Hi Stevo,
We used the old AG year books and listed all the records done in wooden
aircraft and drew our line there. The records tumbled when the
Boomerang/Austria/Foka were replaced with Diamants, Libelles , Pheobus and
Cirrus. They weren't just a step up, they were a leap.
On some exceptional days there were some exceptional flights done. Geoff's
in the Boomerang and Brian Mclaren's 800 odd Km in the Standard Austria
were just outstanding. What I reckon is that if they knew what we know
now, they may have gone further. In the last 2 years there has been
flights of over 1000 k in a K6E (USA) and more recently the 600 k in a K2
two seater (Europe). A K2 not even a K7, probably a 24:1 glide angle.
I can't endorse your comment that these gliders need to be retired. I
argue it's not really about the glider, it's more about the pilot
extending themselves. I won't even say that anyone can jump in a current
machine and just chalk off their silver C. Doesn't matter what you fly,
it's still a goal to achieve in a flying machine without an engine.
Your comments about glue and structural failure needs to be toned down a
bit. Even you know about delamination in glass structures so don't just
point the finger at wood. Most glues have demonstrated longevity,
particularly Casien, which would have to be one of the most careful glues
to maintain has shown excellent strength. Yes there have been examples of
failure but generally there are mittigated reasons for that result and if
detected early it can be very easily repaired and in most cases returned
to service.
As you know I grew up gliding, these pilots, and I knew a lot of them,
were my idols. Jinksy, Rowe, Howland, Blackwell, Reid, Iggulden, Apsland,
Renner and Dick Johnson in the US were just supermen to a junior pilot.
But just as impressionable on me were the other pilots that just enjoyed
their flying, seeing every flight as an experience.
Cheers
Patch
----- Original Message -----
From: gstev...@bigpond.com
To: "Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia."
<aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net>
Sent: Wednesday, 18 July, 2012 11:03:24 PM (GMT+1000) Auto-Detected
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Club Class Records: unofficial
Hi Patch,
Please enlighten me. What are the achieved benchmarks - both official and
unofficial - for a Boomerang/Super Arrow, that you know about? I seem to
recall that a couple of SA pilots were doing flights of 600k plus, many
years ago, including at least one flight across Spencer Gulf. Do you have
an
AG reference for that flight? Ballsy stuff maybe, but I suggest it might
be
hard to beat Percy Wills' flight, and story on how he almost(?)
accidentally
glid across the English Channel.
I endorse your comments in Para 2. It seems to me that despite my earlier
comment (which I stand by), about the best place for most 1-26 gliders is
in
a museum, over the years the owners (as a collective), of these ships have
tested all the limits of what is possible with this type, (and the type
did
evolve, as you well know, so there are many model variations), under
(almost?), every possible situation. It is extremely unlikely that any
current record for the type can be improved upon. In my opinion another
good
reason to put 99% of these ships in museums, before structural/glue or
other
failure kills somebody.
Having made a point or two about the 1-26 as a type, let me make one more
about the skill of the best of the 1-26 pilots. It can be summed up in
one
word -Awesome!
Gary
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ruth Patching" <patch...@westnet.com.au>
To: "Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia."
<aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 1:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Club Class Records: unofficial
Hey WPP,
What you are proposing is very similar to what some of us in the vintage
movement have been doing for some time now, unofficially.
What we try to do with our gliders is to fly them to their fullest
potential. We do that by looking at the records of the era and
endeavouring to better those results in our flying. Given the
improvements
in instrumentation, our knowledge of weather and more importantly the
improvements in flying skills it is a personal acheivement when it all
comes together.
I am sure the Boomerang is capable of much longer flights and believe
they
would have, if the rapid performance gains with GRP gliders hadn't
happened so quickly and replacing those gliders within such a short
period
of time.
Patch
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Woolley" <aussiejuniort...@hotmail.com>
To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
Sent: Wednesday, 18 July, 2012 12:50:14 PM (GMT+1000) Auto-Detected
Subject: [Aus-soaring] Club Class Records: unofficial
G'day All,
I've been keen to set up some unofficial club class records since getting
my Cirrus. Hope you see the concept/idea as I've seen it. The reason
behind it,
As per '3.2' - All in good fun, to give those who can't go for official
records due to financial reasons (eg, not being able to obtain a Discus
2,
to go for a STD class record) or not being their preferred class.
