> > I challenge you to describe something in a foreign language that can’t be > formulated in English? If necessary, I will just incorporate whatever > foreign word you say into English to make sure I win! Obviously every > language is English, right?
I'm glad you see my point. If you want to say such-and-such technical subject isn't mathematical, sorry, the game is rigged. The word "mathematics" is inherently inclusive of such things by definition. So who should design projects in CS, Mathematicians or Computer > Scientists? Should the point of view used to define a program depend on CS > concerns like efficiency, the real world etc or should it depend on > theoretically perfect Mathematical constructs? Definitely Computer Scientists should write code, not Mathematicians. (I've seen some awful examples firsthand, unfortunately.) Just because we use their tools doesn't mean they know the subject material. The theoretically perfect mathematical constructs are the basis for what we do, but practical experience is necessary for anyone to succeed at anything nontrivial, and CS is certainly nontrivial. I just don’t think we get our due respect! I'm not arguing here! But that doesn't negate the fact that computation is inherently mathematical, either. On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 9:53 PM, David Clark <cla...@rccconsulting.com>wrote: > I challenge you to describe something in a foreign language that can’t be > formulated in English? If necessary, I will just incorporate whatever > foreign word you say into English to make sure I win! Obviously every > language is English, right?**** > > ** ** > > So who should design projects in CS, Mathematicians or Computer > Scientists? Should the point of view used to define a program depend on CS > concerns like efficiency, the real world etc or should it depend on > theoretically perfect Mathematical constructs?**** > > ** ** > > I am not trying to play “one up man ship” on Mathematics!**** > > ** ** > > Like Rodney Dangerfield, I just don’t think we get our due respect!**** > > ** ** > > David Clark**** > > ** ** > > PS Does it matter if you don’t feel slighted or not? Does your data point > negate my argument?**** > > ** ** > > *From:* Aaron Hosford [mailto:hosfor...@gmail.com] > *Sent:* January-07-13 6:51 PM > > *To:* AGI > *Subject:* Re: [agi] Why Logic & Maths Have Sweet FA to do with Real > world reasoning**** > > ** ** > > To an extent, I agree. Computer Science requires math in the same way that > Physics requires math. You can't do either without it, but neither is > merely math.**** > > ** ** > > However, I challenge you to name one computational construct which cannot > be formulated in mathematics. Mathematics could be looked at as a > technical, symbolic language, like any programming language, but this > wouldn't quite be correct. In fact, mathematics is the union of all such > technical, symbolic languages, plus the axiomatic truths which can be > expressed in them, which means that if you invent a subject technical > enough to require its own symbolic language but which isn't covered my > mathematics, mathematics will shortly spread to include it by nature of its > definition.**** > > ** ** > > I am a CS "specialist", and a mathematics enthusiast. I am not demeaned in > the slightest by the statement that all computation can be expressed > mathematically, anymore than a physicist is demeaned by stating that all > physics can be expressed mathematically. It's the truth, but it doesn't > mean that if you know math, you know CS or Physics, because each of those > fields has its own truths that don't come automatically with the language > used to express them.**** > > ** ** > *AGI* | Archives <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now> > <https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/23050605-2da819ff> | > Modify<https://www.listbox.com/member/?&;>Your Subscription > <http://www.listbox.com> > ------------------------------------------- AGI Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/21088071-f452e424 Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=21088071&id_secret=21088071-58d57657 Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
