On Jan 23, 2013, at 4:21 PM, Matt Wagner <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 01:42:31PM -0500, Mo Morsi wrote:
>> On 01/23/2013 01:16 PM, Bryan Kearney wrote:
>>> Well, just thinking out loud.. can any component go into the cloud
>>> which may not be in the same VPN space?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- bk
>>> 
>> 
>> I'd imagine this would come down to the security policy of the
>> organization deploying to the cloud, namely how lax the firewall can be
>> to permit connections from the cloud as well as the ip address
>> assignment on the cloud instances launched.
> 
> For a while now, I've been watching this discussion thinking, "It feels
> like we decided a while back that AMQP would be cool, and are now trying
> to work backwards to come up with reasons to justify it." Perhaps I'm
> just not forward-looking enough, or perhaps I'm overlooking an important
> detail, but that's sort of how it feels to me.
> 
> I think networking is an edge case, and a minor detail. We should
> absolutely try to support running components on different boxes (though
> I don't believe we have ever properly tested or supported it). But if
> you break Aeolus up and run it on disparate network segments, you're
> going to have to handle somehow patching things together. I don't think
> we should choose how we handle inter-component messaging based on what
> happens if you break components up on different networks and refuse to
> set up a VPN or appropriate port-forwarding rules.
> 
> I don't mean to single out networking in general, though; it's just the
> latest in the discussion. I just worry that the discussion is largely
> theoretical and academic, focused on how different means of
> inter-component communications differ. That might be a good conversation
> to have if we didn't already have all our components using one. What I'm
> missing from this discussion is an exploration of what issues we're
> actually experiencing today with our HTTP callbacks system, and whether
> the overhead of switching to AMQP is a worthwhile trade-off. Is changing
> Factory and Conductor to use AMQP worthwhile to prevent the issue where
> if you shut down one of the two components in the middle of an exchange
> of messages, some messages might be lost? Could that better be solved by
> implementing some queuing or polling? Or, is it fair to say that if you
> send a job to Factory from Conductor and then shut down Conductor, it's
> just expected that the updated status might be missed?
> 
> It's not my intention to vehemently oppose AMQP, and I certainly don't
> mean to suggest that it shouldn't be discussed. I just don't find the
> current conversation terribly productive at making the case for why we
> should switch.
> 
> -- Matt

imagefactory started off using QMF. It's what we were told was decided on when 
Aeolus was designed. But conductor was having a difficult time using it because 
it meant having a separate thread or process to bridge conductor to the broker. 
So, in the summer of 2011, there was a number of discussions where developers 
on both the imagefactory and conductor teams came out in favor of imagefactory 
offering a REST interface. We did, and near the end of January of 2012, we 
officially removed the QMF interface from the source tree when it started to 
seem like QPID/QMF was failing to gain traction in the wider community.

I'm not saying the conversation shouldn't happen either. What I am saying is 
that it should pick up where it was left 18 months ago with the question of if 
the challenges of conductor actually connecting to a broker are easier to deal 
with now than they were in 2011 when they were great enough to decide to switch 
course.

-steve


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