> >And make sure politicians cannot order them around-- by making the EXECUTIVE branch >INDEPENDENT of the legislative - the elected cadres.>>>
Last week some people called me to speak at a seminar organized at Guahati by a neutral group. Presiding was Sri. D.N.Chakravarty -some people brand him a Hindutva Lackey-I found him pleasently -a "I am for total Change" type.
I told this meet on ' WHAT SHOULD BE MEDIA'S ROLE NOW TO ENSURE A HEALTHY Electoral Process' I advised them to do following:
- Explain to the clueless voters that Nehru Co had this bogus document printed to ensure his eternal supremacy through a process of -Fools to Elect Bums-to preside over fat clerks. This is simply futile in 2006 .
- Suggest an alternative-Let the elected LEADERS(just1 vote more makes him that) should do just that = LEGISLATE.
- And in these days when India is going all out for E- EVERYTHING including surely E-Governance, these LEADERS should be allowed to draft more and more laws sitting at their constituency via E-mail.At least that will be a good collection of thoughtsof LEADERS.
- These LEADERS Should do a good job of LEGISLATING-and MUST BE kept away from polluted Guahati altogether.
mm
mm
Subject
From: Ram Sarangapani <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], ASSAMNET <assam@assamnet.org>
Subject: Re: [Assam] Reforms - The CONCLUSION
Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2006 17:24:59 -0600
C'da,
Just to keep things in prespective, this is what Priyankoo asked Himen da (to Himen da's statement)
** Do you have any plans or ideas how these people can be controlled or eliminated? If yes, then what have our previous generations been doing in the last 50 years to eliminate/ control those people?The sins of fathers ought not to be visited upon the sons :) What Priyankoo asked is legitimate, but in the present scenario seems like he is simply passing the buck from this generation to the previous one. And of course, the previous gen is also doing the same.
So, question is how do you expect the problem/s to be solved of we keep passing the buck around, with no solution in sight?
Now, lets get to what you are asking:
> everyone cries hoarse over, but are unable to figure out how to begin dealing >with. I asked you to offer your thoughts, those of you who ASSERT vehemently >that the prevailing Indian system is adequate to deal with it, on HOW you will >begin to that.
Again, since we haven't much agreement on any of these issues (dealing with them), let us assume we the desi-bhoktos don't have any answer.
I would like to ask again of you (those who see Assam's liberation as an end to all problems):
a) How do you propose to FREE Assam from the clutches of on evil India?
We would like practical, feasible proposals. Of course, you will have to assume all the realities, like
GOI doesn't care or is inept in resolving the issue
That the GOI is willing and very capable of thwarting any move for independence simply because of its sheer might and inept/adamant ministers and bureaucrats.
and
b) How do you convince the rest of the Assamese (who want to stay with India) to join hands with you?
Now, I will definitely understand if you do not want to answer these or give vague answers.
But if you seriously think these are impossibilites, then what is the next step for Assam?
Continue with insurgency
or work within the ambit of the Indian constitution (however broken it is?).I am eagerly awaiting a positive and practical response from you, C'da :) :)--Ram
On 1/13/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> At 1:12 PM -0600 1/13/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
> C'da
>
> >*** That is a fine idea. And I challenged the devotees of desi-demokrasy to do just that, very pointedly, a number of times: To show how >they would proceed with effecting the reforms they see as necessary under the prevailing system.
>
> Assume if you will for a moment that we 'devotees of desi-demokrasy' have no answers. But you anti-desi everything are the ones dishing out left and right about how Assam cannot prosper under 'Indian rule'
>
>
>
>
>
> Ram:
>
>
> I took one littler area: Of corruption in public life, one that everyone seems to agree on, and one that
> everyone cries hoarse over, but are unable to figure out how to begin dealing with. I asked you to offer your thoughts, those of you who ASSERT vehemently that the prevailing Indian system is adequate to deal with it, on HOW you will begin to that. I asked for no minutiae, no details--that would be unfair to ask, because we are all amateurs -- just offer a conceptual solution approach.
