Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Mitchell Reese]

Absolutely brilliant rant - thanks for that! You just made my day. All 
very true. I hope it's solved in future iterations of UT - here's to hoping.


Mitchell

On 23/02/16 14:18, ubuntu.me...@spamgourmet.com wrote:
I know how irritating a bunch of "me-too" replies and rants are. But 
in this case we're talking about the one reason Ubuntu phones don't 
work and can't work.  A crowd of people yelling might actually achieve 
something.


I also carry two phones, a very nice MX4 and a very beaten-up iPhone 
4.  I absolutely do not have the option of leaving my desk without the 
iPhone.


Two apps I can't live without: WeChat and Alipay.  And I'm not unique: 
those two apps are just as essential to practically everyone in 
China.  China being a fifth of the human race, so possibly meriting 
some strategic consideration*.  Tencent and Alibaba own the internet 
here.  They do not care about you or your little operating system.  
All they care about is beating each other to death using tactics so 
blatantly unfair and illegal they make 90s Microsoft look like Harper 
Lee.  The general population is precisely as concerned about "software 
freedom" as you would expect from people living with a corrupt 
communist dictatorship. So if I'm waiting for WeChat and Alipay to 
return power to ordinary people with open APIs and software choice, 
I'm going to have to be pretty bloody patient.


(There is talk of WeChat coming soon to Ubuntu, in partnership with 
China Mobile.  This is a glimmer of hope.  But if it's as crippled as 
their desktop app or, heaven forbid, their website, it isn't going to 
move the needle.  The very best I can hope for is something 
Skype-on-Linux-esque.  Too little too late.)


I suffered for decades with a Linux desktop, and I could cope with 
that.  A desktop is primarily a content-creation device - and when 
you're done, you might like to tell people about it in an email. If 
you're collaborating there are significant network effects, but there 
are ways around that.


A phone is a communications device.  It's ALL network effect. There is 
no point having a phone in your pocket unless you can talk to your 
friends with it.  So there is absolutely no point developing a phone 
operating system when you know full well that it won't plug into the 
communications networks people actually use.  There are open messaging 
platforms, but guys, the war is over.  We lost.  Get over it.


And meanwhile my elevator is suddenly plastered with posters for Apple 
Pay.  Payment processing is another natural fit for monopoly and 
cartelisation (EMV, Swift, PayPal).  Only play that game if you're 
playing to win.  Alipay has already won in China.  And people are 
surprisingly unwilling to accept "I left my other phone at home" as an 
excuse for not paying them.  Android can be a player in the mobile 
payments market.  Ubuntu isn't even in the fight.


As for "defeat[ing] the security work that has been put into Ubuntu", 
yes please!  It's a constant frustration that I'm not allowed to 
access MY content on MY phone.  That's precisely what I hate about my 
iPhone, but my iPhone is a lot more generous than my MX4.  If it's a 
choice between security and being able to use the damn thing, I'll 
just be careful to not install any malware thanks.


The lesson I learned from my beloved Nokia N900 is that, in a pinch, 
having to do something in a clunky, inconvenient way is infinitely 
better than not being able to do it at all.  That phone could run 
Gnumeric!  Not "gnumeric reader", the whole package! Ever tried 
running desktop spreadsheet software on a four-inch screen?  You don't 
do that for fun, you do it because the sky will fall if you don't.  So 
you put Android in a sandbox and if you want to send a photo over 
WeChat you have to manually copy the photo into the sandbox first.  
Inconvenient.  But right now when I see something amazing I don't 
photograph it with my very nice MX4, I reach for my god-awful iPhone 
4, because what's the point if I can't send it to anyone?


Android on Ubuntu is an opportunity.  How jealous the Wine developers 
must be!  Can you imagine how much easier that would have been with an 
open-source reference implementation to work from?  .apk is the best 
plausible de-facto standard for mobile apps.  Come up with your own 
ideas, sure, but not at the expense of compatibility with the rest of 
the world.


I'm very excited about the potential for Ubuntu on IoT.  Can't wait to 
get my hands on an Artik 5.  Every elevator here includes (often 
multiple!) advertising screens with a cracked piezo speaker turned up 
to 11.  They tend to run Android, but I'm very optimistic that in the 
future it'll be Ubuntu's security model making me want to smash my 
brains out against the wall by around the tenth floor.  Ubuntu on my 
phone though?  No, can't see it. Not unless Android apps work.


For now... seriously, can anyone point me to reliable instructions for 
how to reflash my phone with 

Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[ubuntu . mexon]

I know how irritating a bunch of "me-too" replies and rants are. But in 
this case we're talking about the one reason Ubuntu phones don't work 
and can't work.  A crowd of people yelling might actually achieve something.


I also carry two phones, a very nice MX4 and a very beaten-up iPhone 4.  
I absolutely do not have the option of leaving my desk without the iPhone.


