtopia/ASU and OM.GTK, how could I import 
 my contacts in FSO? Milestone II is so nice!!
 
 Maybe I should write a python script based on the zhone code or is there 
 already something for doing it?

As far as I know, there's no import code yet.  Be aware that currently 
FSO doesn't have a contacts database, it stores all the contacts on the 
SIM (which usually has limited capacity).

The API for storing contacts is pretty simple at the moment.  If you 
steal the dbus init code from zhone, adding contacts is done using:

   dbus_object.gsm_sim_iface.StoreEntry(reference, name, number)

where reference indicates the slot on the SIM card in which to store the 
entry (between 0 and whatever the maximum for the card is).

Andreas



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Re: Questions: Daily Use, Community stability?

2008-07-31 Thread Aaron Sowry

Shawn Thompson wrote:
 Hello Community,
This is my first time starting a new thread in the mailing list and 
 I felt that before investing $400 on something I should really think 
 it out and ask a few questions. I will start with the questions 
 regarding use as a day to day device. I need a minimum of two things 
 from a phone: the ability to make and receive phone calls reliably and 
 the ability to send and receive SMS messages reliably. From what I 
 have read this is not always the case right now. If someone can verify 
 that they have been using the device for this purpose for a matter of 
 time I would really appreciate that. I have been waiting, patiently, 
 for almost 3 years for this phone, since about the time that the 1973 
 sold out for the last time. I really do want to purchase a freerunner 
 but unless I will be able to make it work as a phone I think I may be 
 tied to my low end POS samsung t409 for the time being.

   My second set of questions revolve around the recent storms brewing 
 in the community list. There has been a lot of fighting going on over 
 ONE feature, the toggle option on the keyboard. Personally I would 
 prefer to toggle mine myself but I am NOT going to get into arguments 
 over that right now. What I would like to know is that if a major 
 usability problem is reported by members of the community that we will 
 not be placing information upon deaf ears. I am NOT a programmer but I 
 love playing with anything Linux so the freerunner really looks like 
 it would be fun to have. So long as I know that major problems (echo, 
 the GPS issue, keyboard toggle option, etc) are going to at least be 
 heard I will be willing to take some minor usability problems while a 
 resolution is in the works.

 Thank you for taking the time to read and respond.

 -Shawn Thompson
 

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Hi Shawn,

I use the Qtopia image and find it quite usable as an everyday phone for 
SMS and phonecalls - this is not to say it's perfect but certainly more 
usable than the other distributions at present. If open-source mobile 
development interests you, I'd say go for it and buy one. They're cute.

There has been turbulence in the community lately beyond what I would 
call healthy debate, but I think it was mostly just a handful 
individuals doing a bit of posturing early on in the game. Seems to have 
calmed down now. Being an open-source project you can safely assume that 
your considerations will be taken into account, however my opinion is 
that the people hired by Openmoko have been hired because they're good 
at what they do, not because they're intended as a medium for each and 
every personal opinion to be realised in the final product. I think we 
have to trust these people to set the general direction of development 
and design, and the community is there to build upon this framework and 
make it theirs. No open-source project I know of is without this kind of 
structure, and rightly so.

So if people want a manual keyboard button (I happen to be one of these 
people) then they should definately make their opinions heard in the 
hope that they are acted upon, but if not then this decision needs to be 
respected - don't castrate the designer, the design is open-source and 
can be changed later. When enough people adopt these changes then it 
evolves to replace the original, which is how open-source development 
should work.

Anyway hope you decide to take the plunge and become part of the community.

Aaron

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Re: Phonecalls hanging up

2008-07-31 Thread Marcel MadJo de Jong




Jeffrey Ratcliffe wrote:
 
 2008/7/31 Kalle Happonen [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 option. Is the phone going to suspend even if a call is active?
 
 It also seems to suspend even if you are logged in over ssh.
 

What's worse, it completely crashes the ssh connection. At least it did for
me.
Even after I woke up the phone, the ssh session had to be killed. 


There needs to be an option not to suspend if
 a. There is external power
 b. You are in a call

That would be ideal, I agree.

Did anyone file this in Trac yet?

---

Marcel MadJo de Jong

-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/Phonecalls-hanging-up-tp662200p662355.html
Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com.


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Re: WIKI still a POS

2008-07-31 Thread Daniel Benoy

I think we should take a lesson from Gentoo's wiki and make a big page with all 
the howtos.  Also, how about this kind of structure?:

'Getting Started' or 'What are open phones?'
(Or 'What are open palmtops?' might be better)

'Community  Events'

'News'

'HOWTO Index'
|
\-etc etc. (Categorized, or bareing tags in their titles, based on what 
hardware / software they're refering to.  Perhaps bareing a template that says 
what hardware, what versions it's known to work with, etc etc.)