>
>
> What did you come up with? What did Rajen? What did Himendra Thakur have to offer in response to
> Priyankoo's question?
>
>
>
>
> Fact is, if you had even anything, you would have laid it down on me like sand bags.
>
>
> But we do know why, because you too know the real truths, but are unable to acknowledge them. Is that NOT the truth Ram?
>
>
> c-da
>
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>
>
> What we would all like to know is how you and others intend to get Assam out from under this 'yoke'?
> Lets set aside slogans and emotions for a while, just tell us in very plain Ingrazi how do you propose in a very practical manner to free Assam? (we can get to the lofty plans for Assam post-independence)
>
> And if you cannot see a way out, what is the next best step for Assam?
> Continue with the insurgency?
> or do what we can to develop Assam within the present framework.
>
> If either of the above are impossible to achieve, then would a solution for Assam be to throw up our hands and declare in unison
> 'Upaai nai'
>
> --Ram
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/13/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> At 11:35 AM -0600 1/13/06, Rajen Barua wrote:
>
> >But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. "
>
>
>
>
> I think before we proceed on our debate, let us debate this. Is the above is a slogan or fact?
>
>
>
>
>
> *** That is a fine idea. And I challenged the devotees of desi-demokrasy to do just that, very pointedly, a number of times: To show how they would proceed with effecting the reforms they see as necessary under the prevailing system.
>
>
> The last time we went thru that exercise, Rajen Barua decided to play Dalai Lama and Ram went on and on, beating around the bush.
>
>
> But the challenge remains. Put up, or you-know-what!
>
>
> And I aim that challenge specifically to those who have lived in the USA or Britain for decades, and hopefully have, some clues, as to how democratic processes work. Those who have seen and experienced nothing but the dysfunctional desi-system, are exempt. Umesh is included. He gets an extra reprieve because he has been so disoriented.
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> cm
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> RB
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Ram Sarangapani
>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Cc: ASSAMNET
>
> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2006 10:47 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [Assam] Reforms - The CONCLUSION
>
>
>
> Umesh,
>
>
>
> Thats the wrong question for C'da. Look what he wrote:
>
>
>
> "Question is who will take charge of such reforms, NOW? The answer is that
>
> there are plenty of people, right in Assam--and outside too, to take it on. Ready, willing and able.
>
>
>
> But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. That is the difference."
>
>
>
> So, basically what he is saying is, yes we have all the capable people who are willing and able, BUT CANNOT do so because of the "Indian Rule"
>
>
>
>
> Obviously, what he means is that Assam will be in this state, until and unless Assam is free of India.
>
>
>
> But, practical people anywhere will tell you that for Assam to get out of "Indian rule" is next to impossible. Why?
>
>
>
> 1) Many Assamese itself DO NOT support independence or be outside of India. They think they are Indians.
>
> 2) ULFA or others have been trying for this for 25 + years
>
> 3) India will never give up an inch of its territory (inspite of various arguments and philosophies why "Indian domination" is bad/unwarranted/illegal).
>
>
>
> If those are the stark realities, what would reasonable people do to make the best of a bad situation?
>
>
>
> I think, they would work within this present system and try and do what they can for Assam, for its people, its development,and other problems.
>
>
>
> Sometimes I think this continuing insurgency is a big money-churner for many - politicians, GOI, GOA, ULFA, businesses and bureaucrats. Many people have the potential to make it big if there is a continuing instability - and of course damn the common folks of Assam. They do not fall into any equation.
>
>
>
> And, all we can say is "just you wait" :)
>
>
>
> --Ram da
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>
> On 1/13/06, umesh sharma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> C-da,
>
>
>
> You make a valid point about urgency of reform needed in Assam and also that there are people who can and are willing to take up. Who stops them? Is someone at Delhi bent on killing them or maiming them?
>
>
>
> Umesh
>
>
>
>
>
> C-da wrote:
>
>
>
> "If Rajen or your assertions are accurate that Assam is the most corrupt of the various colonies of India, then it behooves it needs those reforms, NOW! The sickest needs the treatments most urgently.