Two apps I can't live without: WeChat and Alipay.  And I'm not unique: 
those two apps are just as essential to practically everyone in China.  
China being a fifth of the human race, so possibly meriting some 
strategic consideration*.  Tencent and Alibaba own the internet here.  
They do not care about you or your little operating system.  All they 
care about is beating each other to death using tactics so blatantly 
unfair and illegal they make 90s Microsoft look like Harper Lee.  The 
general population is precisely as concerned about "software freedom" as 
you would expect from people living with a corrupt communist 
dictatorship.  So if I'm waiting for WeChat and Alipay to return power 
to ordinary people with open APIs and software choice, I'm going to have 
to be pretty bloody patient.


(There is talk of WeChat coming soon to Ubuntu, in partnership with 
China Mobile.  This is a glimmer of hope.  But if it's as crippled as 
their desktop app or, heaven forbid, their website, it isn't going to 
move the needle.  The very best I can hope for is something 
Skype-on-Linux-esque.  Too little too late.)


I suffered for decades with a Linux desktop, and I could cope with 
that.  A desktop is primarily a content-creation device - and when 
you're done, you might like to tell people about it in an email.  If 
you're collaborating there are significant network effects, but there 
are ways around that.


A phone is a communications device.  It's ALL network effect.  There is 
no point having a phone in your pocket unless you can talk to your 
friends with it.  So there is absolutely no point developing a phone 
operating system when you know full well that it won't plug into the 
communications networks people actually use.  There are open messaging 
platforms, but guys, the war is over.  We lost.  Get over it.


And meanwhile my elevator is suddenly plastered with posters for Apple 
Pay.  Payment processing is another natural fit for monopoly and 
cartelisation (EMV, Swift, PayPal).  Only play that game if you're 
playing to win.  Alipay has already won in China.  And people are 
surprisingly unwilling to accept "I left my other phone at home" as an 
excuse for not paying them.  Android can be a player in the mobile 
payments market.  Ubuntu isn't even in the fight.


As for "defeat[ing] the security work that has been put into Ubuntu", 
yes please!  It's a constant frustration that I'm not allowed to access 
MY content on MY phone.  That's precisely what I hate about my iPhone, 
but my iPhone is a lot more generous than my MX4.  If it's a choice 
between security and being able to use the damn thing, I'll just be 
careful to not install any malware thanks.


The lesson I learned from my beloved Nokia N900 is that, in a pinch, 
having to do something in a clunky, inconvenient way is infinitely 
better than not being able to do it at all.  That phone could run 
Gnumeric!  Not "gnumeric reader", the whole package!  Ever tried running 
desktop spreadsheet software on a four-inch screen?  You don't do that 
for fun, you do it because the sky will fall if you don't.  So you put 
Android in a sandbox and if you want to send a photo over WeChat you 
have to manually copy the photo into the sandbox first.  Inconvenient.  
But right now when I see something amazing I don't photograph it with my 
very nice MX4, I reach for my god-awful iPhone 4, because what's the 
point if I can't send it to anyone?


Android on Ubuntu is an opportunity.  How jealous the Wine developers 
must be!  Can you imagine how much easier that would have been with an 
open-source reference implementation to work from? .apk is the best 
plausible de-facto standard for mobile apps.  Come up with your own 
ideas, sure, but not at the expense of compatibility with the rest of 
the world.


I'm very excited about the potential for Ubuntu on IoT.  Can't wait to 
get my hands on an Artik 5.  Every elevator here includes (often 
multiple!) advertising screens with a cracked piezo speaker turned up to 
11.  They tend to run Android, but I'm very optimistic that in the 
future it'll be Ubuntu's security model making me want to smash my 
brains out against the wall by around the tenth floor.  Ubuntu on my 
phone though?  No, can't see it.  Not unless Android apps work.


For now... seriously, can anyone point me to reliable instructions for 
how to reflash my phone with Flyme?  It's actually kinda hard to google 
that.


* No-one's going to use Ubuntu Touch in China until something's done 
about the unfit-for-purpose pinyin keyboard.  But unlike Android apps, 
this is not something 

Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[mtx_lives]

Hi all,


I realise it's a contentious question and the previous emails have covered the 
argument for and against. Here's my two cents, whilst I use my Nexus 4 running 
UT as my daily device, I keep having to check whatsapp on an alternative 
device. Having signed up for it on that device ppl don't seem to understand 
that I won't necessarily get a msg from them now(and clearly don't understand 
the arrow notification) I appreciate that is not a failing of UT and I agree 
that native app is preferable and I'd rather use Telegram but whatsapp is the 
one everyone seems to be using,


Thanks


J






On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 3:02 PM -0800, "Wayne Ward"  
wrote:





I wish emails had a like button

Wayne

Monday, 22 February 2016 21:20:06 UTC, Bob Summerwill 
wrote:
> "Why would you want android apps?"
>
> I am using a Jolla Phone as my day-to-day device, and I can vouch from
> first-hand experience that the AlienDalvik Android support on that device
> is utterly invaluable in a practical sense.
>
> Having native applications is obviously best, but Android compatibility is
> a fantastic stopgap solution.   There are a huge number of Android
> applications, and having access even to a subset is a godsend.   It is
> surprising how many Android applications can run without Google Play
> Services.
>
> Jolla Phone works with various Android stores, with Yandex and F-Droid
> being the ones which I use the most.   Having F-Droid on Ubuntu Phone would
> undoubtedly be "A Good Thing".
>
> Having that kind of functionality available on top of a FOSS solution would
> be fabulous.The SailfishOS ports really suffer for its absence.
>  Ubuntu Phone would really benefit from an equivalent.
>
> If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
> SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone as
> well, I think.
>
> https://twitter.com/sledgeSim/status/679647138305970177
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Peter Bittner 
> wrote:
>
>> Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).
>>
>> > And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to write a
>> native app.
>>
>> Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
>> implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
>> I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
>> mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
>> user souls though.
>>
>> Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
>> argument has been discussed on the list before.
>>
>> @Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
>> user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
>> messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
>> bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"
>>
>> Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
>> generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
>> That would be a very promising way to go, probably.
>>
>> We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
>> relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
>> Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
>> it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
>> already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
>> appointments are not on there, unfortunately.
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> [2] https://tox.chat/
>> [3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)
>>
>> --
>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>> Post to : ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net
>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>
>
>
>



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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Francisco Pina Martins]

Technical issues aside (such as notifications, etc), I don't see how 
this can be positive to Ubuntu-touch's future...
Best case scenario, the apps work "okish" and with some overhead due to 
the translation layer. What you get is an OS that **also** runs android 
apps, but does it **worse** than android.
If any devs are considering porting their apps to Utouch, at this point 
they will most certainly call it quits (example: Blizzard, warcraft 
franchise and wine).
This is sort of "stop-gap" in the short term, but IMO will seriously 
compromise the platform's future.
Furthermore an "official" compat. layer would redirect the community's 
efforts into making existing apps work with the said layer instead of 
encouraging the creation of new native apps - such as Ubuntu-hangups, 
telegram udrop cabin or utorch, just to name a few.
Tempting? Yes. Good for the platform? I don't think so. At least in an 
official manner.


That being said - I thing that maybe making shashlik work in utouch, 
just to show it can be done is quite an interesting goal, that would 
really show off the OS's versatility.


Ubuntu touch can be so much more that "just another android clone". 
Think further. Build your own missing apps. If you can't do it, engage 
the community. **Make** it better.


Also, apologies for the long rant.

Francisco

On 22-02-2016 21:24, Wayne Ward wrote:

I wish emails had a like button

Wayne
Monday, 22 February 2016 21:20:06 UTC, Bob Summerwill 
 wrote:

"Why would you want android apps?"

I am using a Jolla Phone as my day-to-day device, and I can vouch from
first-hand experience that the AlienDalvik Android support on that 
device

is utterly invaluable in a practical sense.

Having native applications is obviously best, but Android 
compatibility is

a fantastic stopgap solution.   There are a huge number of Android
applications, and having access even to a subset is a godsend. It is
surprising how many Android applications can run without Google Play
Services.

Jolla Phone works with various Android stores, with Yandex and F-Droid
being the ones which I use the most.   Having F-Droid on Ubuntu Phone 
would

undoubtedly be "A Good Thing".

Having that kind of functionality available on top of a FOSS solution 
would

be fabulous.The SailfishOS ports really suffer for its absence.
 Ubuntu Phone would really benefit from an equivalent.

If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone as
well, I think.

https://twitter.com/sledgeSim/status/679647138305970177





On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Peter Bittner 
wrote:


Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).

> And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to 
write a

native app.

Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
user souls though.

Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
argument has been discussed on the list before.

@Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"

Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
That would be a very promising way to go, probably.

We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
appointments are not on there, unfortunately.

Peter

[2] https://tox.chat/
[3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)

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[Ubuntu-phone] Landing team 22.02.15

[Łukasz 'sil2100' Zemczak]

Hello everyone,

Mobile World Congress 2016 is ongoing and our representatives are there
showing off our Ubuntu Touch goodies. A lot of good announcements
recently - BQ Aquaris M10, Meizu Pro 5 and the Sony Xperia Z1 port. All
those were some of the reasons why so many of our developers were so
busy in the last weeks!

As for our rc-proposed releases today: we had a new unity8, thumbnailer
and unity-scopes-mediascanner landing (audio previews creating
playlists, playlist fixes), a new messaging-app (fixing MMS group chat
toggle) and a new ubuntu-keyboard with Japanese support. The latter
still requires a seed change (addition) which we will formalize tomorrow.

Besides that, since it's Monday and a bit less busy than last week, we
promoted the current devel-proposed images to devel as there was not
much change in quality. We'll have to put more pressure on devel image
quality in the nearest weeks.

As for OTA-9.1 - we are still in final testing, waiting for the final +1
before publishing. Once the test results are here we will be copying the
hotfix release to the stable channel and starting phased upgrades. ETA:
Wednesday.

Cheers!


* What landed in our images:
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch

#264 rc-proposed/krillin
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en/krillin/264.commitlog

#258 rc-proposed/vegetahd
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en/vegetahd/258.commitlog

#253 rc-proposed/arale
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/meizu.en/arale/253.commitlog


* Some useful documentation:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/citrain/RTMLandingApproaches
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/citrain/LandingProcess
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam/Smoketesting
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam/ReleaseSchedule
http://developer.ubuntu.com/start/ubuntu-for-devices/image-channels/

https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/
https://trello.com/b/AE3swczu/silo-testing
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/issues/
https://lists.launchpad.net/landing-team-changes/


* Blocking issues (stable):

None.