'Hardware'
|
|-'Neo1973 / Neo Freerunner' (General)
|  |
|  |-'GPS Chip' (Detailed)
|  |-'GSM Modem' (Detailed)
|  \-etc etc.
|-'Treo 650 - Partially Supported'
\-etc etc.

'Distributions'
|
|- 'OpenMoko' (General)
|   |-'ASU' (Detailed)
|   |-'FSO' (Detailed)
|   \-'2007.2' (Detailed)
|- 'QTopia for Neo phones'
\- 'Debian'

'Open Phone Stacks'
|
|- 'OpenMoko FSO Specification'
|- 'Android'
\- 'QTopia'

I'd love to volunteer to tidy the wiki up.  Also, it might be better to just 
fork the openmoko wiki and make another one (Since the GNU FDL allows it, and 
the 'openmoko' URL isn't entirely appropriate if we're talking about 
Debian+Android running on a Treo, as an example.)  How would all of you feel 
about that?

P.S. I agree with the sentiment below.  As well, developers and power users 
with special applications need detailed documentation even on mainstream phones.

On Wednesday 30 July 2008 13:47:08 steve wrote:
 Perfectly put
 

 
 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Wilson
 Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 8:37 AM
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion
 Subject: Re: WIKI still a POS
 
 Maybe you are not happy because you think it's just a phone. To me it's a
 complete programmable handheld computer which happens to have a GSM phone
 feature. The phone is a fairly insignificant feature for some of us. If all
 you want is a phone, go to the supermarket, they have really nice ones there
 that don't come with any significant documentation. I use one myself.
 
 I am trying to develop GPS software for the OM. I have had about 15 minutes
 a day to work on it so far but it's been fun. I don't really care (much)
 about navigation features, I care about data collection.
 The competition is not TangoGPS or Garmin or Tom-Tom or anything OM is
 likely to come out with.
 
 Therefore documentation is vitally important to me.
 
 Incidentally I borrowed a friend's T-Mobile SIM card and tried the phone
 feature yesterday. It worked fine (including the documentation).
 
 Brian
 
 On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 7:20 AM, Steven ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  A phone that NEEDS documentation is a POS.
 
  In my mind, the Neo won't be ready for end-users unless I can give it 
  to one of my co-workers and they can figure almost everything out 
  without documentation.
 
  -Steven
 
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http://daniel.benoy.name


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RE: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread steve

Do folks know wher to find the SOP for the cap fix? 

Tony, if you havent already, go ahead and post the SOP for the cap fix. It's
easy enough to do
And undo.  

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jay Vaughan
Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 1:14 AM
To: List for Openmoko community discussion
Subject: Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card
interferenceissue

 I haven't had any problems with TTFF since the software update was 
 done.  In fact my impression from all the emails on the subject was 
 that the software fix was enough.


Try putting tangogps in a configuration where its updating the tiles
frequently - zoom way in, so that you have a closeup of your map, and then
walk around a bit.  In between tile updates, GPS will go way off the
map.  Thats the problem: its a workaround, but not a complete, effective
fix.  Looks like we have to have the capacitor-fix in place to make this
work smoothly without further glitches ..

;
--
Jay Vaughan





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RE: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread steve

Hmm. Jay...

  Amaybe when SD I/O occurs one could use the accelerometers to dead reckon?
They are noisy and drift
  but for short periods MIGHT be able to keep wild errors in mapping from
occuring. 

  Just a thought. 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jay Vaughan
Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 1:24 AM
To: List for Openmoko community discussion
Subject: Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card
interferenceissue

 (We have external LNA)  It means it can track with a 16dBm reduction 
 in GPS signal after it made the satellite acquisitions.  So if you 
 understood it will get a fix OK with the software workaround, and we 
 saw many people report this, you should expect the tracking phase to 
 work better than the acquisition phase since the signal requirement is 
 relaxed by 16dBm.


My experience has proven that this is not the case; yes the fix happens
sooner, but if SD I/O occurs during tracking phase, wild errors are still
introduced into the GPS signal sufficient to drive us off the map.

Just sayin', not trying to stir the pot.  I've been testing this GPS fix
every day since it arrived, by tracking my progress to work, and if I zoom
too closely (meaning there is more SD I/O on map refreshes) the GPS goes
wild.


 That'll be interesting.  But in the real world many thing perturb GPS 
 tracking and sophisticated software filters are anyway used to try to 
 see through excursions, I guess this will be the case for typical SD 
 Card usage pattern here.


My ride to and from work is through a wide open space with no obstructions,
lots of blue sky, and for sure .. SD I/O still massively impacts GPS
*accuracy*.  Not just in the acquisition phase, but also tracking ..

;
--
Jay Vaughan





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/media/card corrupted?

2008-07-31 Thread Staley, Daniel L

I am currently running the latest kernel with ASU.

