On 12/13/2023 7:55 AM, Joshua C. Colp wrote:
On Wed, Dec 13, 2023 at 8:45 AM Jonathan Simpson
<jsimp...@jdsnetwork.com <mailto:jsimp...@jdsnetwork.com>> wrote:
The mixed content is useful.
Learning about stir shaken updates, useful. Would that have been
in a github notification? Would the subject line be parsable?
My inquiry was strictly regarding release notifications and security
advisories. If discussions were done in GitHub then it would have been
a GitHub notification and parseable if you opted to receive them.
I'll point out another issue with this as well. This assumes we're just
talking about the "asterisk" repo here, and friends, but the
asterisk-dev list has become the catch-all list for most discussion of
anything development related in the entire Asterisk family of software,
particularly as most of the other lists died a long time ago.
For example, in what repo should discussion of wanpipe take place? Some
of us might want to discuss issues with or trade patches[1], but there
isn't a wanpipe repo since it's not an "open source project". Or general
discussions that might cross over into multiple repos at once, like
something that affects both Asterisk and DAHDI Linux, or both DAHDI
Linux and DAHDI Tools? Should everyone now watch the asterisk-test-suite
repo too? There are a lot of edge cases this doesn't handle well.
I think it's also worth pointing out that, while I'm not one of these
individuals, there are a number of people that don't have a GitHub
account (and perhaps might not want one) that would be excluded if all
discussion was happening there. This very point came out when the
project moved away from Atlassian and there were comments to that effect
*on this list*. These people would have been completely unheard if
discussion had also moved to GitHub prior to that. Do you want to
intentionally exclude them now?
Some people I've noticed also subscribe to the digest version of this
list. I could be wrong but I doubt GitHub discussion has a "digest"
mechanism... because it isn't a real mailing list with all the options
of a real mailing list.
Sometimes people see something on the mailing list and reply privately
to the OP to continue a specific point of discussion off-list. On GitHub
discussions, where everyone is identified by their GitHub usernames and
not real names or email addresses, getting in touch with someone could
be considerably more difficult, particularly for people who might just
be looking at the discussion online.
And frankly, I think expecting 2100 people to reply to this thread is
downright unrealistic. On no mailing list ever does everybody
participate. The majority of mailing lists are dominated by the
discussion of a few while the rest sit back and listen (which is
perfectly fine), maybe 5% of posters generating 95% of the posts. Some
people don't want to contribute, but they do want to read. Nobody has
come out and said he or she wants the mailing list to go away or give
way to another format, and lack of a response is *not* tacit approval of
doing so. All the stakeholders that have spoken out are against the
decision.
I will say though that I have been receiving release announcements both
via the mailing list and via GitHub. For release announcements
specifically, they both work fine. In fact, since the recent 3.3.0 GA
DAHDI Linux release only went to GitHub and not the mailing lists,
that's how I noticed it. I think GitHub is probably just fine for this,
but less so for everything else.
I've already given my opinion before, but I'll reiterate that mailing
lists are accessible to everyone in a way that GitHub never has been and
never will be. I can fire up a terminal email client like mutt or alpine
and make a new post to the list[2][3]. Their website is notorious for
making random changes that break certain browsers and they don't give a
hoot. It's a proprietary platform that we're all at the complete mercy
of. There are already certain things that it's bad at, and there's no
reason to expect it will be better at other things in the future.
NA
[1] This has been happening, but largely on another private mailing
list, not on the asterisk-dev list, though the latter is arguably a more
suitable location for this
[2] And given the audience of this list, I think it's reasonable to
expect that a number of subscribers do this or may want to, at least
occasionally
[3] I'm aware you can respond to a GitHub discussion from email, but you
can't start a discussion via email - see
https://webapps.stackexchange.com/questions/76055/can-i-create-an-issue-in-a-github-repository-by-sending-an-email
This alone is a major access barrier, considering that GitHub no longer
works in any of my preferred browsers, because they have no obligation
to comply with standards. Even though I have a GitHub account, I hate
using the GitHub website and it's a pain to do so.
--
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