* Blocking issues (devel):

None.


* Issues in need of attention:

** Install the calendar app by default
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1418986

** Install the Dekko email app by default
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1477210

** [regression] mouse pointer support on emulator is broken
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1517597

** Unity8 is crashing in the emulator
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1535583



Best regards,

-- 
Łukasz 'sil2100' Zemczak
 Foundations Team
 lukasz.zemc...@canonical.com
 www.canonical.com

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Wayne Ward]

I wish emails had a like button

Wayne 

Monday, 22 February 2016 21:20:06 UTC, Bob Summerwill  
wrote:

"Why would you want android apps?"

I am using a Jolla Phone as my day-to-day device, and I can vouch from
first-hand experience that the AlienDalvik Android support on that device
is utterly invaluable in a practical sense.

Having native applications is obviously best, but Android compatibility is
a fantastic stopgap solution.   There are a huge number of Android
applications, and having access even to a subset is a godsend.   It is
surprising how many Android applications can run without Google Play
Services.

Jolla Phone works with various Android stores, with Yandex and F-Droid
being the ones which I use the most.   Having F-Droid on Ubuntu Phone would
undoubtedly be "A Good Thing".

Having that kind of functionality available on top of a FOSS solution would
be fabulous.The SailfishOS ports really suffer for its absence.
 Ubuntu Phone would really benefit from an equivalent.

If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone as
well, I think.

https://twitter.com/sledgeSim/status/679647138305970177





On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Peter Bittner 
wrote:


Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).

> And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to write a
native app.

Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
user souls though.

Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
argument has been discussed on the list before.

@Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"

Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
That would be a very promising way to go, probably.

We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
appointments are not on there, unfortunately.

Peter

[2] https://tox.chat/
[3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Volume control during calls (earpiece; increase volume range)

[Andrea Bernabei]

On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 11:12 AM, martin  wrote:

> Hi list,
>
> The volume control during calls has some issues: The minimum volume is too
> high and the step width is too small.
>
> The minimum volume can be decreased by decreasing the alsamixer "RX1
> Digital" entry. This leads to an acceptable min. volume but the max. volume
> is now too low.
> The solution would be to increase the step width/ volume range. How can
> this be accomplished?
>
>
Hi Martin,

thanks for taking the time to report this...
would you mind reporting this as a bug/feature-request to the dialer app,
so that the developers can have a look :)

Cheers,
Andrea


> Thanks!
> martin
>
> [Nexus4, OTA-9, stable]
>
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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Rodney Dawes]

On Mon, 2016-02-22 at 13:20 -0800, Bob Summerwill wrote:

> 
> If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
> SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone
> as well, I think.

The security model of Ubuntu, and that of Android, do not mesh at all.
Sailfish is not Ubuntu, and to compare the two in this regard of running
Android apps, is to completely ignore all of the work that has gone into
Ubuntu for security.

A general purpose solution for running Android apps would defeat the
security work that has been put into Ubuntu, and open up your Ubuntu
phone to all the same malware and other problems that Android has.


However, anyone is more than welcome to attempt to create a package
which contains one of these translation engines, and their
favorite .apk, and side-load it onto their phone, and attempt to use it.
You won't get Android push notifications. You won't get contacts or
calendar integration. You will get an Android App running on your Ubuntu
phone. If you want full system integration, then the best way for that
to happen, is to have a port of the app.




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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Bob Summerwill]

:-)

And maybe faenil will be bringing the "Android as an App" magic to Ubuntu
Phone?

https://twitter.com/faenil/status/679648455652995073


On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 1:24 PM, Wayne Ward  wrote:

> I wish emails had a like button
>
> Wayne
> Monday, 22 February 2016 21:20:06 UTC, Bob Summerwill 
> wrote:
>
>> "Why would you want android apps?"
>>
>> I am using a Jolla Phone as my day-to-day device, and I can vouch from
>> first-hand experience that the AlienDalvik Android support on that device
>> is utterly invaluable in a practical sense.
>>
>> Having native applications is obviously best, but Android compatibility is
>> a fantastic stopgap solution.   There are a huge number of Android
>> applications, and having access even to a subset is a godsend.   It is
>> surprising how many Android applications can run without Google Play
>> Services.
>>
>> Jolla Phone works with various Android stores, with Yandex and F-Droid
>> being the ones which I use the most.   Having F-Droid on Ubuntu Phone
>> would
>> undoubtedly be "A Good Thing".
>>
>> Having that kind of functionality available on top of a FOSS solution
>> would
>> be fabulous.The SailfishOS ports really suffer for its absence.
>>  Ubuntu Phone would really benefit from an equivalent.
>>
>> If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
>> SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone as
>> well, I think.
>>
>> https://twitter.com/sledgeSim/status/679647138305970177
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Peter Bittner 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).
>>>
>>> > And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to write a
>>> native app.
>>>
>>> Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
>>> implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
>>> I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
>>> mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
>>> user souls though.
>>>
>>> Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
>>> argument has been discussed on the list before.
>>>
>>> @Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
>>> user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
>>> messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
>>> bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"
>>>
>>> Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
>>> generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
>>> That would be a very promising way to go, probably.
>>>
>>> We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
>>> relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
>>> Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
>>> it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
>>> already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
>>> appointments are not on there, unfortunately.
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>> [2] https://tox.chat/
>>> [3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)
>>>
>>> --
>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>> Post to : ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net
>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-phone
>>> More help   : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
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>
>
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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Bob Summerwill]

"Why would you want android apps?"