Whenever I first boot up my freerunner into ASU, my /media/card directory is 
read fine and I can access everything on it.  If the freerunner suspends 
however, after it wakes back up, the directory appears to be corrupted and 
nothing can be read out of it.  If I reboot, the directory is fine again.

Is anyone else running into this?

I am using an 8gb sandisk microSDHC card.

-Dan Staley

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Re: Importing contacts in FSO

2008-07-31 Thread Marco Trevisan (Treviño)

Andreas Bogk wrote:
 As far as I know, there's no import code yet.  Be aware that currently 
 FSO doesn't have a contacts database, it stores all the contacts on the 
 SIM (which usually has limited capacity).
 
 The API for storing contacts is pretty simple at the moment.  If you 
 steal the dbus init code from zhone, adding contacts is done using:
 
dbus_object.gsm_sim_iface.StoreEntry(reference, name, number)
 
 where reference indicates the slot on the SIM card in which to store the 
 entry (between 0 and whatever the maximum for the card is).

Thanks for this, BTW during the past night I looked to the Zhone code 
and I got that it was using only the sim, so I've forced it to use 
only my phonebook hardcoding there my phonebook as shown in the Fake 
phonebook code. What I'd like to do is merging these contacts with the 
one saved on the SIM, so I'll be able to save new contacts (and view 
them) too...

-- 
Treviño's World - Life and Linux
http://www.3v1n0.net/


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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Somebody in the thread at some point said:
| Do folks know wher to find the SOP for the cap fix?
|
| Tony, if you havent already, go ahead and post the SOP for the cap
fix. It's
| easy enough to do
| And undo.

Did you ever do it, steve?

- -Andy
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iEYEARECAAYFAkiRzVQACgkQOjLpvpq7dMpGLwCeO+mNJpn0Fk/bMnaoSN3n6o5a
1bEAniOPccvfrk8WZ+/lIUjVlxUE5pZd
=xFkQ
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

steve schrieb:
   Amaybe when SD I/O occurs one could use the accelerometers to dead reckon?

Dead reckoning without gyros is pretty hard.  In theory, the two 
accelerometers are not mounted in the same place and thus could be used 
to derive rotation, but in practice they're pretty close to each other, 
and given the noise of measurement one is unlikely to derive a good 
rotation from them.

Andreas

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Re: /media/card corrupted?

that's a matter rather for the support list.
and yes, there are others experiencing the same behaviour.
if you check with
mount
after resume you'll probably see that the sd card is not longer mounted to  
/media/card but /media/mmcblk0p1 instead (or so).
there's a thread and a ticket, i think.

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Re: Importing contacts in FSO

Marco Trevisan (Treviño) schrieb:
 Thanks for this, BTW during the past night I looked to the Zhone code 
 and I got that it was using only the sim, so I've forced it to use 
 only my phonebook hardcoding there my phonebook as shown in the Fake 
 phonebook code. What I'd like to do is merging these contacts with the 
 one saved on the SIM, so I'll be able to save new contacts (and view 
 them) too...

Well, just execute both branches of the if...else in 
pyphone_contacts.prepare.  Make sure you use unique reference numbers 
for the stuff you add yourself, e.g. start numbering at 1000, not at 1 
as in the Fake phonebook.

Andreas


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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Somebody in the thread at some point said:
| steve schrieb:
|   Amaybe when SD I/O occurs one could use the accelerometers to dead
reckon?
|
| Dead reckoning without gyros is pretty hard.  In theory, the two
| accelerometers are not mounted in the same place and thus could be used
| to derive rotation, but in practice they're pretty close to each other,
| and given the noise of measurement one is unlikely to derive a good
| rotation from them.

I don't think we need to worry about it, but in fact we wouldn't need to
dead-reckon.  All we would need it for would be to put a ceiling on
claims from noisy GPS about what accelerations we could have
experienced.  If the GPS sample says we jumped 100m in 1s, but the
accels didn't really see anything, we could ignore or meddle with the
GPS sample.

Whether that is any better than just filtering between previous and
later samples I doubt.

- -Andy
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread Tilman Baumann

Andy Green wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
 Somebody in the thread at some point said:
 | steve schrieb:
 |   Amaybe when SD I/O occurs one could use the accelerometers to dead
 reckon?
 |
 | Dead reckoning without gyros is pretty hard.  In theory, the two
 | accelerometers are not mounted in the same place and thus could be used
 | to derive rotation, but in practice they're pretty close to each other,
 | and given the noise of measurement one is unlikely to derive a good
 | rotation from them.
 
 I don't think we need to worry about it, but in fact we wouldn't need to
 dead-reckon.  All we would need it for would be to put a ceiling on
 claims from noisy GPS about what accelerations we could have
 experienced.  If the GPS sample says we jumped 100m in 1s, but the
 accels didn't really see anything, we could ignore or meddle with the
 GPS sample.
Inertial navigation systems for the masses!
Anyone here who wants to write a kalman filter?

