Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Tony Vanson]

Thank you all for the information that has cleared my brain fog. :-)

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:26 PM Fred Bone  wrote:

> On 18 October 2022 at 22:54, Tony Vanson said:
>
> > I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> > grips with my problem. The tolling system here is not the automated ones
> > I'm used to. Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done,
> > must be charged with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with
> > cash on a regular basis. My question is what category is this card and
> how
> > do I treat additions and subtractions from it? I initially thought it
> > might be treated as a credit card but the way it operates it's obviously
> > not. Any advice would be much appreciated *Tony Vanson*
>
> I have
>  Assets:Current Assets:Prepaid:Dart-Charge
> to which I move funds from (usually) a credit card
> and from which I subtract the charges as I incur them.
>
>
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-- 
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[devaps]

   Glad to hear your problem is resolved, Tony.
   Cheers.
   Sent using the mobile mail app
   On 19/10/22 at 9:45 AM, Tony Vanson wrote:
   From: "Tony Vanson" 
   Date: 19 October 2022
   To: dev...@asia.com
   Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   Subject: Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
   Thank you Devaps, that clears my head 洛
   On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:25 PM <[1]dev...@asia.com> wrote:

 You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.
 So you have -
 Assets->Bank Account
     Assets->Toll pre-paid card
 Expenses->Toll
 When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset
 accounts above.
 When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card
 to Expenses->Toll.
 Cheers.
 > Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
 > From: Tony Vanson <[2]tonyvan...@gmail.com>
 > To: gnucash-user <[3]gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
 > Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
 > Message-ID:
 >
 <[4]CACnjAucZzeKyqrOOUrHg7Fkga7Nf7S0R_zLNDHYs74318GH_EQ@mail.gmail.c
 om>
 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
 >
 > I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to
 get to
 > grips with my problem.
 > The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
 > Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must
 be charged
 > with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
 regular
 > basis.
 > My question is what category is this card and how do I treat
 additions and
 > subtractions from it?
 > I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the
 way it
 > operates it's obviously not.
 > Any advice would be much appreciated
 > *Tony Vanson*
 >
 >
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   --
   Tony Vanson
   The older I get,
   the better I was

References

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   2. mailto:tonyvan...@gmail.com
   3. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   4. mailto:cacnjauczzekyqroourhg7fkga7nf7s0r_zlndhys74318gh...@mail.gmail.com
   5. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   6. https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Tony Vanson]

Thank you Devaps, that clears my head 洛

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 11:25 PM  wrote:

> You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.
>
> So you have -
>
> Assets->Bank Account
> Assets->Toll pre-paid card
> Expenses->Toll
>
> When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset accounts
> above.
>
> When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card to
> Expenses->Toll.
>
> Cheers.
>
> > Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
> > From: Tony Vanson 
> > To: gnucash-user 
> > Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
> > Message-ID:
> >   <
> cacnjauczzekyqroourhg7fkga7nf7s0r_zlndhys74318gh...@mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> >
> > I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> > grips with my problem.
> > The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
> > Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be
> charged
> > with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
> regular
> > basis.
> > My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions
> and
> > subtractions from it?
> > I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> > operates it's obviously not.
> > Any advice would be much appreciated
> > *Tony Vanson*
> >
> >
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-- 
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] pre-paid electronic toll card

[Chris Skudder]

   The card, with a cash value on it, is an asset - probably best
   described as a "prepaid expense."
   The fully accurate way to account for it:
   1. When you "put cash onto the card":
   -- credit "cash" (or bank account, or credit card, or wherever you get
   the money that you put onto the toll card)
   -- debit the pre-paid asset account (increasing its value).
   2. When you use some of the balance on the card to pay a toll:
   -- credit the pre-paid asset account (decreasing its value), and
   -- debit an "Expense-tolls" account
   The other way, the simple way, is to just debit "expense- tolls" when
   you "load up" the card.
   This is fewer transactions, less bookkeeping, but it "lumps" all your
   toll expense into a bigger amount and into the date on which you "load"
   the card.
   - Chris
 __

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   Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2022, 12:00 PM
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   Subject: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 235, Issue 45

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Today's Topics:

   1.  Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card (Tony Vanson)


--

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
From: Tony Vanson [7]
To: gnucash-user [8]
Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
Message-ID:
[9]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*