I am using a Jolla Phone as my day-to-day device, and I can vouch from
first-hand experience that the AlienDalvik Android support on that device
is utterly invaluable in a practical sense.

Having native applications is obviously best, but Android compatibility is
a fantastic stopgap solution.   There are a huge number of Android
applications, and having access even to a subset is a godsend.   It is
surprising how many Android applications can run without Google Play
Services.

Jolla Phone works with various Android stores, with Yandex and F-Droid
being the ones which I use the most.   Having F-Droid on Ubuntu Phone would
undoubtedly be "A Good Thing".

Having that kind of functionality available on top of a FOSS solution would
be fabulous.The SailfishOS ports really suffer for its absence.
 Ubuntu Phone would really benefit from an equivalent.

If you want to see something amazing, check out "Android as an App" on
SailfishOS.   That kind of magic should be possible for Ubuntu Phone as
well, I think.

https://twitter.com/sledgeSim/status/679647138305970177





On Mon, Feb 22, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Peter Bittner 
wrote:

> Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).
>
> > And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to write a
> native app.
>
> Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
> implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
> I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
> mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
> user souls though.
>
> Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
> argument has been discussed on the list before.
>
> @Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
> user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
> messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
> bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"
>
> Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
> generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
> That would be a very promising way to go, probably.
>
> We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
> relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
> Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
> it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
> already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
> appointments are not on there, unfortunately.
>
> Peter
>
> [2] https://tox.chat/
> [3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)
>
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>



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[Ubuntu-phone] suspend in 10 seconds after phone call

[Matthias Apitz]

Hello,

I have configured in my BQ E4.5 OTA-9 'lock when idle' to 4 minutes. But 
after any phone call the device goes to suspend within 10 secs. Is this a 
feature or a known issue?


matthias



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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Only 5% remains on internal storage

[Matthew Paul Thomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Gareth France wrote on 17/02/16 20:37:
> 
> I'm getting the above error message but tapping on it takes me to 
> 'external storage' or SD card management and the only options seem
> to be formate or safely remove. How do I go about cleaning up the 
> internal storage and what could possibly be using that much space?

If you can, please take a screenshot, and report a bug that it’s
taking you to the wrong place. It’s supposed to take you to the
Storage screen in System Settings.


- -- 
mpt

-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlbK46gACgkQ6PUxNfU6ecqH9gCfY6FN7+ELDU2KLM/CCpDYUDGA
hh8AoJL5T9KA1z0WqZK6Y4t+IL274DXl
=3ms6
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Peter Bittner]

Sorry, I forgot to respond to your second question (and email address).

> And if you can run android apps, why would they be bothered to write a native 
> app.

Maybe for the same reason why not every organization chooses to
implement their apps using Cordova. Because on an attractive platform
I want to offer the best available integration possible. Not a
mediocre, "working one", which could be sufficient to some suffering
user souls though.

Attractive. That was my point in mentioning "differentiation". This
argument has been discussed on the list before.

@Mark Re Tox [2], I think I saw that before. But what (current)
user-facing problems does it solve (apart from Edward Snowden's secure
messaging, which *is* important, acknowledged)? Will my wife stop
bugging me with "can you finally install Wattsup on your damn fone?"

Seriously, integrating all those communication features, including
generic SIP and XMPP, seamlessly in Ubuntu Phone would be awesome.
That would be a very promising way to go, probably.

We don't need extra clients if it's really as advertised, "The
relationship of The Tox Project to Tox is analogous to the Linux
Foundation's relationship to Linux." [3], let's go for integration if
it's that good. What we don't need is another messaging client. We
already have Telegram. And the contacts for our kids' sports
appointments are not on there, unfortunately.

Peter

[2] https://tox.chat/
[3] https://tox.chat/about.html (at the bottom of the page)

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Peter Bittner]

No, don't get me wrong. I love to run around with a full-blown pocket
calculator that runs the best Terminal app of all mobile platforms.

It's just that my wife is bugging me I need to get one of those odd
messaging apps, with working notifications (even when the app is in
the background), so I can also participate in taking the kids to and
from their sports appointments. Unfortunately, the friggin' PlayStore
(that I'm redirected to, because zillions of websites think I'm
running an Android phone) doesn't install those goodies.

I know, that problem is easily solved. I just need to buy an eye fone
or a device from their main competitors. But I don't want to give up
on my Spanish 5" pocket calculator. Understand?

Peter


2016-02-22 15:30 GMT+01:00 i...@carakas.be:
> Why would you want android apps ?
>
> Most of them won’t work because they rely on google play services or because 
> of the sandbox.
> They would also look out of place. And if you can run android apps, why would 
> they be bothered to write a native app.