Besides the point that a small pocket-IMU would be great. To GPS jumts 
that big exist? As fas as i understand GPS it should have little jitter.

-- 
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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread Al Johnson

This one?

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Gta02_gps_10pf_rework_sop.pdf

On Thursday 31 July 2008, steve wrote:
 Do folks know wher to find the SOP for the cap fix?

 Tony, if you havent already, go ahead and post the SOP for the cap fix.
 It's easy enough to do
 And undo.

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RE: GPS application (was: Request for help: Would like communityapplications to show anddiscuss at LinuxWorld)

2008-07-31 Thread steve

Thanks Mickey, 

 TANGO GPS  was one of the first teams I decided to give a Free FreeRunner
to.  

  I'm  glad to hear that it will be in milestone2.

Steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael 'Mickey'
Lauer
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 6:46 AM
To: community@lists.openmoko.org
Subject: Re: GPS application (was: Request for help: Would like
communityapplications to show anddiscuss at LinuxWorld)

Am Dienstag 29 Juli 2008 15:28:56 schrieb rakshat hooja:
  Moreover the '800 pound gorilla' OM is developing its own gps 
  software and I'm not spending my energy competing with it.
 
  OM2007.2 is there, it works and I recommend everybody to develop for it.
 
  Best regards,
  Marcus

 Not  to start a flame war but even I would like to know why Openmoko 
 with its scarce resources is developing its own gps software instead 
 of supporting something like Tango GPS that seems to be working so well?

Dear Rakshat, please don't let yourself be fooled by polemics, I know it's
hard to resist, but we should lean on to the facts.

Fact is: Openmoko is NOT developing its own gps software, in fact we all
like Tango GPS a lot. It talks nicely to our opgsd implementation and will
be included by default in the FSO milestone2.

What we did though was to write a framework subsystem implementing the
org.freedesktop.Gypso dbus protcol, enhancing it to support the great U-Blox
chip found in the Neo Freerunner devices, enhancing it to hook into the
systemwide peripheral resource control, enhancing it to prepare for
automatic downloading/uploading almanac and ephemeris to improve warmstart.
So, in a
nutshell: We provided the necessary middleware (as is the rest of FSO) to
make things run better. Of course we will also discuss with upstream about
how to improve the gypsy implementation of org.freedesktop.Gypsy.

Please see Daniel Willmann's announcement for more details.

Cheers,
--
:M:

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Re: ASU, exposure doesn't work

2008-07-31 Thread DooD

Finally found how to get this one to work... the problem is with python-ecore
package the newest one doesnt even seem to run camp wifi for me anymore.
The version you want to install is from

http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/armv4t/python-ecore_0.2.1+cvs20080702-r1_armv4t.ipk

If you cant get opkg to install it for you try -force-downgrade, which
doesnt seem to work for me. so i just temporarily removed my
armv4t-feed.conf from /etc/opkg, removed the package, then had opkg update
and typed

opkg install
http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/armv4t/python-ecore_0.2.1+cvs20080702-r1_armv4t.ipk

This should work, goodluck

Benedikt Schindler wrote:

I am running ASU with a daily kernel and opkg-config from mwester.
(kernel_2.6.24+git25+8533927964761f4e2078ccd8607b90f5acc60b93-r1_om-gta02.ipk)

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/# app-launcher.py exposure
Can't connect to unix socket - starting daemon ...
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/#

no more messages.
nothing new in dmesg.
nothing in /var/log/messages.

does anyone know where to look for the problem?

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View this message in context:
http://n2.nabble.com/ASU%2C-exposure-doesn%27t-work-tp661973p662542.html
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Re: Where is FSO Milestone 2 for FreeRunner

2008-07-31 Thread Michael 'Mickey' Lauer

Am Mittwoch 30 Juli 2008 23:08:28 schrieb Maciej Piechotka:
 1. On http://downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone2/ there is no jffs2
 image for FreeRunner. Is there any?

Take the one with gta02 in the name.

 2. Can I expect that I'll be notified by system if I'll recive an SMS or I
 need to wait on M3?

Sorry, sms notification is not done in the UI (although it's finished since 
long in the services). Probably you don't have to wait until MS3 though, 
we're going to try providing some updates beforehand.

-- 
:M:

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Re: Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Mike Montour

Marcel MadJo de Jong wrote:

 Uboot is: 
 (u-boot-gta02v5-1.3.1+svnr4297+gitb29661fc115106454288051bc9a488351ce8-r3.bin)

That's old (even if it was built recently, it used the SVN patchset 
rather than the OM u-boot.git tree). Try this one:

http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200807/20080730/u-boot-gta02v5-1.3.1+gitr6+ba029a1426bfca169572bf80d50a8b190a6b0e19-r0.bin


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Re: Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Steven **

I see this every time I plug in to the wall charger.  The USB icon
will show up for a second or two and then disappear.  Unplugging and
plugging it back in usually cause the battery icon to change and the
USB icon to stay.  This is only with the wall charger.  Plugging USB
into my computer always works the first time.

