Finally, I'll be answering you..
As I said, maybe we're in a vicious circle, people grew tired from reading
endless discussions on the ML, and they stopepd working.. I remember when
I first joined in, there was Alvaro, burger, and me.. and the instructions
were simple "do whatever you like", there was no discussions, no nothing,
we did what we felt was right... but then of course, when we were more
than 3 devels, it became impossible, and discussions over the ML were
necessary, maybe that's what slowed people down...
In my case, I'm really busy, I have work, school, and in my free time, I
prefer to be with my girlfriend. I just finished my exams this week, and I
might be able to get some more free time now (when my gf will be at work,
I'll be home.. and *maybe* I will feel like coding instead of feeling like
watching a movie). So basically, it's time..
when it's not time (yes, if you want to, you can always find the time, but
then you see the person you love, next to you, being bored, all alone, can
you really leave her there for some code???), it's motivation... I don't
like fixing bugs (I never did, even in the beginning, I did new feats, and
Alvaro fixed the bugs, hehe), most of the new features now are not stuff
that I would use, so I'm not interested, also, I begin to be bored from
tcl/tk, and most of the new feats to implement require you waste a lot of
time trying to do them inside really messy code.. you waste more time
trying to understand the code than coding itself.. and once it's done,
it's another trip to hell in order to add the appropriate GUI options...
also, I can't do GUI stuff, I'm really bad at it, so it can only be core
feats.. not always easy to do.. I could also do the difficult stuff, like
RE-ing something or sniffing, etc.. but if I begin, I KNOW I won't be able
to go to bed until I finish, and with work, you can't afford to do that..
also, I need to rest alot during my free time and the weekends so I don't
waste to waste even more time on that..
Add to it that I spend the whole day working on a pc, when I get home, I
usually don't want to code again...
And finaly, another reason is that it is well known that you should only
have one task : admin or developer.. if you *give orders* and code at the
same time, it will end up being a real mess, so I usually try to do the
design, give the ideas, the implementation, but not code (you notice that
probably in my many replies to amsn-commits with "do it this way" while I
don't do the code (even if I have it working, I send it by email), I
already had problems when trying to manage a project I was part of the
coding staff for... so when I code something, I prefer it to be something
that I'm sure noone else will code...
that's about it for my own personal reasons.. I'll answer your individual
questions below like billiob did, with short lines (I hope:P)
On Tue, 09 May 2006 11:36:32 -0400, Boris Faure (aka billiob)
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
2006/5/7, Jérôme Gagnon-Voyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
What is going on here???
Did I missed something on the IRC?
Yes, you missed me being praised as a hero :D
It seems like almost nobody seems to care about aMSN anymore. Where
is billiob?
I'm here ! and on IRC. I was coding a plugin that i'll release next
WE. I do care about aMSN ! As you know, i never coded a lot!
May be it's time to know what is going on. Why do you think I want to
leave? School finished and I asked myself...hey what can I
do...hmm....what should I do? What are the goals for 0.96? What part
of aMSN do we want to improve? WHERE ARE WE GOING?
The TODO-List is not long, but too hard for me :( I've searched the
thing about non fully compliant WM and linflash, but it gave me no
interesting answers.
Yes, I know, we never set goals for 0.96, and that is my fault (I guess),
I never had the motivation to do it, write a proper TODO list like we had
for 0.95.. maybe it looks like we have no goals because we are in a state
much different from 0.95 release period, but this 0.96 release was not
supposed to be here, it was supposed to be a 0.95.1 bugfix release, the
bugfixes becomes small features, small features become a lot of stuff
being done, but no real roadmap.. it's not a problem.. but lately, I've
been working with vivia on this, we had a todo list for 0.96, we're trying
to set it up, she never wanted to temporarly manage that todo list, so I
had to do it (at last!) but as you said.. noone answered (STILL NOONE
ANSWERED???)
where are we going? We should have released 0.96 two weeks ago (or 1 week?
I can't remember), vivia is waiting for more input on the proxy setup, and
she has I think 3 items that need to be done, she took care of everything
(great job there!), for each task she had someone working on it (asking
each one privately on msn), so we had "this is what we want, XXXX will do
it, and it will be done in YY weeks". I don't know exactly what's the
status for that, but we're really close to 0.96.. I didn't want to
publicly announce it because I know users will complain for being even one
day late...
I think somewhere near next week or in 2 weeks, the 0.96 RC1 will be
released, we planned on an RC1 and RC2, I don't think we'll go to RC3, but
we never know.. at that point, 0.96 will be released, an improved version
with many bugfixes... and once it's done, we'll have a "real new version",
we'll enter that cycle with detailed, specific goals, tasks assigned to
each one (vivia and I are maintaining the task tracker on SF), with
deadlines, etc...