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[justcarakas]

Why would you want android apps ?

Most of them won’t work because they rely on google play services or because of 
the sandbox.
They would also look out of place. And if you can run android apps, why would 
they be bothered to write a native app.

> On 22 Feb 2016, at 15:26, Peter Bittner  wrote:
> 
> Wow, this is cool news!
> 
> It's something like Wine, hopefully a lot closer integration-wise. The
> (realistic) goal of the project according to the introductory video on
> [1] is to have Android apps available on your desktop (depicted by
> icons) and just click on the icons to launch them. No setup and
> tweaking of a runtime environment (as now during development). And
> Android apps available for installation from any app store. Nice!
> 
> Unfortunately (or fortuantely), the project maintainers are
> overhauling the code base completely. So, the project is not
> "installable" at the moment. The main repositories on GitHub have been
> renamed to "*-old" [2, 3]. I've been told on IRC that "realistically
> if you want to build it yourslef you're best waiting a few weeks for
> me to tidy things up" (d_ed on #shashlik).
> 
> Would be awesome if that would work in an integrated fashion on Ubuntu
> phone and table, rather soon. That would solve a lot of headaches, à
> la "is  going to be implemented
> for Ubuntu Phone?". That could do away with the maybe major motivation
> for Canonical to focus the catch-up game on the platform instead of
> differentiation. (Sorry!)
> 
> Peter
> 
> [1] 
> http://www.shashlik.io/news/2015/07/27/shashlik-project-launches-at-akademy-2015/
> [2] https://github.com/shashlik/old-shashlik
> [3] https://github.com/shashlik/old-docs
> 
> 
> 2016-02-22 4:25 GMT+01:00 Jason Daborn:
>> Saw this today, maybe useful for Ubuntu Touch?
>> 
>> http://www.shashlik.io/
>> 
>> Jason
> 
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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Peter Bittner]

Wow, this is cool news!

It's something like Wine, hopefully a lot closer integration-wise. The
(realistic) goal of the project according to the introductory video on
[1] is to have Android apps available on your desktop (depicted by
icons) and just click on the icons to launch them. No setup and
tweaking of a runtime environment (as now during development). And
Android apps available for installation from any app store. Nice!

Unfortunately (or fortuantely), the project maintainers are
overhauling the code base completely. So, the project is not
"installable" at the moment. The main repositories on GitHub have been
renamed to "*-old" [2, 3]. I've been told on IRC that "realistically
if you want to build it yourslef you're best waiting a few weeks for
me to tidy things up" (d_ed on #shashlik).

Would be awesome if that would work in an integrated fashion on Ubuntu
phone and table, rather soon. That would solve a lot of headaches, à
la "is  going to be implemented
for Ubuntu Phone?". That could do away with the maybe major motivation
for Canonical to focus the catch-up game on the platform instead of
differentiation. (Sorry!)

Peter

[1] 
http://www.shashlik.io/news/2015/07/27/shashlik-project-launches-at-akademy-2015/
[2] https://github.com/shashlik/old-shashlik
[3] https://github.com/shashlik/old-docs


2016-02-22 4:25 GMT+01:00 Jason Daborn:
> Saw this today, maybe useful for Ubuntu Touch?
>
> http://www.shashlik.io/
>
> Jason

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] mailing list

[Barry Warsaw]

On Feb 21, 2016, at 09:12 PM, Matthias Apitz wrote:

>I've checked the archives and my log files: I do not receive any mail
>from the list after this one:

I don't know why that is; I'm seeing several messages to this mailing list
today.  Let's see if I get this response...

>What can I do as this is not a normal Mailman list? Can someone please
>have a look... Thanks

Launchpad mailing lists are run by Mailman underneath the covers, but without
the traditional web u/i.  Instead, Launchpad manages subscriptions and such,
and it bakes in several options that are traditionally available for
customization by users.

Cheers,
-Barry

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] mailing list

[Peter Bittner]

Actually, I'm getting email from this list here [1], and there are
messages. More than enough, recently.

[1]  https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/

Maybe the mailman thing is just an integration into Launchpad, and the
integration is broken? Just guessing.

Peter


2016-02-22 12:06 GMT+01:00 Cesar Herrera :
> It fails also the page:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net/index.html
> Cheers,
> Cesar

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] mailing list

[Cesar Herrera]

It fails also the page:
http://www.mail-archive.com/ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net/index.html
Cheers,
Cesar
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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Dual-SIM phone features?

[Vic G]

Hi Alexey!

Currently the Sim-card system is not hot-swappable, the best way to 
detect SIM with the phone turned on is enable/disable flight mode.


Cheers,

El 22/02/16 a las 09:38, Alexey Balmashnov escribió:

Hi All,

Thanks for your insights. Second sim card is on its way...

Never used dual sims and never had phone, where access to sim cards 
was so easy (always needed to remove battery first). So, question: are 
sim-cards hot-pluggable/hot-swappable?


