That is always a problem. And much more so if your product has software
inside. My products I can put them into production, take them out,
advertise, not advertise pretty much on a whim.
When you have software you always have features, oddities, perhaps bugs,
anomalies that need to be hunted down and killed.
Software is born, lives and dies but is never done.
When I was doing software dependent products I spent all my spare time
adding features and killing bugs. I like this much better the way I do
them now...
*From:* Lewis Bergman
*Sent:* Thursday, December 21, 2017 4:03 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Remote generator start options packetflux?
Of course, that might lead Forrest back to the initial place in this
thread which was "I didn't sell that many of them". Not saying he
wouldn't, but he has mouths to feed and only one of him. As a result he
tries to gauge interest before taking on projects. I'll bet he could tell
you pretty quick if it seems like something he would be interested in.
On Thu, Dec 21, 2017 at 4:06 PM Darren Shea <darr...@ecpi.com> wrote:
Well, I certainly understand that cheap and flexible tend to be
opposites, which is why I would think the best way to do what I
suggested would be to make the module a pricier option, not a
default. A multi-purpose tool has the potential to be more useful to
a wider range of people than something which is practically a
uni-tasker. Having to shut off all the APs on a RackInjector to
replace one is not fun – having to perform surgery on a deployed
RackInjector while 7 fully-functional APs have to be shut off during
the process is even less so.____
____
Even as an internal add-on card with a bunch of cables to each of
the jumper blocks could be a major factor in deciding how to
build-out a new site. Front-swappable might also work (maybe each
card could be in a drawer-like setting with a front-accessible screw
or two to lock it down most of the time) if we’re keeping the
jumpers for cost. Just brainstorming…____
____
____
*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *George Skorup
*Sent:* Thursday, December 21, 2017 3:32 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Remote generator start options packetflux?____
____
Do you want PacketFlux injectors to cost what CMMs and CTMs do? No.
And neither does Forrest.
We've done several radio swaps year after year. I take a spare
SyncInjector/PowerInjector/RackInjector/whatever and swap it.
Yes, it would have been cool to see the cards for the RackInjector
be easily front swappable like storage on a server. Again,
complexity and cost.____
On 12/21/2017 2:40 PM, Darren Shea wrote:____
Forrest,____
That’s really interesting – am I jumping to conclusions, or does
that modular design of the underlying architecture mean it would
be possible to design a module which would replace the jumper
options on the current RackInjector with a fully controllable,
web-accessible, interface? Honestly, that’s the only reason we
haven’t deployed ours – the fact we are mixing PMP450 and
450i/450m APs and ePMP 1000 and 2000 APs means that having to
partially disassemble the RackInjector to change an AP is a
statistically likely and pretty daunting task. Having a module
to give the programmable flexibility of a LMG CTM-2M, for
instance, without having to remove the unit from the rack, open
up the case, and move around jumpers when switching AP types
would be a big thing…____
____
Thanks,____
__n__Darren____
____
*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Forrest
Christian (List Account)
*Sent:* Thursday, December 21, 2017 9:57 AM
*To:* af
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Remote generator start options
packetflux?____
____
I'd like to explain where we are in the grand scheme of
things. Getting the rackinjector out the door took pretty
much all of our R&D engineering for the last year or so. BUT...