NOWHERE!
Don't tell me you don't have time or something, we just stoped
because we had no motivation. Some commited only by obligation.
Without Vivia doing the "ground" work, there's nothing going on here.
You're right. If Vivia had not joined the team, i don't know if we
would still write and read this ML, or maybe you would have send this
electric shock before.
it's nto about the ML, it's about the commits.. vivia did a great job
there.. but maybe if she didn't join people would stop thinking "ohh,
vivia will do it" and would actually do something! :P
Remember 0.95? We all knew what we wanted for the release. It was
taking a long time but A LOT OF WORK was done.
What was done 0.96? A slider for the webcam viewer......? Yeah? Was
that the big goal for 0.96?
there were a lot of improvements, the main reason for 0.96 is the fix for
the proxy support, the current 0.95 version wil lnot work with proxies,
and vivia fixed it for 0.96, and it's a critical issue which is why we're
going to release 0.96 sooner than expected.
Remember 0.95? The todo updated by everybody, all the bugreports
verified, when Youness first talked about the release, there was a
LOT of activity here. Like before every release.
And now Youness send a message about 0.96....NOBODY ANSWER!!! WE
DON'T CARE!!!
I ask for help about aMSN on Intel Mac...hey without that the Mac
version of aMSN is GONE!!!!. NOBODY ANSWER!! NOBODY CARE!!!
I can't help you on that, sorry.
yeah, seems everyone is fed up.. we need new faces, new people.. like
vivia, and I'm planning on adding two new members who I think deserve
their place as team members.. but they don't know it yet :p
So start telling what is your problem and may be we can try to fix
that. But it seems like right now nobody care and nobody is
motivated, there MUST be a reason.
These are mine
-I don't know where are we going
No, there are plenty of ideas.
The TODO in the wiki was updated btw...
-No leadership
We miss you. And Youness stopped his dictature that was useful in fact !
lol, yeah, my dictature.. thx :p yeah, we miss you J, and the reason why
I'm not leading anymore is because, as I said, I quit... if I have to lead
the team again, It will take too much of my time, and I don't want to go
back to that state, I had to make so much sacrifices, and leading amsn
become a real burden, really stressful, no more fun.. now that I have less
responsabilties, I'm able to contribute without sacrificing my own life.
This is why I stopped... I thought you'd take over my lead, but you're
going too, so this leaves... euhh.. noone :p
-No direction
I think we need to release 0.96 as soon as possible. It's a burden for us
yes, and that's what we'll do...
-Big time lost on silly things and silly discussions
If you're talking about the GUI, you're wrong. But it's because we're
used too long mails (thanks Youness :D)
lol, no, he's talking about all discussions.. and I agree to that.. we
need to start coding and stop talking.. and as this GUI thread showed us
today, and as Alvaro said, which enlightened all of us, "code it, do it,
commit, THEN if people complain, let's argue and we'll see if the code
needs to be changed".
Don't bother answering if it's just to tell "hey...I had an homework
to finish for yesterday", when we are motivated, we always find time.
I'm sitting for my most important exams but i have free time during this
period.
yes, but if I get motivated, I find the time, and I cut off my legs... (==
sacrifice other stuff...)
If i'm just out of track, just tell me, may be i'm alone to see a big
problem here, may be everything is perfect.
You're right : it's not perfect, but not as dead as you said.
We need to release and start working on huge goals that keep us in right
way.
yes, we're far from being perfect.. it looks dead ,but it's not as dead as
you said...
but I can't agree with billiob, yes, we need goals, specific goals,
interesting stuff to do... but not huge goals, it's known that huge goals
always end up incomplete, and forgotten..
look at the new preferences window, the new contact list, the second new
contact list... we need goals, even if they are small, we need goals.. and
if they are interesting, that would be better.
Now, I hope I answered your question Jerome, and I hope you're feeling
better, you looked quite pissed off in that mail.. hehe, anywyas, take
care, and I hope you all the best.
KaKaRoTo
Greetings
--
Boris FAURE (aka billiob)
mail, msn : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
No trees were killed in the sending of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly agitated.
-------------------------------------------------------
Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job
easier
Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache
Geronimo
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid0709&bid&3057&dat1642
_______________________________________________
Amsn-devel mailing list
[email protected]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel
--
KaKaRoTo
-------------------------------------------------------
Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security?
Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier
Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo
http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid0709&bid&3057&dat1642
_______________________________________________
Amsn-devel mailing list
[email protected]
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/amsn-devel