Cheers,
Alexey


On Wed, Feb 17, 2016 at 1:04 PM, Alan Bell > wrote:


you can choose which is the default SIM for data/text/calls so you
could have a local SIM for data roaming if your main SIM contract
is still harsh on data roaming - this is slowly being fixed as
suppliers are starting to give you your data allowance when
roaming, or pay a few £/€ a day for unlimited/throttled data, but
if you are going somewhere for more than a few days and want a
local data SIM then this can work well.

Alan.



On 16/02/16 22:10, Alexey Balmashnov wrote:


Hi All,

Is there some overview/list of dual-SIM related features
supported by ubuntu phone platform?

Quick googling did not bring much useful results. Pointers to
reliable information sources are appreciated.

Cheers,
  Alexey






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Marie Curie, 19 Bloque 2 Planta 6 Oficina 6

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Dual-SIM phone features?

[Alexey Balmashnov]

Hi All,

Thanks for your insights. Second sim card is on its way...

Never used dual sims and never had phone, where access to sim cards was so
easy (always needed to remove battery first). So, question: are sim-cards
hot-pluggable/hot-swappable?

Cheers,
Alexey


On Wed, Feb 17, 2016 at 1:04 PM, Alan Bell  wrote:

> you can choose which is the default SIM for data/text/calls so you could
> have a local SIM for data roaming if your main SIM contract is still harsh
> on data roaming - this is slowly being fixed as suppliers are starting to
> give you your data allowance when roaming, or pay a few £/€ a day for
> unlimited/throttled data, but if you are going somewhere for more than a
> few days and want a local data SIM then this can work well.
>
> Alan.
>
>
>
> On 16/02/16 22:10, Alexey Balmashnov wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> Is there some overview/list of dual-SIM related features supported by
> ubuntu phone platform?
>
> Quick googling did not bring much useful results. Pointers to reliable
> information sources are appreciated.
>
> Cheers,
>   Alexey
>
>
>
>
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[Ubuntu-phone] Landing team 19.02.16

[Łukasz 'sil2100' Zemczak]

Hello everyone,

Another quiet day in the landing world - only one new package released
today so far: a new oxide-qt with multiple security updates. For the
rest we'll have to wait for till later next week.
We used this rather quiet day to update our wiki-pages regarding the
release procedures [1], documenting the procedures of hotfix update
preparation.

As for our hotfix OTA-9.1 release: all looks good so far and we are now
in final testing for the next few days. Currently the approximate
release date is set to Wednesday the following week. There will be a
separate announcement once that happens of course.

Next week is Mobile World Congress 2016 with some exciting Ubuntu Touch
demos planned, so be sure to tune in!

Have a great weekend.


* What landed in our images:
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch

#263 rc-proposed/krillin
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en/krillin/263.commitlog

#257 rc-proposed/vegetahd
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en/vegetahd/257.commitlog

#252 rc-proposed/arale
-
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/landing-team/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/meizu.en/arale/252.commitlog


* Some useful documentation:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/citrain/RTMLandingApproaches
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/citrain/LandingProcess
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam/Smoketesting
[1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LandingTeam/ReleaseSchedule
http://developer.ubuntu.com/start/ubuntu-for-devices/image-channels/

https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/
https://trello.com/b/AE3swczu/silo-testing
http://people.canonical.com/~lzemczak/issues/
https://lists.launchpad.net/landing-team-changes/


* Blocking issues (stable):

None.


* Blocking issues (devel):

None.


* Issues in need of attention:

** Install the calendar app by default
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1418986

** Install the Dekko email app by default
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1477210

** [regression] mouse pointer support on emulator is broken
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1517597

** Unity8 is crashing in the emulator
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1535583



Best regards,

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] mailing list

[Mark]

I'd been thinking that things had been very quiet too - I just put it 
down to everyone working extra hard!


On 21/02/16 14:12, Matthias Apitz wrote:

Hello,

I've checked the archives and my log files: I do not receive any mail
from the list after this one:

Feb 17 22:25:40 c720-r292778-amd64 sm-mta[11232]: u1HLPed6011232:
from=,
size=14358, class=-30, nrcpts=1,

Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Text inserting - suggestion

[Matthias Apitz]

El día Sunday, February 21, 2016 a las 07:34:22PM +, Chris escribió:

> Hello,
> 
> I was wondering if anyone shares my opinion, that phones in general are 
> not very convenient when it comes to typing.
> Something I find most annoying is when I need to position cursor by 
> touching between letters to correct misspelled word (especially letter 
> "i" is difficult to touch around).
> 
> I started thinking what would be ideal text editor for phone.
> 
> ...

I fully agree, that placing the cursor to an exact point is a PITA.

What is missing, IMHO, on the keyboard is, that it lacks keys for cursor
movement to place a (wrong placed) cursor into the right position.

matthias


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[Ubuntu-phone] Problem with AngularJS and jQuery libraries in Ubuntu SDK - HTML 5 App

[Marco Graziotti]

Hi list,

I'm trying to explore the "Ubuntu SDK" and just to test I made a "HTML 5 
App".
The app need to use my own angular library (such as: angular.min.js) and 
module for routing (angular-route.min.js), with this module I can fill 
an index page with other html views, but it doesn't work, it seems that 
it cannot  find the angular libraries. Also, after installing it on my 
Meizu MX4 (with click package kit: all).