You could submit a bug report.  I never bothered.  But perhaps it
really doesn't charge on the first attempt?

-Steven

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 7:51 AM, Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I have noticed that sometimes when I plug it in the icon doesn't change to
 the lightning bolt!  Stays green.  Why is that?  Update problem?

 Scott

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Re: Freerunner not charging?

2008-07-31 Thread Angus Ainslie

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:51 AM, Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 I have noticed that sometimes when I plug it in the icon doesn't change to
 the lightning bolt!  Stays green.  Why is that?  Update problem?

 Scott


The Freerunner doesn't always identify a charger as being able to supply 500
mA when this happens it charges at 100mA. At that rate the battery goes dead
faster than it charges.

There are some solutions that are not recommended by OM

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Forcing_fast_charge_mode

Angus
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Re: Freerunner group sales in TAIWAN!! Dear Taiwanese pay more attention

2008-07-31 Thread Harry Tsai

Dear All,
Mac contact with me for order collection today, if you need freerunner
pls contact with him for group order.
I am very appreciated his help, pls feel free support his great job.

BR


Harry


Lin Mac 提到:
 hi,

 Thanks to the generosity of Harry of openmoko, there will be a group sale in 
 Taiwan for sure.

 If we can collect 10 piece, then we could have the 10-pack price. But even if 
 we can't , they would still accept the order.

 One that are interested in Taiwan, please send an e-mail to [EMAIL 
 PROTECTED], and specify the amount of the phone, debug board(DBoard), and 
 spare packs that you want, along with your name and phone number.

 I hope it could be done fast, so the due date will be 8/17. Than I'll send 
 the order to openmoko.

 I don't have such group sale experience yet, so mail me if you have any 
 concern or question want to ask.

 Best Regards,
 Mac Lin


 _
 隨身的 Windows Live Messenger 和 Hotmail，不限時地掌握資訊盡在指間 — Windows Live for Mobile 
 http://www.msn.com.tw/msnmobile/ 

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Re: Which ATT data plans are compatible?

2008-07-31 Thread ian douglas

Ken Restivo wrote:
 Is there a specific limit? How do they *know* you are tethering? What are the 
 overage fees and where are they detailed?


 From what I've read, they watch your traffic for things like user agent 
strings (if they see an HTTP header specifying that you're using 
Firefox, it's a sure thing you're tethering since Firefox doesn't have a 
mobile browser yet), or that they watch for traffic levels that exceed 
your phone's capacity. For example, if you surf and browse more than a 
few GB of traffic (ie: torrent downloads) chances are good that you're 
tethering since your phone will only natively hold about 200MB of 
content plus whatever your SD card will hold.

As for overage fees, it's whatever they charge you based on your 
current plan. For example if you don't HAVE a data plan, they'll hit you 
with pretty heavy fees. Even at 0.01/kb on the MediaNet plan, they 
expect all of your content will come through their MediaNet browser. 
That's $10 per 1 MB of data over their limit, which frankly isn't hard 
to do these days.

Their unlimited data plan used to be $20/month but they raised it to $30 
for the new iPhone. Tethering adds even more because they expect that 
you'll be downloading much more data than users who don't tether.

-id

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Any sales at Linuxworld?

2008-07-31 Thread Adilson Oliveira

Hi.

I believe Openmoko itself will not be selling GTAs at Linuxworld next
week (piti) but is anyone going to do it?
I'll gladly buy my there it's available.

[]s

Adilson.

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Re: WIKI still a POS

2008-07-31 Thread David Samblas

+1 to structure and the how-to
I thing is a great proposal I enjoy a lot gentoo wiki we I haved use it,
and the tagging/template content will be a help to auto organize it
-1 to fork
Content is almost in the wiki and if the tagging approach is taked I
will try to help in organizing(tagging content)

-1 to url inapropiate
gentoo almost include other_distro-portage/distcc without exiting
gentoo.org and I never care about it 

El jue, 31-07-2008 a las 10:05 -0400, Daniel Benoy escribió:
 I think we should take a lesson from Gentoo's wiki and make a big page with 
 all the howtos.  Also, how about this kind of structure?:
 
 'Getting Started' or 'What are open phones?'
 (Or 'What are open palmtops?' might be better)
 
 'Community  Events'
 
 'News'
 
 'HOWTO Index'
 |
 \-etc etc. (Categorized, or bareing tags in their titles, based on what 
 hardware / software they're refering to.  Perhaps bareing a template that 
 says what hardware, what versions it's known to work with, etc etc.)
 
