Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-14 Thread Robin Vickery
On 13/06/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, June 13, 2007 3:36 am, Robin Vickery wrote: On 12/06/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 9:33 am, Tijnema wrote: I meant reverse order :P That would be pretty broken. There's no guarantee that

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-13 Thread Robin Vickery
On 12/06/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 9:33 am, Tijnema wrote: I meant reverse order :P That would be pretty broken. There's no guarantee that browsers will present the inputs in any order at all, even though they all seem (so far) to follow the convention

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-13 Thread Tijnema
On 6/13/07, Jake McHenry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been reading along, very informative :) I found Osama within 20 seconds and as someone posted already, looking for his head wouldn't be much of a task for a computer. It's just for if you want to keep normal people out ;) Has anyone

RE: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-13 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 10:12 pm, Jake McHenry wrote: Has anyone tried cracking/hacking what Microsoft has done with the animal pictures? MS is using petfinder.com or whatever it is, as their source to know what is a cat and a dog So all you have to do is trick petfinder.com into giving you all

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-13 Thread Richard Lynch
On Wed, June 13, 2007 3:36 am, Robin Vickery wrote: On 12/06/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 9:33 am, Tijnema wrote: I meant reverse order :P That would be pretty broken. There's no guarantee that browsers will present the inputs in any order at all, even

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 6:22 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Server builds up a database of pictures, client does the same with MD5 check, and problem solved...:) Tijnema Tijnema: Not exactly, I don't think you could MD5 this: http://sperling.com/examples/dot-captcha/ To make variations of the theme. I can

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;) As I provided in another post, try cracking this:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 7:51 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: It would definitly be an interesting challenge, but you don't have time, or is that an excuse..? :P What about you tedd? Tijnema Eager Beaver, huh? Good for you! After you crack my dot-captcha, I'll make up another. :-) Rob provided an interesting

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Stut
tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;) As I provided in another post, try cracking

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 3:02 PM -0400 6/11/07, Robert Cummings wrote: OCR is extremely fast. I've done work in the past using OCR and while it was simple text in documents, the OCR program could extract the text from the image of a magazine page in about a second. For simplistic displays of text, or even only slight

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 4:37 PM -0400 6/11/07, Daniel Brown wrote: I'm going to try to knock out a proof-of-concept later this week if I can to bring some of it together. -- Daniel P. Brown Daniel et al: While thinking about proof-of-concepts, think also of optical illusions -- perhaps there's some

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 12:42 PM +0100 6/12/07, Stut wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;) As I

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, tedd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 12:42 PM +0100 6/12/07, Stut wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:25 -0400, tedd wrote: At 6:22 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Server builds up a database of pictures, client does the same with MD5 check, and problem solved...:) Tijnema Tijnema: Not exactly, I don't think you could MD5 this:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;) As

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:05 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 08:01 -0400, tedd wrote: At 3:02 PM -0400 6/11/07, Robert Cummings wrote: OCR is extremely fast. I've done work in the past using OCR and while it was simple text in documents, the OCR program could extract the text from the image of a magazine page in about a second. For

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Stut
Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Stut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;)

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Stut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:09 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:09 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 07:29 -0400, tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Stut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Stut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Stut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: Nope, it does actually check for Submit.x and Submit.y ;) DOH! :) Cheers, Rob. You seem pretty sure about it, what if he

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: Nope, it does actually check for Submit.x and Submit.y ;) DOH! :) Cheers,

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robin Vickery
On 10/06/07, Dave M G [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PHP General List, With a little help from the web, and help from this list, I have a simple CAPTCHA image that works within the content system I'm building. But it's *really* simple. Basically white text on a black background, with a couple of

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:33 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: Nope, it does actually

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:35 +0100, Robin Vickery wrote: On 10/06/07, Dave M G [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PHP General List, With a little help from the web, and help from this list, I have a simple CAPTCHA image that works within the content system I'm building. But it's *really* simple.

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread zerof
This is another intersting example of CAPTCHA, from - Carnegie Mellon University: http://recaptcha.net/ -- zerof http://www.educar.pro.br/ Apache - PHP - MySQL - Boolean Logics - Project Management -- VocĂȘ deve, sempre, consultar uma

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:53 -0300, zerof wrote: This is another intersting example of CAPTCHA, from - Carnegie Mellon University: http://recaptcha.net/ That's a pretty cool idea... doesn't necessarily improve CAPTCHA per se, but it does give it some usefulness beyond preventing spam.