I checked this link 
https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/html-5/guides/introduction-to-the-html5-ui-toolkit/without 
finding any solution.


Anyone has my same issue? Where am I wrong?

Thank you,
Marco

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] font size/ accessibility

[Selene Scriven]

* Peter Bittner  wrote:
> Actually, "theming" should already be a core design feature, at 
> least planned if not implemented.

+1 to this.

At minimum:
  - Ability to set arbitrary wallpaper.  (independent of the lock screen)
  - Configure default font type, size, and color.
  - Configure number of rows/columns in scopes.
  - Choose an overall scale for the UI, as with grid units.
  - Set a global default base color for UI widgets (or at least 
provide "light" and "dark").
  - Set a base color for the top bar and pull-down menus.

I find that the default font sizes are okay, but the widgets are 
mostly too large with too much empty space between them, and the 
solid white used everywhere hurts to look at.


-- Selene

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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] reload page in browser

[Olivier Tilloy]

On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 5:50 PM, Matthias Apitz  wrote:
> Hello,
>
> What is the best way to do a page reload in the browser app in BQ E4.5
> OTA-9?
>
> Thanks
>
> matthias

Tap on the address bar to focus it, a reload icon should appear to the
left of the URL (in place of the favicon), tap it.

HTH,

 Olivier

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[Ubuntu-phone] Convergence with a Pi docking station.

[Ed Kapitein]

Hi,

Does anyone know if there is a project, that is building a docking 
station for the Bq 4.5, based on a raspberry pi?
With a custom (3D printed) case, a pi could be used to drive a display 
over HDMI and use it's USB ports to connect a keyboard and mouse.


Kind regards,
Ed


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[Ubuntu-phone] Volume control during calls (earpiece; increase volume range)

[martin]

Hi list,

The volume control during calls has some issues: The minimum volume is 
too high and the step width is too small.


The minimum volume can be decreased by decreasing the alsamixer "RX1 
Digital" entry. This leads to an acceptable min. volume but the max. 
volume is now too low.
The solution would be to increase the step width/ volume range. How can 
this be accomplished?


Thanks!
martin

[Nexus4, OTA-9, stable]

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[Ubuntu-phone] reload page in browser

[Matthias Apitz]

Hello,

What is the best way to do a page reload in the browser app in BQ E4.5 
OTA-9?


Thanks

matthias



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[Ubuntu-phone] Shashlik running Android apps on Linux

[Jason Daborn]

Saw this today, maybe useful for Ubuntu Touch?

http://www.shashlik.io/

Jason
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Re: [Ubuntu-phone] Command

[Vic G]

Hi,

I've filed this bug:

https://bugs.launchpad.net/barajas/+bug/1480185

Cheers,

Victor G.
El 16/02/16 a las 09:59, Cesar Herrera escribió:

I'd like to make an image of the phone with all the apps and
configuration it has now.
And knowing how to restore it.
Cheers,
Cesar






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[Ubuntu-phone] Text inserting - suggestion

[Chris]

Hello,

I was wondering if anyone shares my opinion, that phones in general are 
not very convenient when it comes to typing.
Something I find most annoying is when I need to position cursor by 
touching between letters to correct misspelled word (especially letter 
"i" is difficult to touch around).


I started thinking what would be ideal text editor for phone.

So far I saw nice solution in android, when you do not have to touch 
cursor itself but a little round thing right below it, so you can see 
exactly it's current position right  above your finger.


I saw once other solution where on touching the screen while in typing 
mode, little window showing what is under your finger currently would 
show right above your finger (a bit like Windows magnifier) - so again 
you can see exactly where cursor position is at that moment.




I would like to suggest another solution, where when entering typing 
space (say you enter your details on the website or something) than 
window-like pane opens above your keyboard, where typing is done (with a 
button "Done" when you are done typing).
In that window you would be able to enlarge your text, and maybe even 
navigate by touch: e.g. swipe left - cursor moves left by character, 
swipe and hold, cursor moves by a word. Swipe up - move cursor by line up.
After you are done typing, or if you are not happy with this input 
method, press done, and you still are able to type as normal.


Third idea I have is to use gesture for cursor navigation: tu use - 
touch and hold anywhere in your keyboard, and with the other finger 
start swiping outside the keyboard area - that would be kind of 
equivalent of mouse movement. So if you swipe up (while "holding 
keyboard") cursor moves up - say one line for each 2 millimetres of your 
swap - same for sideways moves). Holding keyboard with two fingers would 
act as "select text".


Let me know guys, what you think. I think no phone came yet with good 
cursor navigation, and maybe this would be move right direction.
If there is Ubuntu suggestion-box, let me know where, and what would be 
category of such a suggestion, as I would like to see it device-wide 
rather than only in web browser or messaging.
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[Ubuntu-phone] mailing list

[Matthias Apitz]

Hello,

I've checked the archives and my log files: I do not receive any mail
from the list after this one:

Feb 17 22:25:40 c720-r292778-amd64 sm-mta[11232]: u1HLPed6011232:
from=,
size=14358, class=-30, nrcpts=1,