>
>
>
>
> Question is who will take charge of such reforms, NOW? The answer is that
>
> there are plenty of people, right in Assam--and outside too, to take it on. Ready, willing and able.
>
>
>
>
> But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. That is the difference."
>
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> Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Ram:
>
>
>
>
> One last time on these issues:
>
>
>
>
> >But you must agree that ANY reform in India or Assam MUST come from an informed >public.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *** Yes I do. And that is exactly why I asked for YOUR recommendations, Rajen's recommendations. But what did you show?
>
>
>
>
> Therefore it follows that Assam cannot depend on its intelligentsia establishment, the supposedly informed lot, the one that controls the media, the economy and the political machinery -- and even its purported cream of the crop of NRA's in the west.
>
>
>
>
> Certainly not on its uninformed, uneducated masses, struggling merely to survive against the incredible odds, while their assets, resources are being plundered and looted by India and partially being redistributed to a tiny minority of Assam's privileged.
>
>
>
>
> But that does not mean Assam ought to wait for India to effect the reforms that it had decades to start with and demonstrate a trend. It did did not, because it cannot. Assam will have to do it for itself. Take charge of its own future!
>
>
>
>
> You make the argument of other states prospering in spite of the dysfunctional Indian governance. And thus you demand the same from Assam.
>
>
>
>
> It is a preposterous argument. Imagine demanding an ill-fed, poor child of illiterate parents from the slums same performance as children of IAS Babus or Engineers or Doctors because they go ,to the same school. That is exactly what you are doing.
>
>
>
>
> Assam's circumstances are not the same as Karnataka's, or Tamil Nadu's or Bihar's. Assam must do what it needs to under its own circumstances, and not what Karnataka does or West Bengal does.
>
>
>
>
> Assam must REFORM and RE-order its governance for its own sake, because it is essential for its survival and progress, regardless of what India does or does not.
>
>
>
>
> And even if I were to accept your argument -- which I don't--that some Indian states are prospering in-spite of their broken governance, it still makes no sense for Assam to labor under it--because its circumstances does not give it that luxury. If Rajen or your assertions are accurate that Assam is the most corrupt of the various colonies of India, then it behooves it needs those reforms, NOW! The sickest needs the treatments most urgently.
>
>
>
>
>
> Question is who will take charge of such reforms, NOW? The answer is that
>
> there are plenty of people, right in Assam--and outside too, to take it on. Ready, willing and able.
>
>
>
>
> But they cannot do that under prevailing Indian rule. That is the difference.
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> c-da
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> At 1:54 PM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
>
> C'da
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >That Ram is called accountability. It is DETERRENCE
>
>
>
> I fully agree its a major component. The laws do exist for such punishment, and they would be implemented at a much faster speed if the 'public', the media and others are on top it it and expose corrupt individuals and till punishments are rendered. Jail time for those stealing public funds always existed. Politicians & the powerful have been able to thwart legal proceedings by employing corrupt practices and circumventing and undermining the system.
>
>
>
> With the resent cash for questions, the media having exposed these powerful politicians, they have been expelled. The CBI and the Auditor General's office are now contemplating civil actions against the culprits. At least the national media is keeping on top of it. And things are NOT that easy for the errant Delhi politician.
>
>
>
> > Remember when ULFA executed a few of those officials how Assam was all agog?. And I was >told -- it is second hand info, I was not there -- that there was a visible reduction of demands for >bribes and such
>
>
>
> Probably so, and goo too - but it didn't last long, did it? As soon as people found out that all the ULFA was trying to do was corner the market on thieving. All that did was replace the regular thieves with the 'patroitic' thieves for a while, till people found out the extent of their patriotism.
>
>
>
> But more importantly - even murdering a few corrupt did nothing to DETER corruption on a permanent basis, did it?
>
>
>
> >Undertake a major reform of the laws of the land. Throw most of them out.
