On Sun, Nov 3, 2019 at 20:52 scott <sc...@solarnetone.org> wrote: > > > On Sun, 3 Nov 2019, Martin Hannigan wrote: > > > > > > > Bootp, AAA, dhcp? MSO, MNO? Been happening for a long time already. > > pardon, we are talking about leasing to someone not operating a network, > hence the "non-connected systems in the draft title". > nobody has a problem with upstream provided addresses via a standard dhcp > "lease".
The point was landlords have always been here. This is nothing new. Speaking of air gaps. SIPRNet? > Admittedly, this is a twist. However, its a cost saving measure for those > > who need it and have a real use. > > How is this cheaper than addresses provided by upstream? Granted, it can > be costly to roll your own routing infrastructure on addresses allocated > to you from the RIR, particularly if you don't have the technical chops to > do it yourself. That said, you are going to have to announce your > "leased" address space somehow anyway. > Tried getting a /24 from a paid upstream lately? As long as the addresses are used in a network legitimately, I’m good. We should define only who gets credit for use. Maybe. Best, -M< > > Cost wise, its effective. While I agree > > the business model may be less desired to some, the outcome is legit. > > > > The question could be about accurate tallying of utilization. > > > > Best, > > > > -M< > > > > > > > > On Sun, Nov 3, 2019 at 17:58 scott <sc...@solarnetone.org> wrote: > > IMHO, we should do everything we can to prevent "internet > > landlords." > > Further, I do not see a legitimage use case problem that is > > solved by > > allowing leasing that is not solved by upstream provided > > address space, or > > barring that, 4.10 of the NRPM. If we want to enable spammers, > > attack > > networks, and other bad actors, then leasing is for sure a > > great solution > > for them, and the "internet slumlords" that would provide their > > resources. > > > > Scott > > > > On Sun, 3 Nov 2019, Martin Hannigan wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Nov 2, 2019 at 10:30 PM Owen DeLong <o...@delong.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > [ clip ] > > > > > > However, what I do not want to see is a situation where > > we > > > permit the desire to lease space as a justification for > > > obtaining space through the transfer market (or > > > any other mechanism). If you want to leas space you already > > have, > > > then fine. But the desire to lease space in and of itself > > should not > > > qualify as “utilization” or > > > “need” in evaluation of any form of resource request. > > > > > > > > > > > > Needs a little more clarify for me. Either the lessor or > > lessee has a right > > > to use the numbers as justification? The lessee may be the > > logical party, > > > but seems less likely to be in the transfer market. However, > > if they are > > > leasing numbers they may have legitimate need. On the other > > hand, if a > > > lessor has a ratio like an ISP or other provider using > > numbers in an > > > aggregated manner _and_ the lessee can't use the lease as > > justification for > > > transfers, that would seem to be inline with current > > practice. I do think > > > legitimately "in use" addresses should be eligible for "need" > > credit. Isn't > > > the idea that "access" is being facilitated by providing the > > numbers? You > > > can use RFC 1918 address space as a justification for need > > and the numbers > > > are technically "not connected". I'm thinking source nor > > business model > > > should matter, but that we're careful who is getting credit > > for them. Just > > > saying that made me wonder if this is even worth addressing. > > > > > > Feels like it is more sensible to allow the both to > > demonstrate use as a > > > justification and let ARIN process sort it out. > > > > > > $0.02 > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > -M< > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
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