--

Subject: Digest Footer

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End of gnucash-user Digest, Vol 235, Issue 45
*

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   3. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   4. https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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   6. mailto:gnucash-user-ow...@gnucash.org
   7. mailto:tonyvan...@gmail.com
   8. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
   9. mailto:cacnjauczzekyqroourhg7fkga7nf7s0r_zlndhys74318gh...@mail.gmail.com
  10. mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Fred Bone]

On 18 October 2022 at 22:54, Tony Vanson said:

> I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> grips with my problem. The tolling system here is not the automated ones
> I'm used to. Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done,
> must be charged with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with
> cash on a regular basis. My question is what category is this card and how
> do I treat additions and subtractions from it? I initially thought it
> might be treated as a credit card but the way it operates it's obviously
> not. Any advice would be much appreciated *Tony Vanson*

I have
 Assets:Current Assets:Prepaid:Dart-Charge
to which I move funds from (usually) a credit card
and from which I subtract the charges as I incur them.


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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[devaps]

You can treat it like a pre-paid card, so it resides under Assets.

So you have -

Assets->Bank Account
Assets->Toll pre-paid card
Expenses->Toll

When you top up the card, record a transfer between the 2 asset accounts above.

When you pay toll, record a transfer from Assets->Toll pre-paid card to 
Expenses->Toll.

Cheers.

> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2022 22:54:28 +0700
> From: Tony Vanson 
> To: gnucash-user 
> Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card
> Message-ID:
>   
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
> grips with my problem.
> The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
> Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
> with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
> basis.
> My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
> subtractions from it?
> I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> operates it's obviously not.
> Any advice would be much appreciated
> *Tony Vanson*
>
>
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Kevin Reid]

On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 8:54 AM Tony Vanson  wrote:

> Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be
> charged with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a
> regular basis.
> My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
> subtractions from it?
> I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
> operates it's obviously not.


It's an asset — something you have of value — that is measured in dollars.
So, create an Asset account for it. When you top it up, you move money from
your cash account to the toll card account. When you use it to pay tolls,
move money from the toll card account to Expenses:Transportation:Tolls or
whatever expense category makes sense for you.

In my own case I have a category under Assets just for all these restricted
assets that can only be spent on certain things, but that categorization is
up to you.

By the way: The only difference between the way you use this and the way
you use a credit card account is that the payments come before the usage
rather than after. If you were to change GnuCash's setting for “Reverse
balanced accounts” to “None”, then all account types would work the same
way, so that your credit card account would appear as having a negative
balance — because it's a liability, an opposite-of-value to you.
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Re: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Gyle McCollam]

I would treat it as an asset.  When putting money on the card you would debit 
the card and credit checking or credit card,  however you pay for it.  When 
traveling you would debit tolls or auto expense or similar account and credit 
the card.



Sent from Samsung Galaxy smartphone.



 Original message 
From: Tony Vanson 
Date: 10/18/22 11:54 AM (GMT-05:00)
To: gnucash-user 
Subject: [GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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[GNC] Accounting for a pre-paid electronic toll card

[Tony Vanson]

I'm hoping that someone on this list can aid my befuddled brain to get to
grips with my problem.
The tolling system here is not the automated ones I'm used to.
Here one needs to obtain an electronic card and, once done, must be charged
with a cash value prior to travelling and topped up with cash on a regular
basis.
My question is what category is this card and how do I treat additions and
subtractions from it?
I initially thought it might be treated as a credit card but the way it
operates it's obviously not.
Any advice would be much appreciated
*Tony Vanson*

*The older I get,*
*the better I was*
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Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note)

[Eric Hammond]

Thank you all for valuable input on this.

Version 4.10 appears to have resolved the issue, I can now enter invoices, 
bills and payments with the needed accounts.

Victor, I don't know how my entries were different from yours. Now it works for 
me too. Thanks

Eric

Victor: I w
Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2022 19:05:03 -0400
From: "R. Victor Klassen" 
To: Eric Hammond 
Cc: "gnucash-user@gnucash.org" 
Subject: Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit
note)
Message-ID: <9c9a569a-9a4f-4872-8d47-47a9c151e...@icloud.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset=utf-8

Pretty sure that?s been around for quite a few versions.  I?ve been marking 
bills paid with Liabilities:Credit Card for as long as I?ve been using GnuCash 
(2012? 2013??)