there's a reason for this, and it is related to the technology
which is underpinning the web interface on that device. And
which is related to our fairly near-term future as far as
packetflux goes...____
____
The architecture underneath the rackinjector control system is
far more layered and abstracted than it would need to be to
provide just the web interface. Every piece of data is
abstracted into a generic data format inside the unit, and the
system is designed in a way to greatly simplify the addition of
additional features. The overriding idea is an on-site system
which is able to gather up status from the entire site and also
be able to control an entire site. ____
____
To sort of give you a glimpse, in the rackinjector, there is a
module for gathering up data from a NMEA GPS stream (GPS lock
status, etc), a separate module for measuring the timing of the
PPS pulses, a separate module for the analog digital
controllers, another module to pull data from sitemonitor
expansions (the expansion cards in the rackinjector are running
the same underlying protocol as the sitemonitor expansion cards
are today), and so on. Each of these modules pull data from
their information source and makes it available in a generic
manner to the system. For instance, the number of satellites
in view is accessed in exactly the same way internally as a
voltage reading. This abstraction allows me to add additional
modules to pull data quickly - all I have to do is to create a
chunk of code to pull data from say a solar charge controller or
pull values via SNMP from a radio. The difficulty varies of
course based on how hard it is to access the data, but it's a
lot easier than writing an entire stack for each device.____
____
Today the rackinjector is running what we call internally the
"DeviceManager" code on top of this. Generally what this is is
a purpose-built web interface which is built on the underlying
architecture. The web-interface actually pulls the data it
needs from the underlying system using another generic chunk of
code so it is relatively easy for us to add additional fields
and support for additional devices. The "DeviceManager SNMP"
module allows quick development of SNMP mibs again for specific
purpose appliances. There's a few other tricks coming as
well. Our intent with this code base is to build a set of
specific-purpose appliances to pull data largely from one device
or a couple of devices and provide it in a simplified manner to
the user. For instance a Solar Charge controller monitor. Or
a RackInjector controller. The key point here is that the
DeviceManager codebase is designed largely to hide all of this
from the end-user, while making it easy for us to build these
products quickly.____
____
Now, back to the main point: This same flexible architecture
permits us to also build various automated control systems on
top of the same underlying architecture. If you replace the
fixed-function devicemanager interface with a programmable,
scriptable, flexible interface, all sorts of things start to
happen. Including all of the items we're discussing in this
thread. We already sell all of the physical interfaces needed
to get a generator controller running - you can plug a
unregulated power supply into a voltage input to get a rough
idea of the AC voltage, or can get the DC voltage using another
voltage input. You have contact closures in the form of
another sitemonitor expansion module. And so on. What is
missing is some sort of on-site automation, and that's where
we've been heading with this entire architecture for about 2
years now.____
____
I don't know how quickly this is going to happen. The next 30
days I'm focused on 'finishing' the rackinjector - meaning
shipping the cambium sync cards and the new 'either polarity'
cards, and getting a new firmware out for it which has the
"Devicemanager SNMP" code running in it. Once that is done we
can re-focus on how to prioritize the future of this
architecture.____
____
____
On Thu, Dec 21, 2017 at 7:40 AM, Dave <dmilho...@wletc.com>
wrote:____
Forrest,
We had a discussion about this as we now have 4 generators and I
have 3 of your standby controllers taking care of
these sites without issue since we installed them.
Would it be feasible to just remove the Transformers and just
give a link for separate purchase ?
My issue as with many would like to see a box with many inputs
to monitor different things like AC,DC voltages, tempatures
make and brake contacts. Also, the need for active outputs to
turn on off things or just for a cycle with timer.
A nice gui would be ok to be able to log in for manual control
or configuration.
There are some very expensive things out there to do all of this
but I know with a little work it can be done with out much money
involved.
I have a very specific need to integrate a 26vDC generator with
a site that is a 48v plant. I have everything installed and
connected but I need some
automation to start and stop when needed.
The generator has a voltage sense on its output to detect if the
battery bank is below 22vdc and if so it will kick on for an
amount of time to restore
charge. The problem with this is there is a 1000W converter
between it and the 48v battery bank.