>
>
>
> Good suggestion. Agreed. But do you also think such demands must come from a population who is uder the yoke? Why would you assume the corrupt to take it upon themselves to undertake such reforms and in the process kill the golden goose?
>
>
>
>
>
> Why can't the AASU, and the other various student bodies and the opposition and even ULFA make sure the corrupt get the message and in strong terms - or else. Where are these patriots when we need them? Why can't Assam's intellectuals and writers fill up the media with stories of corrupt and paste the photos of corrupt politicians and bureaucrats?
>
> Could you guess why nobody is interested?
>
>
>
> >Reform the court systems. Decentralize them. Give powers to resolve disputes to local bodies. >Let simple issues be decided according to traditional ways. Dispose of pending cases
>
> >and make sure cases get heard and resolved in a reasonable time frame.
>
>
>
> Again, a very good suggestion, I am all for it. Who will do the reforming? And why should there be any reform without suggestions coming from a silent population?
>
>
>
> >And make sure politicians cannot order them around-- by making the EXECUTIVE branch >INDEPENDENT of the legislative - the elected cadres.
>
>
>
> I have got to hand it to C'da - you are at your best, and that too all this without demands for independence.
>
> It is indeed a great idea. But you must agree that ANY reform in India or Assam MUST come from an informed public. A public that makes sure it is not a part of the problem, a public that has a long-term memory, a public that will not take it lying down, and a public that is willing to take to task by employing the media, public interest lawsuits, the voting machines and other forms of protests.
>
>
>
> The biggest fear of a politician is keeping the 'gadhi' and reelection. If the gadhi is at stake for small crimes, they sure as heck will become squeaky clean, real fast.
>
>
>
> >I am sorry to say this Ram: Your advice on this matter has no use for Assam, or India.
>
>
>
> Heh! heh! heh! C'da - what can I say, that is the best I can give - even on good days :)
>
>
>
> --Ram
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/2/06, Chan Mahanta <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> Ram,
>
>
>
>
> You repeated a whole bunch of vague generalities, hoping for some miracle to change attitudes. You did not have a single practical, achievable means to suggest, like a functioning governmental system MUST have.
>
>
>
>
> Let me give you another clue: What is happening to Tom DeLay? And what happened to that very powerful Rep. Dan Rostenskowski of Chicago? Or the Governor of Connecticut last year? If you don't know, the latter two are in prison. Why? Corruption in office.
>
>
>
>
> That Ram is called accountability. It is DETERRENCE. Accountability brings deterrence. Indian governance has no means for holding anyone accountable. There is no deterrence. Even if an official is prosecuted, he would live happily ever after knowing that he can keep delaying any action, even if it gets heard in his lifetime, until he is long gone.
>
>
>
>
> The other alternative is INSURGENTs' justice. Remember when ULFA executed a few of those officials how Assam was all agog?. And I was told -- it is second hand info, I was not there -- that there was a visible reduction of demands for bribes and such. People were all very supportive of ULFA's justice. But it is NOT a dependable system is it? And then came the Indian military, and now the military officers run drugs from Myanmar under official cover. Heard of that Ram?
>
>
>
>
> Or would you prefer partisan dictatorial rule a-la Indira Gandhi's Emergency, when corrupt officials without political cover all of a sudden turned law abiding, and trains were running on time?
>
>
>
>
> What you should have known and recommended were things like:
>
>
>
>
> Undertake a major reform of the laws of the land.
>
> Throw most of them out. There are too many now that empower corrupt
>
> officials and deter law abiding citizens.
>
> Reform the court systems. Decentralize them. Give powers
>
> to resolve disputes to local bodies. Let simple issues be
>
> decided according to traditional ways. Dispose of pending cases
>
> and make sure cases get heard and resolved in a reasonable time frame.
>
> Completely revamp police -- re-train them as SERVANTS of the people,
>
> not their bosses, empowered to dispense summary justice. Give them
>
>
>
> equipment, a salary to make a living without stealing, hire educated
>
> cadres who are able to investigate and aid prosecution. And make sure
>
> politicians cannot order them around-- by making the EXECUTIVE branch
>
> INDEPENDENT of the legislative - the elected cadres.