> On Jul 14, 2022, at 2:31 PM, Eric Hammond  wrote:
> 
> Hold the presses!
> Just testing v4.11: It appears that it now allows for the 'assign as 
> payment' to use Liability accounts! (and matching process for Bills) I will 
> report back after more testing!

***
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Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note)

[R. Victor Klassen via gnucash-user]

Pretty sure that’s been around for quite a few versions.  I’ve been marking 
bills paid with Liabilities:Credit Card for as long as I’ve been using GnuCash 
(2012? 2013??)

> On Jul 14, 2022, at 2:31 PM, Eric Hammond  wrote:
> 
> Hold the presses!
> Just testing v4.11: It appears that it now allows for the 'assign as payment' 
> to use Liability accounts! (and matching process for Bills)
> I will report back after more testing!

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Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note)

[R. Victor Klassen]

Pretty sure that’s been around for quite a few versions.  I’ve been marking 
bills paid with Liabilities:Credit Card for as long as I’ve been using GnuCash 
(2012? 2013??)

> On Jul 14, 2022, at 2:31 PM, Eric Hammond  > wrote:
> 
> Hold the presses!
> Just testing v4.11: It appears that it now allows for the 'assign as payment' 
> to use Liability accounts! (and matching process for Bills)
> I will report back after more testing!

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Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note)

[Eric Hammond]

Hi Adrien, David,
Thank you for the thoughtful replies!

I do not use transaction imports any more to enter invoices or bills, or 
related payments now. 
The official Customer and Vendor features are too good to bypass.

I create an invoice for every client visit I make, even if there is no charge. 
That way I have notes, possibly details, for future reference.
(And flag no-pay or slow-pay clients as well)
I raise an invoice for pre-paid items or time for the same reason. Plus, some 
customers, by agreement, pay later.
(I also create a Bill/Payment for every purchase for traceability, whether I 
get a Bill or not)

Hold the presses!
Just testing v4.11: It appears that it now allows for the 'assign as payment' 
to use Liability accounts! (and matching process for Bills)
I will report back after more testing!

Thanks Again,
Eric

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2022 18:23:25 +0100
From: 
To: 
Subject: [GNC] .Re:  Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit
note
Message-ID: <005e01d896dd$4283c3a0$c78b4ae0$@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;   charset="us-ascii"

Hi Adrien,

I had the same thought as you "I'm curious why you raised an invoice for a 
payment against a coupon/credit note." But I guess the reason is that a 
document will be created if an" invoice" is raised for the prepayment which he 
can send to the student called "Coupon for future studies" or " Proforma 
Invoice" with hours and rates or whatever, and then when the actual tutorship 
is completed, he can raise an invoice and send that to the student too and post 
it to revenue, which will need to be offset against the prepayment. The billing 
system will produce the documents nicely.

Otherwise, if that's not the reason, I would agree with you entirely as your 
procedure is simpler.

Regards

David

I'm curious why you raised an invoice for a payment against a coupon/credit 
note.

Why not just book a payment against 'no-invoice' for that 'customer'?

You should do this manually, using the Process Payment feature, not as an 
import as far as I'm aware so the Business Features link the payment 
transaction to a customer/client. If you have LOTS of pre-payments, then yes, 
you can import standard transactions, but then you still need to individually, 
right-click and 'assign as payment' for each one.

Then, when you earn the revenue, you raise the invoice and clear it with the 
pre-payment. (Step 1, enter & post invoice; Step 2, Process Payment to apply 
partial pre-payment to the invoice)

The Pre-Payment would end up something like:

Dr. Assets:Cash/Bank/Un-deposited Funds/...
Cr. Assets:AR

*note, a Credit balance in an Asset account is a 'contra' balance because 
Assets *normally* have Debit balances. Thus, if a customer/client has a 
negative/credit AR balance, that is 'contra' what is expected and technically, 
a liability, so no need for a special Liability:Pre-Paid account, the GnuCash 
Business Features handle all of this for you *and* give you nice reporting 
capabilities. That's the idea behind the respective AR/AP accounts and their 
linked reports/functions. 
(AP works like the mirror of AR with vendors that you owe instead of 
customers/clients that owe you.)

