Hi Mayur:
Good to hear from you.
But before we go on to a serious issue, like the idea of a
referendum, or plebiscite , let us see if we can close the loop on
open issues here, like your
assessment of the people of Assam, such as emotionally
immature/illogical, violent /murderous, so on and so forth, and how
you arrived at those conclusions.
>I swear you are an amazing bundle of contradictions.
*** That may have some merit. But IF it does, it is a response to
equally, if not more pronounced contradictions that you presented. I
can detail them here, but in order move on, I will forgo that for the
moment. But should you want an explanation, feel free to ask, I will
be pleased to comply :-).
*** Now then, do you continue to believe in the methodology and
analyses of the kind you employed to assess those qualities of the
people of Assam that you listed the other day? And then use those
assessments to find solutions for the issues you see as
problems?
Why it is important to pin down, is that solution to
'problems' are dependent to correct definition of the problems. If
it is vague, if it is faulty, the solution prescriptions would be
too.
>At one place, you don't think twice to lambast me and
ridicule my exercise and again, at another place you
>want my endorsement of your perspective.
*** Does that surprise you? It should not have. Because none of
us are forever imprisoned to either the 'right' camp or the 'wrong'
camp. One can be right on some issues and wrong on others. I
can see the notion was difficult for you to either comprehend or
accept.That could also explain some of your previous comments. But I
hope my explanation helps you with coming to terms with this seemingly
unfathomable dichotomy :-).
> Otherwise you will accuse me of exhibiting some sloppy emotions to drive >home a fact.
*** Would that be out of place for a 'kharkhowa', as might
be inferred from your assessments of our 'jaati' :-)?
>Jumping at the prospect of holding a plebiscite is
>simply preposterous.
*** Here you confound me again. But reading on, it appears
as though you have had the wrong idea about what the word
preposterous means. I attempted to place a possibly missed
not in front of it. But that did not read right, considering your
far above the average command of the English language.
>For me it is as simple as denying
the possibility of divorce to one's spouse when he or
>she is not happy with marriage.
*** But that is nothing uncommon , neither in the Indian context,
nor in certain Roman Catholic communities, and who knows where
else?
>It is nothing but pure slavery.
*** It might not be THAT bad, but sure does come close.
>Of course no one prevents us to make an
effort to change things we don't like. But efforts
>should be pragmatic ans should not be driven by pure
emotions.
*** Words of the wise no doubt!
So what is it Mayur? is the idea of of a referendum a good one
or a preposterous ( grotesquely amusing) one :-)?
Once we settle this primary confusion, we may be able to
look into it further and see if the idea could be examined in more
detail, and perhaps support for it generated, assuming you are
for it.
>Another possibility of their apparent
>disinterest may be you might have scared them enough
earlier.
*** You maybe right here Mayur. I do have a knack for instilling
fear among my
peers. What with my sympathies for ULFA and 'deep-rooted hatred
of Indians' :-)?
>But Mahanta da, be ready to get shocked. The situation
>in J&K is quite different than that of Assam.
*** No kidding! You have to give some warning before you drop
these bombshell revelations. The last check-up showed my ticker is in
good shape, but hey, at my age, I have to be careful about
sudden and unanticipated news like you break here. I have pretensions
to being around for a few more years you know:-)?
> You canalso tell those India fed Editors to take a vote
among the
>readers on the issue.
*** I admire your faith Mayur.
> However, for that also, subjective benchmark is a must.
Presently for Assam, >which is the bigger problem directly
affecting common people at villages?
*** Uh-huh! I admire your feelings for them poor Oxomiya folks
from the villages. A man after my own heart. But before I answer your
question, why don't you tell us what your determination is, with a
short explanation of how you came to that conclusion? Go ahead use
your subjective benchmark. I won't complain anymore.
For one thing, mine will be a long list, a litany of grievances
that you wished you had not asked for. What is more that my list is
not exclusive for the poor villagers only, seemingly the exclusive
domain of your deeply felt concerns. Mine will address all those who
do not have the luxury of talking down to their fellow men who have
not made it, gaonlia and nogoriya alike :-).
Best to you and more later.
cm
At 12:35 AM -0700 9/20/05, mayur bora wrote:
Dear Mahanta Da
I swear you are an amazing bundle of contradictions.
At one place, you don't think twice to lambast me and
ridicule my exercise and again, at another place you
want my endorsement of your perspective. What kind of
support a person without 'fundamental
analytical/inferential skills' can provide to you ?
Anyway I am just joking. Otherwise you will accuse me
of exhibiting some sloppy emotions to drive home a
fact.
Jumping at the prospect of holding a plebiscite is
simply preposterous. For me it is as simple as denying
the possibility of divorce to one's spouse when he or
she is not happy with marriage. You can't shackle
anyone to any position by force. It is nothing but
pure slavery. But the pertinent point is one should
have balanced outlook to life to accept things as
they come. Of course no one prevents us to make an
effort to change things we don't like. But efforts
should be pragmatic ans should not be driven by pure
emotions. Why don't you start the exerise among the
net users probably by giving them a quistionnaire ?
You may also give them scope for justifying their
position in respect of a particular point. You are
telling about poor responses from the netters on the
issue earlier. Now in the light of the possibility of
negotiation with PCG, netters' interest may be
ignited. Another possibility of their apparent
disinterest may be you might have scared them enough
earlier. Of course I don't know. You are the best
judge.
But Mahanta da, be ready to get shocked. The situation
in J&K is quite different than that of Assam. You can
also tell those India fed Editors to take a vote among
the readers on the issue. But I want to add one more
issue. However, for that also, subjective benchmark is
a must. Presently for Assam, which is the bigger
problem directly affecting common people at villages?