>
>
>
>
> That would bring the issue of making enlightened and effective
>
> enforceable laws. Indian election system does not allow that. Reform it
>
> to allow able people to get nominated, funded and elected.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> You catch my drift Ram?
>
>
>
>
> And if you could have shown how all these could be effected under Indian rule, your protestations would have carried some water. But you could not. I don't know whether you are really unaware of how it is done or you resorted to the pithy platitudes to justify your pre-determined answer. Neither is good.
>
>
>
>
> I am sorry to say this Ram: Your advice on this matter has no use for Assam, or India.
>
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> c-da
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> At 11:35 AM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
>
> C'da,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >That the govt. is inefficient, the people are corrupt. Only thing you did not repeat is that the >Assamese are lazy too
>
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>
>
> I am surprised. I have never said people are LAZY. You may have drawn some implications or confused me with someone else. But thats OK - I have had words put in my mouth before :)
>
>
>
>
> >About Govt. corruption.
>
>
>
>
> C'da - it is NOT just Govt. corruption. Corruption is all too pervasive, at least in the major cities and towns of Assam. It is come to such a pass, that nothing works till palms are greased. People take it in their stride and for granted. Cost of doing business?
>
> As for insurgents - who initially came out like Robin Hoods, turned out to be mostly hoods.
>
> Lastly, and the sad part is that Assam is often cited as a great example of inefficiency and corruption. While there is also corruption in other states, the levels are much, much lower, the govts. far more responsive to citizenry needs, and law & order is maintained pretty well in a number of states.
>
>
>
>
>
> >How do you see the citizenry deal with it?
>
>
>
>
> I have written before - my guess would be a drastic change in attitudes, viewing responsibilities, froming citizen groups (there are some already in Guwahati to deal with some problems, and they are having success), making sure politicains and the corrupt, and the inept are given full coverage in the media (like a Tehelka) and expose corrupt ministers and bureaucrats, and even elections - they work sometimes and a fresh set of ministers will be more careful in corrupt practices.
>
>
>
>
> But saying that its all the GOI's fault and the only salvation is some sort of severance is really not a solution .
>
> Once our house is in order, I am with you all the way to hold the GOI/Center to keep their end of the bargain and also teach them a thing or two about able governance.
>
>
>
>
> --Ram
>
>
>
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>
> And how will the good citizens deal with such a menace
>
>
>
>
> On 1/2/06, Chan Mahanta < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Ram:
>
>
>
>
> I am perfectly willing to go right along with you, and hold GoA's feet to the fire. But I don't know how. Just like all the other people in Assam that would like to do just that. That is why I asked you, I asked Rajen to show all these people complaining and rebelling and seeking to re-orient Assam governance and other such unpatriotic stuff.
>
>
>
>
> And so I was hoping for a no-nonsense action plan from you about how to go hold GoA's feet to the fire.
>
>
>
>
> All you gave us the same old same old. That the govt. is inefficient, the people are corrupt. Only thing you did not repeat is that the Assamese are lazy too and so deserve what they get. But that must have been a slip :-).
>
>
>
>
> Let me give you a little help here. Take the one subject no-one disgrees with here: About Govt. corruption.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> How do you see the citizenry deal with it?
>
>
>
>
> Surely they go to the polls, vote in great numbers, eliciting desi-demokrasy-devotees' cries of --see how democracy is working -- accolades.
>
>
>
> They even vote some them out, leading the political class ( not to mention NRA political observers) to declare -- SEE there is accountability, they get voted out. Was Indira Gandhi not voted out too?
>
>
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>
> But what good has that done about abating corruption?
>
>
>
>
> So tell us how an intelligent, well informed person like yourself, who has seen one of the best managed democracies in the world at work for decades, will go about holding GoA's feet to the fire, and take corruption on, USING the tools that desi-demokrasy gives you.
>
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> We shall be all ears! And if you cannot tell us, then face the fact that your protestations do not hold any water .