The Invoice would be something like:

Dr. Assets:AR
Cr. Income:Tutoring

*Applying the Pre-Payment would show up as:

Dr. Assets:AR
Cr. Assets:AR

*This doesn't show up as its own transaction, but effectively that's how it 
works. The best way to see this account balance effect is with a Customer 
Report and using the option to show Detailed/Simple 'Transaction Links'. (so 
you can see which payments apply to which invoices and vice versa. I'm a fan of 
the Detailed option for the complete information it offers, but you may prefer 
Simple.)

I'm not certain why any 'coupon' scheme exists in this case. You can track 
unused pre-payments via Customer Reports. (functionally 'Statement of
Account') You can then provide reports/statements to clients to show remaining 
pre-paid balance available for use by them as needed.

(note, I see you say you're reviving a previous discussion, but I don't see 
reference to it - I didn't dig through the entire digest you quoted, though it 
may have been there.)
> 
> Thanks for any help,
> 
> Eric Hammond
> 
> PS: Am I supposed to keep the rest of the messages below?

Please, "No." It is not 'good form' to quote the entire digest. The wiki covers 
this, but the ideal 'workflow' when using digest mode is:

1. Reply-all/Reply-List
2. Change your Subject Line to match your topic (copy paste if this is a reply, 
prepended with "Re:" without the quotes helps) 3. Remove *all* of the quotation 
except what you are replying to. (**TIP
- select what you want to reply to *then* hit the Reply-all/List button, as 
most e-mail/list clients will then *only* quote what you selected, saving you 
lots of deletion work. It is okay to incl

Re: [GNC] .Re: Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note

[Adrien Monteleone]

The Customer Report can show current 'credit available' once the 
pre-payment is processed and can be given to the client. Of course, this 
doesn't show rate info, etc. (though a footer type stylesheet might 
offer room for such info)


An alternative would be to create a Credit Note and send that to the 
client, but then a conundrum ensues:


The usual process for a Credit Note is to use *it* as 
payment/partial-payment for an invoice, but in this case, the customer 
is still paying in full. Credit Notes are for situations like discounts 
& allowances or other refunds/reductions from an invoice so the customer 
doesn't have to pay the full original price and where a discount wasn't 
applied on the original invoice.


It may be that the best option is to create a document outside of 
GnuCash to give to clients that reflects the initial credit available 
with other desired information. From then on, regular invoices and 
Customer Reports should suffice.



Regards,
Adrien


On 7/13/22 12:23 PM, davidvernonl...@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Adrien,

I had the same thought as you "I'm curious why you raised an invoice for a
payment against a coupon/credit note." But I guess the reason is that a
document will be created if an" invoice" is raised for the prepayment which
he can send to the student called "Coupon for future studies" or " Proforma
Invoice" with hours and rates or whatever, and then when the actual
tutorship is completed, he can raise an invoice and send that to the student
too and post it to revenue, which will need to be offset against the
prepayment. The billing system will produce the documents nicely.

Otherwise, if that's not the reason, I would agree with you entirely as your
procedure is simpler.



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[GNC] .Re: Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note

[davidvernonlong]

Hi Adrien,

I had the same thought as you "I'm curious why you raised an invoice for a
payment against a coupon/credit note." But I guess the reason is that a
document will be created if an" invoice" is raised for the prepayment which
he can send to the student called "Coupon for future studies" or " Proforma
Invoice" with hours and rates or whatever, and then when the actual
tutorship is completed, he can raise an invoice and send that to the student
too and post it to revenue, which will need to be offset against the
prepayment. The billing system will produce the documents nicely.

Otherwise, if that's not the reason, I would agree with you entirely as your
procedure is simpler.

Regards

David

I'm curious why you raised an invoice for a payment against a coupon/credit
note.

Why not just book a payment against 'no-invoice' for that 'customer'?

You should do this manually, using the Process Payment feature, not as an
import as far as I'm aware so the Business Features link the payment
transaction to a customer/client. If you have LOTS of pre-payments, then
yes, you can import standard transactions, but then you still need to
individually, right-click and 'assign as payment' for each one.

