Dear Stewart,
The relaxed speed is, I suspect, because she's dancing a 17th century
French courante - tho' perhaps even a bit too relaxed in this example.
Many courantes found in Austro-germanic sources are in the Italian
manner.
M
--- On Wed, 13/10/10, Stewart McCoy <lu...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
From: Stewart McCoy <lu...@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: [BAROQUE-LUTE] Corrrecting mistakes and mistaking
corrections...
To: "Baroque Lute Net" <baroque-lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Date: Wednesday, 13 October, 2010, 10:56
Dear Mathias,
The piece played in the video is a courante for 11-course baroque lute
ascribed to Aureus Dix. There is a modern edition in Emil Vogl (ed.),
_Z
Loutnovych Tabulatur AeeskA(c)ho Baroka_, Musica Viva Historica 40
(Prague:
Editio Supraphon, 1977), p. 80. The source is given as Warschau,
Musikhistor. Institut der UniversitACURt, MS., Sign. GrA 1/4ssau 2010.
I am surprised how slowly the piece is played on the video. I have
always played it a little quicker.
Best wishes,
Stewart McCoy.
-----Original Message-----
From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
[mailto:[2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On
Behalf Of "Mathias RAP:sel"
Sent: 13 October 2010 10:01
To: baroque Lutelist
Cc: Lutelist
Subject: [BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Corrrecting mistakes and mistaking
corrections...
Just to let you know what I was talking about, here's a related video:
[3]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haloVV3WxfE Note how slowly the dance
is
performed, and the dancer takes pairs of measures.
Mathias
"Mathias RAP:sel" <[4]mathias.roe...@t-online.de> schrieb:
> <[5]wi...@cs.helsinki.fi> schrieb:
> > The piece is La Mignonne by F. Dufault. As far as I know, the
only
> > source is ms. Barbe, p. 64.
> ...
> > There are a few interesting "mistakes" and corrections of
"mistakes" in
> > the ms. and in the CNRS edition:
> > * Second last bar of A section: CNRS has moved the letter "c"
from
> > 5th course to 4th, from e to g in C major chord. I agree.
>
> On which grounds? That change (fifth instead of third) makes it more
> mainstreamish, indeed. But I beg to differ. The third is by no means
> wrong, it's just uncommon. In textual criticism, there is a rule that
> says, lectio difficlior est lectio probablior, the difficult reading
has
> more probability. That's why I prefer to reject the unneeded
emendation
>
> > * Section B, 4th whole bar: there is no comma (,) after the
open
> > first string a, neither in the original or the CNRS. I think
there
> > must be an ornament, because of similiar places before and
after.
>
> That would be my very reason to cling with the text as is. Having no
> comma here, interrupts an otherwise boring chain of samey movements.
>
> > * The A section has 16 bars, the B section has only 15. The
editor of
> > CNRS has composed an extra bar after the 7th bar of the
original.
> > To me that sounds really bad! Perhaps something else in some
other
> > place would work? Anyhow, the original version with its 15
bars in
> > B section doesn't sound at all "incomplete" to my ears - the
music
> > anyhow is already quite irregular in itself. So here I
definitely
> > keep the original 15 bars.
>
> Yes, agreed. The addition is unneeded in terms of the music. Without,
> the voice-leading works just as well. On the other hand, this
additional
> measure will help dancers out. Since I saw Jutta Voss perform a
French
> courtly courante ( www.historischer-tanz.de ), I have realized that
> dancers take pairs of measures in a courante, and they need 16
measures
> so as to finish.
>
> > * B section, bars 10 and 11 (11 and 12 in CNRS): The
tabulature
bass
> > line in both versions is D'-F-C. I think the writer of the
ms. has
> > made here the typical error of placing a letter one course
off. To
> > me it should read D'-C-Bb'.
>
> That would mean that the scribe made the same mistake two times
shortly
> one after another. There is a difference, however, between the two
> places. In measure 10, F makes sense as the third of the chord. It is
> unnecessary to replace it by another tone of the same chord.
>
> As opposed to that, C in measure 11 obviously is a slip of the pen,
as
> the chord wouldn't make sense (a'-d'-C). Your emendation does make
good
> sense, turning the a' into a seventh appogiatura.
>
> > And so I play it. Much nicer and fits
> > better to the structure of the piece.
>
> IMHO second thoughts about what really is nice and fitting with 17th
> century lute music, are worthwhile. What are our guidelines? -- Thank
> you, Arto, for sharing this!
>
> Mathias
>
> > References
> >
> > 1.
[6]http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/wikla/mus/11_courseLute/LaMignonneFacsim
ile.
pdf
> > 2.
[7]http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/wikla/mus/11_courseLute/LaMignonneNotati
on.p
df
> > 3. [8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMH1pp52VBs
>
--
Viele GrA 1/4Ae
Mathias RAP:sel
[9]http://mathiasroesel.livejournal.com
[10]http://www.myspace.com/mathiasroesel
To get on or off this list see list information at
[11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
--
References
1. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
2. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haloVV3WxfE
4. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=mathias.roe...@t-online.de
5. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=wi...@cs.helsinki.fi
6. http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/wikla/mus/11_courseLute/LaMignonneFacsimile
7. http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/wikla/mus/11_courseLute/LaMignonneNotation.p
8. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMH1pp52VBs
9. http://mathiasroesel.livejournal.com/
10. http://www.myspace.com/mathiasroesel
11. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