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 2:12 PM +0100 6/12/07, Stut wrote: The submit image is bigger than the circle, and I'm guessing Tedd is checking the coords passed through. -Stut Yes, that's all the technique does for now. It just checks the submit x and submit y and determines if those coordinates lie within the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:49 -0400, tedd wrote: At 2:12 PM +0100 6/12/07, Stut wrote: The submit image is bigger than the circle, and I'm guessing Tedd is checking the coords passed through. -Stut Yes, that's all the technique does for now. It just checks the submit x and submit y and

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:49 -0400, tedd wrote: At 2:12 PM +0100 6/12/07, Stut wrote: The submit image is bigger than the circle, and I'm guessing Tedd is checking the coords passed through. -Stut Yes, that's all the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: (1 * 100) / 100 = .10 = 10% of the time Bad math alert... (1 * 100) / 100 = 10;) Still the same answer though, was just mixing what I wrote with

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: (1 * 100) / 100 = .10 = 10% of the time Bad math alert... (1 * 100) / 100 = 10;) Still the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: (1 * 100) / 100 = .10 = 10% of the time Bad

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:34 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings

RE: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Jim Moseby
-Original Message- From: Tijnema [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2007 1:34 PM To: Robert Cummings Cc: tedd; Stut; Jim Lucas; php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:34 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 19:23 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:06 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Okay, here's something I whipped up today: http://pilotpig.com/captcha/index.php Works pretty well, but keep in mind that it's in the very early stages. I randomized the position and size to assist in throwing off Turing

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:06 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Okay, here's something I whipped up today: http://pilotpig.com/captcha/index.php Works pretty well, but keep in mind that it's in the very early stages. I randomized

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 6:25 am, tedd wrote: At 6:22 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Server builds up a database of pictures, client does the same with MD5 check, and problem solved...:) Tijnema Tijnema: Not exactly, I don't think you could MD5 this:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 21:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:06 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Okay, here's something I whipped up today: http://pilotpig.com/captcha/index.php Works pretty well, but

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 21:46 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:06 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Okay, here's something I whipped up today:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 6:42 am, Stut wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is uncrackable ;)

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 6:42 am, Stut wrote: tedd wrote: At 7:38 PM +0200 6/11/07, Tijnema wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 6:41 am, tedd wrote: If my dot-captcha holds up against Tijnema, we could think of various ways to combine both. E. Now that I've looked at the source, how do you stop: ?php posttohost('http://sperling.com', '/examples/dot-captcha/index.php',

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 9:33 am, Tijnema wrote: I meant reverse order :P That would be pretty broken. There's no guarantee that browsers will present the inputs in any order at all, even though they all seem (so far) to follow the convention of presenting them in the order they appear in the

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 9:33 am, Tijnema wrote: I meant reverse order :P That would be pretty broken. First, you should;ve seen this as a joke that replies to the previous messages. There's no guarantee that browsers will present the inputs

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 3:40 pm, Tijnema wrote: A PFP (Pixel-For-Pixel) Approach would do the job, but I don't think there exists software yet for it. I would have to get the file format of the bitmap you're using (PNG I Guess), and then parse it PFP. Oh, the software exists.

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Tijnema
On 6/12/07, Richard Lynch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 3:40 pm, Tijnema wrote: A PFP (Pixel-For-Pixel) Approach would do the job, but I don't think there exists software yet for it. I would have to get the file format of the bitmap you're using (PNG I Guess), and then parse

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 7:01 am, tedd wrote: I was thinking about this the other day -- computers are fast and people are generally slow. So, instead of making the time short, examine how fast the answer was obtained. Immediate = computer; delayed = human. Even an easy LETTER CAPTCHA takes

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 10:49 am, tedd wrote: Now, how is a bot going to figure that out? The bot doesn't figure any damn thing out. A human figures it out, and programs the bot to do it. If you're just fighting a bot, any captcha will work. If you're fighting an actual human, any captcha can be

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:05 -0500, Richard Lynch wrote: On Tue, June 12, 2007 7:01 am, tedd wrote: I was thinking about this the other day -- computers are fast and people are generally slow. So, instead of making the time short, examine how fast the answer was obtained. Immediate =

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 2:06 pm, Daniel Brown wrote: Okay, here's something I whipped up today: http://pilotpig.com/captcha/index.php Works pretty well, but keep in mind that it's in the very early stages. I randomized the position and size to assist in throwing off Turing

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Richard Lynch
On Tue, June 12, 2007 7:18 am, tedd wrote: At 4:37 PM -0400 6/11/07, Daniel Brown wrote: I'm going to try to knock out a proof-of-concept later this week if I can to bring some of it together. -- Daniel P. Brown Daniel et al: While thinking about proof-of-concepts, think also of optical

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 6:19 PM +0200 6/12/07, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: (1 * 100) / 100 = .10 = 10% of the time Bad math alert...