Then, when you earn the revenue, you raise the invoice and clear it with the
pre-payment. (Step 1, enter & post invoice; Step 2, Process Payment to apply
partial pre-payment to the invoice)

The Pre-Payment would end up something like:

Dr. Assets:Cash/Bank/Un-deposited Funds/...
Cr. Assets:AR

*note, a Credit balance in an Asset account is a 'contra' balance because
Assets *normally* have Debit balances. Thus, if a customer/client has a
negative/credit AR balance, that is 'contra' what is expected and
technically, a liability, so no need for a special Liability:Pre-Paid
account, the GnuCash Business Features handle all of this for you *and* give
you nice reporting capabilities. That's the idea behind the respective AR/AP
accounts and their linked reports/functions. 
(AP works like the mirror of AR with vendors that you owe instead of
customers/clients that owe you.)

The Invoice would be something like:

Dr. Assets:AR
Cr. Income:Tutoring

*Applying the Pre-Payment would show up as:

Dr. Assets:AR
Cr. Assets:AR

*This doesn't show up as its own transaction, but effectively that's how it
works. The best way to see this account balance effect is with a Customer
Report and using the option to show Detailed/Simple 'Transaction Links'. (so
you can see which payments apply to which invoices and vice versa. I'm a fan
of the Detailed option for the complete information it offers, but you may
prefer Simple.)

I'm not certain why any 'coupon' scheme exists in this case. You can track
unused pre-payments via Customer Reports. (functionally 'Statement of
Account') You can then provide reports/statements to clients to show
remaining pre-paid balance available for use by them as needed.

(note, I see you say you're reviving a previous discussion, but I don't see
reference to it - I didn't dig through the entire digest you quoted, though
it may have been there.)
> 
> Thanks for any help,
> 
> Eric Hammond
> 
> PS: Am I supposed to keep the rest of the messages below?

Please, "No." It is not 'good form' to quote the entire digest. The wiki
covers this, but the ideal 'workflow' when using digest mode is:

1. Reply-all/Reply-List
2. Change your Subject Line to match your topic (copy paste if this is a
reply, prepended with "Re:" without the quotes helps) 3. Remove *all* of the
quotation except what you are replying to. (**TIP
- select what you want to reply to *then* hit the Reply-all/List button, as
most e-mail/list clients will then *only* quote what you selected, saving
you lots of deletion work. It is okay to include the header portion of that
message, and then you can copy/paste the subject as
*your* subject easily.)

Regards,
Adrien


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Today's Topics:

   1. Re:  Saving window position (and size) (Adrien Monteleone)
   2. Re:  Saving window position (and size) (Adrien Monteleone)
   3.  Revisiting the pre-paid invoice  (coupon, credit note ...)
  issue: (David Long)
   4. Re:  Invoicing & payments with "coupons: I sell

Re: [GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note ...) issue:

[Adrien Monteleone]

A negative asset is effectively a liability. It is part of a concept 
called 'contra' accounts. You can have contra-liability accounts too, 
that are effectively assets.


Asset - normally a Debit balance - amount you own.
Contra-Asset - Credit balance - amount you owe someone else. (liability)

Liability - normally a Credit balance - amount you owe.
Contra-Liability - Debit balance - amount someone owes you. (Asset)

Our replies I'm sure got crossed. I go into more specific detail for the 
posted use case, but essentially, I'd do it the same way - post the 
pre-payment to AR, then apply it after posting an invoice when I do the 
work.


Regards,
Adrien

On 7/12/22 9:29 PM, David Long wrote:

Hi,
  one way I know works, but is a bit ugly, is to create your prepayment
account as a negative current asset. I do something similar as some members
of a club incur expenses on its behalf, which goes to their current account
as a negative asset, and I then use this to clear off invoices in their
receivable account using the invoice payment process which is equivalent to
your item 4 below.
Ugly though, as on the balance sheet report the current accounts not yet
cleared of to A/R appear as a negative asset rather than in the liability
section.
Regards
David Long



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[GNC] Revisiting the pre-paid invoice (coupon, credit note ...) issue:

[David Long]