In 1999, Tom Claffey & others experienced some amazing weather conditions
in AUS. I think that the weather cycle goes in 7yr increments. Now
approaching 14yrs later, I think we could be in for a good season - cross
your fingers, I & many others would love a regular great season for a
change!!!
All comments & potential additions on the below welcome.
SeeYou,
WPP
www.facebook.com/W3Racing
Unofficial Australian Club Club Class Records - Rules V1.0
Concept by Adam Woolley
Written by Adam Woolley
1 - Philosophy: To provide a friendly and honest unofficial record
list/rules for Australian pilots, whom race/fly in Australian airspace,
in
the gliders on the Australian Club Class Handicap list provided on the
GFA
website.
2 - RULES: Use the Australian Junior Record Rules (found on
www.joeyglide.com.au & www.ajgc.org.au websites) if you want to go
'official official', as kindly put together by Andrew Maddocks. The
below
are amendments & simple reminders, in no particular order & are generally
based on the KISS principle, with safety in mind!
If you don't want to read the rules, & if your an honest person - the
below will suffice.
2.1 - Entries Open: 18 JUL 2012.
2.2 - Eligable Gliders: Club Class Gliders, as found on the current years
GFA Club Class Handicap list.
2.3 - Handicaps: the use of the current GFA Club Class Handicap list will
be used for the flight (date) submitted.
2.4 - Reference Weight: the use of the current reference weight as
provided by the GFA club class handicap list for the (date) submitted.
2.5 - After Market Modifications: No penalty will be given for the
addition of winglets, wing fillets or extractor vents.
2.6 - Handicap Adjustments: 0.005 disadvantage per part there of 12kg
over
REFERENCE WEIGHT. No performance advantage given for gliders that fly
below REFERENCE WEIGHT.
2.7 - Start Rule: 1km radius over pre-declared waypoint.
2.8 - Turnpoint(s): 500m radius.
2.9 - Finish: 3km radius from the pre-declared waypoint.
2.10 - Record submission: E-Mail your details appropriate for the flight
(Start & Finish Point, Turnpoints (if not a free distance or height gain)
inc waypoint details, glider type, approximate weight (or accurate if
known)), & *.igc file to, agwool...@hotmail.com within 48hrs of 'end of
roll'.
2.11 - Start/Finish Heights: You must finish at the predetermined finish
point, within a 1000m of your start height & predetermined start point.
For 'free distance' one way flights, you must start (predetermined point)
below 1000m AGL & land safely at any point.
2.12 - Records: Each record will stay firm until beaten by the current
years GFA handicap for the club class glider used. ie, won't be changed
each season if the glider handicap or reference weights change.
2.13 - Declarations: A flight must be declared before going through the
start circle, unless it's a Free Distance flight.
3 - GENERAL
3.1 - Remember, unofficial. If you cheat intentially or not being honest,
you're only ripping your fellow mates off.
3.2 - All in good fun, to give those who can't go for official records
due
to financial reasons (eg, not being able to obtain a Discus 2, to go for
a
STD class record) or not being their preferred class.
3.3 - If the GFA thinks its a good idea, more than happy for the rules to
be re-written officially. Though I would like to think that they'll
accept
the unofficial records, even of they have an unofficial column until the
record is beaten officially - to reward the efforts that we've previously
gone too!
3.4 - I know there's lots of holes in the above. Use your noggin for what
you think is right and fair!
3.5 - It's just a game, have fun!
4 - Records obtainable
4.1 - An excel spreadsheet available on request, until I find a place to
upload it to the web.
4.2 - Free Distance
Free Distance
Free Out & Retun Distance
Free Three Turnpoint Distance
4.3 - Distance to Goal
Straight Distance to Goal
Three Turnpoint Distance
Out & Return Distance
FAI Triangle Distance
4.4 - Speed
Speed Out & Return: 100km
Speed Out & Return: 300km
Speed Out & Return: 500km
Speed Out & Return: 750km
Speed Out & Return: 1000km
Speed FAI Triangle: 100km
Speed FAI Triangle: 300km
Speed FAI Triangle: 500km
Speed FAI Triangle: 750km
Speed FAI Triangle: 1000km
_______________________________________________
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
_______________________________________________
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.2178 / Virus Database: 2437/5138 - Release Date: 07/17/12
_______________________________________________
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
_______________________________________________
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.2178 / Virus Database: 2437/5138 - Release Date: 07/17/12