Anyone with suggestions is welcome
Dave
____
On 12/21/2017 03:18 AM, Forrest Christian (List Account)
wrote:____
The short version: I never sold that many, and this
particular product came up in discussions about product
liablity insurance. Not that it was unsafe, just that there
was some discomfort with the fact that I was monitoring the
AC power line. To remedy this I would have either had to
redesign to remove the AC monitoring hardware, or send the
whole thing through UL listing. Based on the volume, I
didn't really see any reason to spend a lot of R&D time or
money doing either.____
____
I do expect the functionality in the generator controller
will be able to be replicated as a side effect of planned
technology to be incorporated in an upcoming product. ____
____
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 8:23 PM, Lewis Bergman
<lewis.berg...@gmail.com> wrote:____
Bummer. Guess there was not enough demand or to make
variants? ____
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 5:18 PM George Skorup
<george.sko...@cbcast.com> wrote:____
Yeahbut Forrest doesn't make the generator control
board anymore.____
____
On 12/20/2017 5:01 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:____
I think packetflux is likely the easiest with
the most to offer our of the box. I know if one
other out of the box solution that cost about 3
times as much. First can not only start it but
he can use his shunt to make sure it is actually
started and producing current.____
If you want to do it yourself you could work
some coding and such but it doesn't sound like
that is what you want to do. Arduino, raspberry
pi, etc. Could do this but you have to build it
all yourself. Not really fast but fun if you
like that kind of thing.____
You would need some electronics knowledge if you
don't want to spend a few days googling. I guess
you still have to know enough to make Google
work.____
Again, see Forest for his genset setup. I know a
lot of people in this list use it.____
____
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017, 4:39 PM Eric Kuhnke
<eric.kuh...@gmail.com> wrote:____
assuming you have a generator that does
auto-choke and is wired for electrical
remote start, like the small generac units
sold for RV use and similar... where all you
need to do is turn on a relay for 4-5
seconds to crank a starter, then turn off
the relay again. ____
____
one of these:
http://tinycontrol.pl/en/lan-controller/____
____
and one of these:
http://tinycontrol.pl/en/relays-board-10a-v3/____
____
or a thing like this:
http://denkovi.com/ethernet-relay-card-5-channels-snmp-http-xml-real-time-clock-din-box____
____
____
there are quite a few different DIN mount
relay-controllers with basic http interfaces
to turn on and off things. Some support
things like receiving an snmp trap to
trigger a relay for automated scripting. ____
____
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 2:30 PM, Brandon
Yuchasz <li...@gogebicrange.net> wrote:____
We are looking at adding a remote start to a
generator at an off grid site we have and I
am gathering information on options at this
point. ____
____
Right now we are all Solar at the site. It’s
a new site and if / when we draw down
batteries beyond where we are comfortable we
turn go to the site turn off the PV and
start a generator manually and run a 48v
battery charger on the bank. It’s a fairly
low tech solution right now. We log in turn
off the PV array and a guy goes out and
pulls the rope on the generator and
batteries start to charge. He then leaves
and in three hours generator runs out of
fuel and charging stops. Log back in turn
the PV back on and that’s the end of the
process. ____
____
We are considering a few different options
at the site and I don’t want to complicate
this to much by offering to much information
to start. Ill go into more details later but
for now I am looking for a way to start a
(different) propane generator remotely
during the dark months. Most likely once a
week in December and January. ____
____
So assuming electric start is an options on
the generator. What options do I have for
throwing that “switch” from the office. I am
positive I am not the first one of us to
want to do this.____
____
Thoughts everyone? I want to KISS so when I
am not around others can do this with
minimal training.____
____
Thanks,____
Brandon____
____
____
____
____
____
-- ____
*Forrest Christian*/CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc./____
Tel: 406-449-3345 <tel:(406)%20449-3345> | Address: 3577
Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
<https://maps.google.com/?q=3577+Countryside+Road,+Helena,+MT+59602&entry=gmail&source=g>____
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com
<http://www.packetflux.com/>____
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/fwchristian>
<http://facebook.com/packetflux>
<http://twitter.com/@packetflux>____
____
--
____
____
____
-- ____
*Forrest Christian*/CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc./____
Tel: 406-449-3345 <tel:(406)%20449-3345> | Address: 3577
Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
<https://maps.google.com/?q=3577+Countryside+Road,+Helena,+MT+59602&entry=gmail&source=g>____
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com
<http://www.packetflux.com/>____
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/fwchristian>
<http://facebook.com/packetflux>
<http://twitter.com/@packetflux>____
____
