The Baha'i Studies Listserv Can you give examples of some of their literalistic interpretations of the Qur'an? All I know is their symbolic interpretation of the command to amputate thieves as getting rid of their impact on society and their Sufi interpretation of salah. On the latter, the purpose of salah is always to be God conscious. The person who is always punctual and always counts their rakahs is said to be offering the trader's prayer according to a tradition. Qur'an aloners do quote hadith that support the Qur'an as hadith that contradict the Qur'an or innovate are worthless and the hadith that agree are superfluos. Therefore, people should strive for continual 24-7 God conciousness rather than performing salah.
________________________________ From: Matt Haase <matthewhaa...@gmail.com> To: Baha'i Studies <bahai-st@list.jccc.edu> Sent: Mon, November 1, 2010 4:48:17 PM Subject: Re: The Future of Religion The Baha'i Studies Listserv Stephen, I take issue with your claim that "most" Western Muslims view Islam through the Qur'an-Alone. That has not been my experience at all, nor has any of my research pointed to that. The Qur'anites or Qu'ran-Aloners comprise a very small group of people, and are very literalistic in their reading of scripture. They claim to be "free-thinkers", but they are not. All of their views on anything come from a literal reading of the Qur'an: Far from what I call a "free-thinker." If anything, the Western experience of Islam has been that of Post-Islamic or Extra-Islamic Sources. The first published translation of the Qur'an in the United States, was from the Ahmadiyyas. They were the firs Americant Muslim door-to-door preachers, and most of whom they converted were African Americans. In the early 20th century, a man going by the title "The Prophet Noble Drew Ali" wrote a book called the "Circle Seven Koran", which he claimed was a post-Qur'anic revelation from God as well as a divulgence of esoteric secrets that he learned while on pilgrimage in Egypt. He taught that Black people were originally Moors from Morocco, and that their true religion was Islam - his Islam. He told them that once they joined his religion (The Moorish Science Temple of America), they would have dual citizenship with all of the Muslim countries of the world; especially Morocco. One of his followers was W.D. Fard, who later went on to form the Nation of Islam. Using some aspects of the Moorish Science Temple and his own teachings, Fard created a religion whereby he taught his followers that Black people were originally Muslims in religion (borrowed from Noble Drew Ali), that they came from the tribe of "Shabazz" and that the Black man is the Original Man, and Original God. Black men are all Gods, but the supreme Black man is Allah - there can only be one Allah at one time - and that role naturally was filled by W.D. Fard (although there was some debate early on that W.D. Fard never claimed to be Allah or even a Prophet.) The Nation of Islam would later go on to teach that God was not a "spirit", but was a human being - specifically a Black male. God could only be a human being because people can only relate to what their five senses tell them. Most of these early Muslim groups did not even use the Qur'an as a source of doctrine, except the Ahmadiyyas. But they were not mainstream due to their teaching that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was the Messiah, and a minor Prophet who revealed writings "inspired by God" (but was not actual revelation per-Qur'an.) In the other part of the West, Great Britian, France, Sweden, etc, some of the early Western converts to Islam were also Perennialists. Perennialists were Universalists in the sense that they believed mankind had an "original religion" going back to early times, and that all of the existing religions expressed parts of that original religion of mankind. Thus, people such as Rene Guenon who was a very devout Muslim, didn't necessarily view Islam in the same manner that a scholar at Al-Azhar would. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying that some extra-Islamic sources played a part in the introduction of a Western Islam, so to speak. On Mon, Nov 1, 2010 at 11:38 AM, Gilberto Simpson <gilberto.simp...@gmail.com> wrote: The Baha'i Studies Listserv >I'm really confused by what connection you see between Quran-only >folks and Anarchists? > >Also, isn't the Bahai faith more "Protestant" than "Catholic" (i.e. >emphasizing the Writings alone, careful to not use pilgrim notes or >the "interpretations of men") > > >On Mon, Nov 1, 2010 at 10:56 AM, Stephen Gray <skg_z...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> The Baha'i Studies Listserv >> >> Islam tends to be complicated by the issue of Hadith. Alot of Westerners >> (including Western Muslims) tend to view Islam solely through the Quran. >> Sola scriptura is something that happens to various religion when people > >> want to discard fallible human traditions ie Karaite Judaism, Protestantism, >> Qur'an alone Islam, Triratna Buddhist Community, Arya Samaj, etc. >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism_and_Islam >> >> Alot of people think Islam (the brands common in the Middle East) is >> responsible and/or compliant to the authoritarian regimes there. >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism_and_religion >> > > >__________________________________________________ >You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:matthewhaa...@gmail.com >Unsubscribe: send a blank email to >mailto:leave-536665-953325.e9a9b042dd227e4657deb0ff0d384...@list.jccc.edu > >Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to ly...@list.jccc.edu >Or subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st >Baha'i Studies is available through the following: >Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu >Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st >News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st >Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai...@list.jccc.net >New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu > __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:skg_z...@yahoo.com Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:leave-536797-1719008.2a3842ae5b2f7d34dd5fdfc724616...@list.jccc.edu Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to ly...@list.jccc.edu Or subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai...@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:arch...@mail-archive.com Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:leave-538374-27401.54f46e81b66496c9909bcdc2f7987...@list.jccc.edu Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to ly...@list.jccc.edu Or subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai...@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