The issues raised by insurgents or insurgeny itself ?
Let us disuss the entire gamut of issues in an
objetive and dispassionate way to come to a somewhat
realistic and workable solution.
Bye for now.
Mayur
Chandigarh
--- Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Mayur:
>
> > >I am sure you can not be
> >serious when you attribute a politically motivated
> >backdoor campaign behind my purely academic
> exerise.
>
>
> *** First off, you must be joking about the
> 'academic' exercise here.
>
> You cite an incident of a 'noted intellectual'
> manhandled by a mob to
> assert the entire Oxomiya Jaati's 'intellectual
> immaturity', of being
> 'emotional' instead of being 'logical', because the
> mob did not
> oppose it.
>
> It is very clear that some fundamental
> analytical/inferential skills
> are missing here to conduct even an ordinary
> 'xaak-khowa',
> 'bhaat-khowa' discussion, 'juhalor-mel' style, far
> less an academic
> exercise.
>
> While I might have given you the benefit of a doubt,
> all your
> political sloganeering focusing on the insurgency in
> Assam leaves
> little doubt as to what your real intention here is,
> and I stand by
> my previous characterization of it, your
> protestations of 'academic'
> exercises not-withstanding.
>
> *** However, I would like to make it clear here,
> that a political
> discussion or debate is not out-of-bounds here. That
> is what we
> engage in most of the time. But those of us who do,
> most of us
> anyway, do not try to present those as some
> 'academic' exercise or
> package it as some other thing. We know better than
> to
> do that. It requires some courage of conviction, but
> most people do
> have enough of it to present them forthrightly. Had
> you approached it
> in that manner, you would have no trouble , except
> that what Ram
> cautioned you about, that earful, might have come
> earlier, without
> all the preliminary niceties.
>
>
>
> > >Similar kind of event elsewhere would not have
> >generated same degree of approval from the people
> at
> >large. Here also, the difference will be in
> degrees.
> >But you don't believe in subjetive benhmark. That
> of
> >course is not a common problem.
>
>
> *** Your methodology and benchmark above is very
> interesting.
>
> >" Similar kind of event elsewhere would not have
> >generated same degree of approval from the people
> at large"
>
> Is this something you have learned from other such
> academic
> investigations, or did you just make it up as a
> convenient standard?
> Think about it a little more and see if you can
> justify the substance
> of your assumption. It is critical you do, because
> your credibility
> is tottering dangerously at the edge of a precipice.
>
>
> > >The way you address those Punjabis and Haryanvis
> >signifies your deep rooted hatred for them.
>
> *** I had no reason to think, thus far, that you
> don't read and
> comprehend well.
> But you make me wonder now. I wrote:
>
> "If I used your method to judge the people of
> Haryana, considering
> the 1984 Sikh pogroms or last month's incineration
> of sixty 'dalit'
> houses; I would call them nothing less than
> genocidal maniacs" and I
> went on ask " Would it be correct?" to do so, that
> is.
>
>
> And you translated that to proof of your
> determination above. If I
> were to be a lawyer, and were to be arguing a case
> in a court of law,
> I might have said at this point: "I rest my case
> your honor".
> Because, you proved, beyond a reasonable doubt, that
> your analytical
> and inferential skills are , well, how to put it
> nicely--how about
> 'work in progress'?
>
>
>
> > >I am ruthlessly forthright in this view and I
> want the
> >same from you. No beating around the bush please.
>
> *** Aren't we we being a bit redundant here ?
>
>
> > > Let
> >the inhabitants of Assam decide by plebiscite
> whether
> >they endorse the main demand of the ultras. For
> your
> >benefit, if you want, let the referendum be
> restricted
> >only to Assamese speakers. Do you have the courage
> to hear the
> >verdict from the >people ?
>
>
> *** You know Mayur, just when I was about to give up
> on you, you come
> up with a fine idea. In fact I argued, right here in
> assam-net, a
> number of times, in favor of this process. What
> could be more
> befitting for the second most populous country in
> the world, devoted
> to democracy ( albeit desi-demokrasy) than to put
> an end to all
> the speculations, spin and propaganda with a 'free
> and fair'
> election that India excels in ( never mind the BBC
> poll of yesterday
> as reported by ToI ) ? If I remember correctly, many
> political
> scientists favor it too, not to mention ULFA itself.
> But I tell you
> what, many of my net-opponents come up with all
> kinds of convoluted
> arguments against such an exercise. And the govt.
> fed newspaper
> editors get very vocal against it. Why do you think
> they are so
> afraid of it?
>
> No, no--let the non-Assamese speakers vote too, even
> though inclusion
> of the Hindi speakers would be a pushing it a bit
> too far. I don't
> know how the people of Assam feels about it, but I
> am cool with it.
>
>
> Thanks for giving me an opening here to demonstrate
> my 'courage'. I
> am with you all the way. Will you join me in
> attempting to sell the
> idea to our opposing friends here? Let me do the
> talking though. You
> just stand by me, and applaud at opportune moments.
> Our friends here
> are allergic to those fancy words and missed
> metaphors. Even though
> some of them don't like my ideas, they are OK with
> my plain-speaking,
> most of the time anyway.
>
>
> > >There is no point on harping what came first,
> once I
> >have accepted that step motherly treatment led to
> >widespread and genuine resentment against Delhi.
>
> *** Let us not go too far on this step-motherly limb
> Mayur. We have
> to be extremely careful here. See, this 'mai-baap'
> concept of Delhi
> is fraught with deadly consequences. That is where
> the real problem
> lies.
>
> Just imagine a scenario where Bharat Maiya sheds her
> 'step-motherly
=== message truncated ===
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