 'Hardware'
 |
 |-'Neo1973 / Neo Freerunner' (General)
 |  |
 |  |-'GPS Chip' (Detailed)
 |  |-'GSM Modem' (Detailed)
 |  \-etc etc.
 |-'Treo 650 - Partially Supported'
 \-etc etc.
 
 'Distributions'
 |
 |- 'OpenMoko' (General)
 |   |-'ASU' (Detailed)
 |   |-'FSO' (Detailed)
 |   \-'2007.2' (Detailed)
 |- 'QTopia for Neo phones'
 \- 'Debian'
 
 'Open Phone Stacks'
 |
 |- 'OpenMoko FSO Specification'
 |- 'Android'
 \- 'QTopia'
 
 I'd love to volunteer to tidy the wiki up.  Also, it might be better to just 
 fork the openmoko wiki and make another one (Since the GNU FDL allows it, and 
 the 'openmoko' URL isn't entirely appropriate if we're talking about 
 Debian+Android running on a Treo, as an example.)  How would all of you feel 
 about that?
 
 P.S. I agree with the sentiment below.  As well, developers and power users 
 with special applications need detailed documentation even on mainstream 
 phones.
 
 On Wednesday 30 July 2008 13:47:08 steve wrote:
  Perfectly put
  
 
  
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Wilson
  Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 8:37 AM
  To: List for Openmoko community discussion
  Subject: Re: WIKI still a POS
  
  Maybe you are not happy because you think it's just a phone. To me it's a
  complete programmable handheld computer which happens to have a GSM phone
  feature. The phone is a fairly insignificant feature for some of us. If all
  you want is a phone, go to the supermarket, they have really nice ones there
  that don't come with any significant documentation. I use one myself.
  
  I am trying to develop GPS software for the OM. I have had about 15 minutes
  a day to work on it so far but it's been fun. I don't really care (much)
  about navigation features, I care about data collection.
  The competition is not TangoGPS or Garmin or Tom-Tom or anything OM is
  likely to come out with.
  
  Therefore documentation is vitally important to me.
  
  Incidentally I borrowed a friend's T-Mobile SIM card and tried the phone
  feature yesterday. It worked fine (including the documentation).
  
  Brian
  
  On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 7:20 AM, Steven ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   A phone that NEEDS documentation is a POS.
  
   In my mind, the Neo won't be ready for end-users unless I can give it 
   to one of my co-workers and they can figure almost everything out 
   without documentation.
  
   -Steven
  
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Re: Where is FSO Milestone 2 for FreeRunner

2008-07-31 Thread Michael 'Mickey' Lauer

Am Donnerstag 31 Juli 2008 18:50:01 schrieb Brian Wilson:
 On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 5:49 AM, Andreas Bogk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Maciej Piechotka schrieb:
  1. On http://downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone2/ there is no
  jffs2 image for FreeRunner. Is there any?
 
  There's a .jffs2.summary file, which is the one you're supposed to use.

 This is interesting but does not tell me HOW to use it. From the
 standpoint of flashing the GTA02, does it work exactly the same way
 with dfu-util?

Yes.

jffs2.summary files are jffs2 files postprocessed with some information that 
allows jffs2 to speed up initial mounting.

-- 
:M:

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Re: Where is FSO Milestone 2 for FreeRunner

I already asked in another mail but maybe it is appropriate here too:
could you realease a tar.gz file of the rootfs?
This would be very helpful for mounting on SD card

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:58 PM, Michael 'Mickey' Lauer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Am Donnerstag 31 Juli 2008 18:50:01 schrieb Brian Wilson:
 On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 5:49 AM, Andreas Bogk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Maciej Piechotka schrieb:
  1. On http://downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone2/ there is no
  jffs2 image for FreeRunner. Is there any?
 
  There's a .jffs2.summary file, which is the one you're supposed to use.

 This is interesting but does not tell me HOW to use it. From the
 standpoint of flashing the GTA02, does it work exactly the same way
 with dfu-util?

 Yes.

 jffs2.summary files are jffs2 files postprocessed with some information that
 allows jffs2 to speed up initial mounting.

 --
 :M:

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Re: WIKI still a POS

2008-07-31 Thread Brian Wilson

 I'd love to volunteer to tidy the wiki up.  Also, it might be better to just 
 fork the openmoko wiki and make another one (Since the GNU FDL allows it, and 
 the 'openmoko' URL isn't entirely appropriate if we're talking about 
 Debian+Android running on a Treo, as an example.)  How would all of you feel 
 about that?

I agree the front page needs help. I suggest you make a rough draft so
we could look at it and help polish it then swap it in if people think
it looks good. You could call it Draft Main Page or something like
that.