Hi,
 one way I know works, but is a bit ugly, is to create your prepayment
account as a negative current asset. I do something similar as some members
of a club incur expenses on its behalf, which goes to their current account
as a negative asset, and I then use this to clear off invoices in their
receivable account using the invoice payment process which is equivalent to
your item 4 below.
Ugly though, as on the balance sheet report the current accounts not yet
cleared of to A/R appear as a negative asset rather than in the liability
section.
Regards
David Long

Your message :


Revisiting the pre-paid invoice  (coupon, credit note ...) issue:

In standard accounting a prepaid debt (aka a coupon, credit note, etc) is
booked as a liability.
On paper, and as direct import of transactions into GnuCash, this works
However, I abandoned the brute force transaction method since I really like
the GnuCash Invoice and Bill features: so I started fresh with imported
Invoices and Bills.




My real life example: client prepays for 13 1 hour tutoring sessions, $25
each; to be used over the next year:
1. New Invoice for the prepayment:
 Dr.$325 Assets: ReceivablesCr. $325 Liabilities:
Prepaid
2. Process Payment for the coupons
Dr. $325 Assets: Cash   Cr.
 $325 Assets: Receivables

I 'earn' payment for an individual session when it is complete.
3. New invoice for that session
Dr. $25 Assets: Receivables Cr. $25 Income: Tutoring
4. and pay for it from the prepay
Dr. $25 Liabilities: PrepaidCr. $25 Assets:
Receivables

GnuCash, however, appears to only allow payment of an invoice from an asset.
Is there a way GnuCash can accommodate this?
On Tue, 12 Jul 2022, 23:20 ,  wrote:
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Re: Pre-paid

[Adrien Monteleone]

Pre-payments are any associated payments with an account that are not assigned 
to bills/invoices.

Since you unposted the invoice, the payment got unassigned. GC is usually good 
about restoring this assignment when you re-post the bill, but sometimes you 
have to fix things manually. This is particularly the case when you make the 
type of changes you describe.

At this point, it would probably be easier to delete the payment and then walk 
through the transactions again.

An important thing to consider is how you applied the discount.

Was it in the form of a credit note or did you add a discount line to the 
invoice, or did you change the line item price? The latter two will function 
pretty much the same save how you accounted for the variance, but the credit 
note method works a bit differently. An important question related to this is 
how did you book the insurance payment and what did you book it against? 
Depending on how complicated the insurance payout was, you could simply leave 
the invoice whole at the original price and record the insurance proceeds as a 
payment against it. (assuming you didn’t create a vendor bill or receive vendor 
credit from the insurance company) That would leave the balance the customer 
owes and then post that.

Issuing a discount or credit would decrease revenue which is maybe what you 
want to do, but if not, then use the insurance payout as a payment on the 
invoice as noted.

If going the discount route to decrease revenue, you don’t have to unpost and 
edit the original invoice. You can simply issue a credit note posted to the 
proper revenue account. Then when you record payment, select both the invoice 
and the credit note in the Process Payments window, this will show you the net 
balance due, record that amount as paid to the proper asset account and you’re 
done. The credit note will reverse the portion of the revenue account in 
question and you won’t have issue with unassigned payments.

Think of this in terms of credit notes being ‘correcting entries’ and that you 
don’t want to edit a posted invoice. (you can unpost any time of course, but as 
you’ve discovered, doing so after payments are assigned to it can get messy)

Regards,
Adrien

> On Jun 30, 2017, at 11:11 AM, Martijn Heuts  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> I had to unpost an invoice as it was posted as paid in full but it was not 
> (we applied discount instead of having an open balance). Now that I have the 
> discount reduced and the payment posted it shows when I click on 'Pay 
> Invoice':
> 6/14/2017   Invoice  62.006/30/2017   Pre-Payment 
>   62.00
> The date the invoice was created was 6/14The date the invoice was paid 50% 
> was 6/14The date that I got insurance money for this invoice was 6/22 (this 
> is when the invoice was entered paid in full after discount)On 6/30 it was 
> unposted, discount was reduced to reflect the open balance, and payment for 
> remaining balance was posted again.The post date was set to 6/14 and the due 
> date set to 6/30.
> Can someone tell me why it shows pre-payment and how to fix it?
> Thanks for all your help. Have a blessed weekend and a great 4th of July!!
> Martijn
> 
> 
> 
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