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> c-da
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> At 10:15 AM -0600 1/2/06, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
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> C'da,
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> >So, your gripe is with pointing fingers at GoI.
>
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>
>
> Not at all. But when we do so, it might be fair to point some of those fingers inward - toward Assam as well. We do need to have some sense of introspection.
>
>
>
>
> >But GoA derives its existence and its powers from Goi's doings and in its image
>
>
>
>
> That is one fine way of avoiding responsibilties and giving Assam a pass. Yes, in the present system, Assam, like every other state, depends on Central funds or laws for continuing its governance. You may not like the system, and that is OK, but given that all states go thru the same thing, why is it that states like Assam & Bihar are clubbed togther and often cited as inefficient states?
>
>
>
>
> But we have seen - time and again, funds to Assam are grossly mis-appropriated, and the left over funds that could not be, are returned to the Central pool. There is probably little accounting for the Centrally allocated funds, but probably no accounting for state collected funds like sales tax or duties.
>
>
>
>
> Politicians and the powerful in Assam (for all the drumbeatings) have little or no integrity left. The state is one of the most corrupt. One person, I talked to said proudly, defending the 'State of the State' this way " nohoi, aaji kali kisu kaam hoi - aagote, 80% poisa khai diya, kintu, aaji kali, 60% man khai".
>
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> As I said earlier, it is pretty common to hear people say that NO ONE that is anyone is Assam is really interested in solving her problems. If problems are solved, the revenue sources dry up. Thats not good!
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> The Center too is NOT interested, because - heck the state representatives don't really care, so why should they. They can go pay attention to some whining state like Bihar. Whatever is said in public is usually for the birds.
>
> There are very, very few powerful people left who are actually thinking about the state and her people (and not themselves). And even if some of them may see independence as a solution, at least one can attest to their integrity and selflessness.
>
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> So, it really doesn't matter WHAT type of Govt. there is at the Center. The %age of poisa khua may reduce a little, but khobo kintu thik! Just a matter of degrees!
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> That is the express reason, why the GOA's feet must be held to the fire. Going around Guwahati, one finds dilapidated roads, buildings and amenities. Most of the places resemble big slums. Even institutions like the Gauhati University, which we were so proud of, show signs of continual neglect and decay.
>
> The GU professors don't get paid on time (they get paid around the 10th or 15th). On pay days -there is huge rush at the bank - its like first come first serve (if you come last, you may not get paid).
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> School teachers are not paid sometimes for months or even years. College teachers and government employees get paid every so often. So, why would we expect govt. employees tecahers etc to work, when the chances of them getting paid are slim. Their only pickings are 'bhaira poisa' - and why NOT? And for teachers, it is 'tuition'. Bhaira tuition is big business these days. Talking to some teachers, one told me, that the big thing is to somehow get a teacher sakori, (preferably 'subject teacher' even if it pays low (RS. 1500 or so) at the begining. But once in, the teacher can make big money by tuition only. Once entrenched, all they have to do is show up for a couple of hours.
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> Bottomline is we can paint a GENERAL picture that the system of govenance needs to be changed (more power to states etc). That may actually be very good for some states, who are performing wonderfully even though they have the same handicap - the central governance.
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> But for a state like Assam, such a change may actaully push it into some deep chasm.
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> IMHO, Assam first needs to show that IT CAN manage its own affairs efficiently. She should be able to show that corruption and inefficiency is eradicated. Our people should be able to demand more from their representatives, and not sit by taking whatever is dished out. Yes, everyone can play a positive role and make the state a much better place.
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> And then, we can all hold our heads high and tell the GOI and the Center to take a hike and ask them to follow the example we have set. Until then, I don't we have much of a leg to stand on.
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>
> --Ram
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> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
>
>
>
> Umesh Sharma
> 5121 Lackwanna ST
> College Park, MD 20740
>
> 1-202-215-4328 [Cell Phone]
>
> Ed.M. - International Education Policy
> Harvard Graduate School of Education,
> Harvard University,
> Class of 2005
>
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