I started tidying it up a few days ago. Hopefully I will make
improvements and not just changes.
Personally this is the only device I am looking at right now so a fork
seems like a bad idea, it would just be another place I'd have to
look. If I felt a need to compare OM with Android I'd prefer to see
information in the OM wiki and links to the appropriate external
Android pages.

Brian

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Re: /media/card corrupted?

2008-07-31 Thread Russell Sears

When this happened to me, it actually corrupted the partition table.  I 
didn't think to try to mount the existing filesystem after I restored 
the partition table, but before I reformatted...  Anyway, I disabled 
suspend/resume, and it hasn't happened since.

-Rusty

arne anka wrote:
 that's a matter rather for the support list.
 and yes, there are others experiencing the same behaviour.
 if you check with
 mount
 after resume you'll probably see that the sd card is not longer mounted to  
 /media/card but /media/mmcblk0p1 instead (or so).
 there's a thread and a ticket, i think.
 
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London Openmoko users?

2008-07-31 Thread Menno Smits

Hi all,

Any Openmoko users/developers in London (UK) interested in semi-regular 
informal meetups?

Menno


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Re: London Openmoko users?

2008-07-31 Thread Joseph Reeves

I'm in Oxford and have met users from here and Reading; not London,
but not too far away either...

Joseph



2008/7/31 Menno Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi all,

 Any Openmoko users/developers in London (UK) interested in semi-regular
 informal meetups?

 Menno


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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread Vibhav Sharma

Tilman Baumann wrote:
 Andy Green wrote:
   
 
 Inertial navigation systems for the masses!
 Anyone here who wants to write a kalman filter?

 Besides the point that a small pocket-IMU would be great. To GPS jumts 
 that big exist? As fas as i understand GPS it should have little jitter.

   

Hi,

I'm using OM2007.2 updated to today morning (Thursday July 31), and 
TangoGPS.
Also have the map cache directory on the card. Normally works fine, but 
when I move indoors,
gps shows 10 satellite fixes and gives my speed as 482 Km/h (really  
it did).

So either I broke the land speed record for a guy on foot ... or I think 
I will have to have that
capacitor fix.

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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

2008-07-31 Thread Brian Wilson

 Besides the point that a small pocket-IMU would be great. To GPS jumts
 that big exist? As fas as i understand GPS it should have little jitter.

Trimble had a few GPS models out with dead reckoning. Not pocket
sized.  I think they are all off the market now. I got one off Ebay a
few weeks ago but have not had time to set it up yet. To me it's more
interesting reading the manuals and learning how it works since I
don't use my car more than once a month. Trimble was addressing loss
of signal in urban canyons not (ahem) antenna placement issues.

See  http://www.trimble.com/tms/placer450.aspx?dtID=overview

They use a small gyroscope. There are much smaller gyros available now
but my intuition from reading their materials is that it will work in
a car if you are going fast enough (they want you to go 22 mph) to
generate steady predictable g forces but if you are going at a walking
pace it would never work.

If you are walking around and want a reasonable position the Kalman
filter would probably be easier to deal with.
Is there a mathematician in the house?

Brian

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Re: London Openmoko users?

2008-07-31 Thread john

I am interested, especially if it involves a pint!

You might want to add yourself to:

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Local_Groups:_London

John.

2008/7/31 Menno Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Hi all,

 Any Openmoko users/developers in London (UK) interested in semi-regular
 informal meetups?

[snip]

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Re: Which ATT data plans are compatible?

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 09:25:45AM -0700, ian douglas wrote:
 Ken Restivo wrote:
  Is there a specific limit? How do they *know* you are tethering? What are 
  the overage fees and where are they detailed?
 
 
  From what I've read, they watch your traffic for things like user agent 
 strings (if they see an HTTP header specifying that you're using 
 Firefox, it's a sure thing you're tethering since Firefox doesn't have a 
 mobile browser yet), or that they watch for traffic levels that exceed 
 your phone's capacity. For example, if you surf and browse more than a 
 few GB of traffic (ie: torrent downloads) chances are good that you're 
 tethering since your phone will only natively hold about 200MB of 
 content plus whatever your SD card will hold.

That's bizarre. They actually hire people to sit around and snoop people's 
UserAgent strings? Kind of NSA-like?
If so, ATT has *way* too much money, and their subscribers are paying for the 
salaries of spies to snoop their own traffic. Seems kinda creepy to me.

 
 As for overage fees, it's whatever they charge you based on your 
 current plan. For example if you don't HAVE a data plan, they'll hit you 
 with pretty heavy fees. Even at 0.01/kb on the MediaNet plan, they 
 expect all of your content will come through their MediaNet browser. 
 That's $10 per 1 MB of data over their limit, which frankly isn't hard 
 to do these days.


That's unpleasant.

 Their unlimited data plan used to be $20/month but they raised it to $30 
 for the new iPhone. Tethering adds even more because they expect that 
 you'll be downloading much more data than users who don't tether.
 