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
http://shorl.com/nomojeryprafri Cheers, Rob. Hmm, LOL Ok, found him ;) He's under the ground ... :P Heheh, nah, not this time... he's in one of the bumper cars :) Cheers, Rob. That would have kept me out. I must have spent ten minutes looking at that thing and I did not

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA OT

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 4:33 PM -0500 6/12/07, Richard Lynch wrote: !!!The remainder is NOT directed to any one specific person!!! Perhaps we should consider a moratorium on posts about CAPTCHA, or some kind of limitation here... It's getting old fast... Perhaps only allow actual implementations and actual cracks

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread tedd
At 12:29 PM -0400 6/12/07, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote:

RE: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Jake McHenry
: Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA At 12:29 PM -0400 6/12/07, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 18:19 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/12/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 11:56

RE: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-12 Thread Robert Cummings
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 23:12 -0400, Jake McHenry wrote: I've been reading along, very informative :) I found Osama within 20 seconds and as someone posted already, looking for his head wouldn't be much of a task for a computer. Has anyone tried cracking/hacking what Microsoft has done with

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/10/07, tedd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tedd: Please don't spread the code of your Audio CAPTCHA, we had a big discussion about it, and we concluded that it was quite easy to crack. I remember i've cracked some other CAPTCHAs, but if you still think your Audio CAPTCHA isn't hard to crack,

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/11/07, Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/10/07, tedd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tedd: Please don't spread the code of your Audio CAPTCHA, we had a big discussion about it, and we concluded that it was quite easy to crack. I remember i've cracked some other CAPTCHAs, but if you still

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Daniel Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/11/07, Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/10/07, tedd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tedd: Please don't spread the code of your Audio CAPTCHA, we had a big discussion about it, and we concluded that it was quite easy to crack. I

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread tedd
Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground. However, Rob said: A good captcha will try to exploit a computer's weaknesses. So, let's expound on that -- what do you consider to be a computer's

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground. However, Rob said: A good captcha will try to exploit a computer's weaknesses. So, let's expound

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground. However, Rob said: A good

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Jason Pruim
On Jun 11, 2007, at 12:01 PM, Robert Cummings wrote: What did you hear ringing? Possible answers... a bell, the telephone, an alarm, etc. The problem then becomes an issue of people who can't spell or are terrible at recognizing everyday things. To combat that, wouldn't you be able

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Daniel Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 12:01 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground. However, Rob said: A good captcha will try to

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/11/07, Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground.

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Jim Lucas
Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously traveled ground. However, Rob said: A good

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Jim Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: Gnag: I know we can beat this thing to death, as we have in previous threads and I don't anyone wants to travel previously

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Crayon Shin Chan
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 00:22, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38 -0400, tedd wrote: [snip] Tijnema, Daniel Brown, and any other guilty ones, please trim your posts! -- Crayon -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
Nah, that's what we have you for! ;-P Just for that, I'm top-posting, too. Gotta' love Mondays On 6/11/07, Crayon Shin Chan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tuesday 12 June 2007 00:22, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 10:38

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 18:57 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Jim Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not if you are morphing/changing the image each page load. snip remember, change height, width, color depth, plus

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 18:57 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Jim Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not if you are morphing/changing the image each page load. snip

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 13:29 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 18:57 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Jim Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not if you are morphing/changing the image each page

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 19:38 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean the same uncrackable as AACS did: HD-DVD is

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 19:38 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see if I can crack it ;) Tijnema * I hope you don't mean

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] spake the following lore: Convert image to fixed width + fixed height + default depth, then do some work on it :P Tijnema Yeah, what work? Best of luck with getting a system to reliably translate one Jell-o blob of an image into another accurately and reliably.

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 19:51 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 19:38 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, if you think this is the uncrackable* solution, create it and i'll see

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 13:52 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] spake the following lore: Convert image to fixed width + fixed height + default depth, then do some work on it :P To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 13:52 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] spake the following lore: Convert image to fixed width + fixed height + default depth, then do some work on it :P To be a bit easier, I whipped up a

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 13:59 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 13:52 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] spake the following lore: Convert image to fixed width + fixed height + default depth, then do

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
The (things I thought were subtle) jokes aside, hopefully the examples can be used as some kind of point-of-reference for those who may follow along in the future. When they Google for a solution like the one we're discussing and the words of this motley crew come up as one of the first

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Daniel Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] spake the following lore: Convert image to fixed width + fixed height + default depth, then do some work on it :P Tijnema Yeah, what work? Best of luck with getting a system to reliably translate one Jell-o

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not a working system, but you'll see what we're getting at here: http://pilotpig.net/captcha-example.php You could even use a color check here to see which color matches the best ;) Tijnema

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 14:29 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not a working system, but you'll see what we're getting at here: http://pilotpig.net/captcha-example.php You could even use a

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Tijnema
On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 14:29 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not a working system, but you'll see what we're getting at here:

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Robert Cummings
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 20:47 +0200, Tijnema wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 14:29 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not a working system, but you'll see

Re: [PHP] Going from simple to super CAPTCHA

2007-06-11 Thread Daniel Brown
On 6/11/07, Tijnema [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/11/07, Robert Cummings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 14:29 -0400, Daniel Brown wrote: To be a bit easier, I whipped up a quick example on the web. It's just static images, not a working system, but you'll see what

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