So unlimited data isn't unlimited at all?

Never mind Open Source phones, looks like what we need is Open Source carriers.

But I'm told that Sprint Metro PCS allows unlimited data, and tethering, for 
US$60/mo, and also the $30/mo plan is the same thing and people have (I'm told) 
just paid that and gotten data for free, although I don't remember the details 
of how they did that. Supposedly that is at DSL speeds too. Alas, Sprint PCS is 
not GSM, so no dice for FreeRunner owners. 

-ken

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Re: ASU as daily phone, someone ?

2008-07-31 Thread Benedikt Schindler

Jacob Peterson schrieb:

 I just managed to install ASU so it works fine for all normal phone
 stuff.  (Call/SMS/Conntacts/GPS/GPRS)
 I will set up/update a wiki-page for the ASU installation i have done.


 If you do find/start a wiki page let me know, I would be interested in 
 helping with that.


Just for now, my opkg update  opkg upgrade is broken.
but i think this is a problem with some packages on the buildhosts. but 
i am not sure yet.
... damm and it looks all so good this morning

tomorow i am not able to realy go on with that task. ... (sometimes i 
have to work for my money ;) )
but i hope to get on that at the weekend.

--
Status:
Exposure - still broken
Campwifi - now also broken (because of the tryings to get Exposure working)
This seems all to be a problem with the python packages.
---

When i killed that problems, i will do the rootfs.
But for now i will work on a ASU installing wiki-site at the weekend.
I will give you the link if i managed to write the basic steps i take.

It will be a mix up of these two docs (with some explanations around it):

http://openmoko.markmail.org/message/4pj37ioh4wbvs6ac?q=ASU+mike
http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=21t=295#p2956 
http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=21t=295#p2956

cu Beni


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Re: Warranty after fix for GTA02 GPS rework for SD card interferenceissue

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Somebody in the thread at some point said:

| I'm using OM2007.2 updated to today morning (Thursday July 31), and
| TangoGPS.
| Also have the map cache directory on the card. Normally works fine, but
| when I move indoors,
| gps shows 10 satellite fixes and gives my speed as 482 Km/h (really 
| it did).
|
| So either I broke the land speed record for a guy on foot ... or I think
| I will have to have that
| capacitor fix.

I dunno how a 10pF capacitor on SD_CLK is going to fix the GPS chip
acting erratic when it genuinely loses the satellites as you move indoors.

FWIW you'll need to wait for tomorrow's kernels to get yesterday's two
fixes in there.

- -Andy
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Re: Openmoko on Design

On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 11:28:13AM +0800, Marek Lindner wrote:
 On Wednesday, 30. July 2008 10:18:33 Al Johnson wrote:
  I agree with everything you say here. The keyboard should just appear when
  I want it and disappear when I don't. The absence of a manual override
  means that whenever it gets it wrong I can't correct it, the worst case
  being when I need to enter something but the keyboard doesn't appear.
  Conversely the presence of a manual override causes no problem even if it
  is never needed.
 
  The keyboard failing to appear is not a hypothetical scenario. Without
  manual intervention minimo was unusable because the keyboard didn't appear
  when the cursor was placed for URL entry. This is likely to be an issue
  with other apps that don't have a specific openmoko port, and we shouldn't
  have to create such a port just to use an otherwise capable app on
  openmoko. Other issues include the keyboard appearing when an edit field
  has focus although I don't want to edit it, keyboard appearing and
  disappearing frequently if a form contains mixed input types, or appearing
  over the top of the field to be edited. The field having focus although
  editing is not required is probably impossible to detect because the answer
  depends on the opinion of the user at the time.
 
 I understand your points and they all are valid. How do we address them ? 
 That 
 brings us back to Seans mail. Openmoko will provide the minimum set of 
 applications and basic functionality that empowers ordinary users to use the 
 phone. We will make sure that these applications work well with the 
 environment we provide. This is an ongoing process we just started compared 
 to many established phone systems. 
 Feel invited to extend that basic system through packages that can be 
 installed. If you install an application that hasn't been ported to the 
 Openmoko platform and does not support the keyboard you also should install 
 the manual keyboard button or you just install a package which deativates the 
 automatic keyboard behaviour right away if you don't like it.
 We have to realize that the world is very diverse - we wont find a solution 
 which suits for everybody in all the cases. So, we have to make it flexible. 
 Again: This is a process and you can help us with that.
 
 


I feel terrible about this whole mess because I was one of the first people in 
the original terminal thread, and I filed one of the original bug reports on it 
too.

I don't expect to be able to stop the mailing-list train wreck from continuing, 
now that it has developed a momentum of its own, except to apologize for having 
been involved in starting it in the first place. Sorry about that.

-ken

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Re: Any sales at Linuxworld?