Dear Monica, As you now know, I haven't yet replied to your latest open mailings since these had both ended by saying that you 'were going to leave it for now' and I therefore took this as meaning I might soon expect something further. Accordingly, not wishing to respond in a piecemeal and disjointed manner, I deliberately delayed replying and awaited your further thoughts. However, I shall do so now. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------- Regarding copying things to other lists, just to be quite clear, I generally copy things to other of Wayne's lists if they're relevant there. Hence why gallichon/mandora stuff (but usually not guitar) can find its way onto the lute lists (or, indeed, elsewhere) - it's not a fiendish plot of any kind! But on with the motley.......... ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------- Our exchanges of 'textual analysis' have clearly failed to persuade each other of our respective cases and therefore, to make any progress, another tack is now required: one more forensic perhaps and closer related to contemporary organological, musicological and source evidence. Firstly though, to summarise our respective positions: - as I understand it from what you have written, your position is that the vast majority (about 98%) of the some 124 works for plucked instruments in this MS are for a six course gytarra and that just three are for a mandora (according to you a twelve course instrument with five fingered courses and seven free basses - you stated that "The mandora has seven unstopped basses" ); - mine is that the 28 pieces notated with a sixth course are for mandora and that the remainder requiring just five courses are principally for gytarra (although, as I was at pains to point out earlier, any passably competent mandora player would easily be able to add a low sixth where suitable in the guitar pieces and similarly, in many cases, a guitarist would be able to play the errant low bass an octave up by employing the open third course). The couple of pieces which have the seven additional free basses notated also have a left hand fingered bass notated in the usual register and, whilst we've not discussed this so far, I believe these additional low course numberings are therefore simply later additions to these two pieces (note also that the scribe left off adding these low basses half way through the piece numbered 45! ). ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------- 1. DATE OF D-189 You stated that the MS could have been written "anytime in the eighteenth century" - but with no evidence for this assertion. I do, of course, understand why you favour such a wide range of dates since it may help give some credence to employing a six course guitar (developed, in fact, only later in the eighteenth century) for all the plucked works in this collection However, others date the writing of this MS considerably earlier, including: James Tyler - 'early 18th century'; Gary Boye - 'beginning of the 18th century'; Ernst Pohlmann - 'um 1700' (around 1700); Jaroslav Pohanka (Principal editor of Musica Antiqua Bohemia) - 'vor 1700 geschrieben' (written before 1700); My own dating (based on stylistic traits and the piece attributed to C. Loschi) is 1700 to 1720. Accordingly, to summarise, the best date range estimate for compilation of this MS lies between 1690 and 1720. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------- 2. CALLICHON/MANDORA Around 70 extant historical mandoras/gallichons have been identified made between 1688 and 1780 (most are listed in Dieter Kirsch's 'La mandora au XVIII siecle): the vast majority (97%) of these are six course instruments but a couple have more courses - one is 8 course and one 9 course . These two are both later eighteenth century and thus too late to be the sort of instruments originally employed for D-189. Extant instruments also well reflect contemporary iconography showing the overwhelming predominance of the six course mandora; and similarly with extant tablatures - though a very few do contain some pieces for 8 or 9 course mandora (such as Univerzitna Kniznica Bratislava Ms 1092 which contains galant/classical music c.1770 requiring a mandora with eight courses). Note that these mandoras basically had these few additional courses on the same peghead (like earlier lutes) and did not employ the much longer extensions as found in the theorbo, archlute or, for that matter, the arch/theorboed guitar known from the seventeenth century onwards. Historically, the upper five courses of the usual six course mandora/callichon were tuned in precisely the same intervals as those of the guitar. The mandora sixth course was commonly tuned a tone below the fifth (as, of course, found in D-189), or a third or a fourth below it. Tablatures show that the additional basses of the rare 8/9 course instrument merely fill in the notes between the fifth course and the sixth a third or a fourth below it and do not extend the range any further downwards. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------- 3. ACCORDO GYTARRA ET MANDORA The tablature system with five lines on f.48v. between the first double bar lines gives octave tuning checks in the usual manner. It shows that the upper five courses of the gytarra and mandora were tuned in the same intervals with an extra course indicated below the line for the usual six course mandora of the period (the six course guitar not then being known). The telling example of the Rondeau (C. Loschi), originally for a six course instrument but later arranged for just five courses (Rondon 75), very well illustrates the differences required in intabulating the same work for the six course mandora and the five course gytarra. The staff after this has numbers below for an instrument with seven additional bass courses - but only two intabulated pieces out of a total of 124 works have had these numbers added. I therefore believe that this section was added later - perhaps when a novel theorboed guitar was acquired (again note that the scribe couldn't be bothered with adding these new low basses all the way through piece 45). ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------- 4. SIX COURSE GUITAR IN BOHEMIA, MORAVIA AND AUSTRIA IN THE EIGHTEENTH CENTURY Six course guitars first appeared in Southern Spain in the 1760s and a little later in Italy in a six string form, but only appear in German speaking lands from the 1780s (the earliest extant one being by Michael Ignaz Stadlmann, Vienna 1787). In c.1810. the Viennese guitarist Simon Molitor also tells us that around 1790 the guitar entered Austria 'where earlier it had been very rarely seen' and that at the same time a sixth string/course was added. As an aside, Molitor also tells of meeting a mandora player in Vienna (perhaps Joseph Zincke?) around 1800 (they were still around then!) who said that he now used single strings instead of double courses since he found it easier to tune........... ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------- 5. CONCLUSIONS 5.1. A multi-course theorboed mandora with twelve courses never existed and, indeed, even the rare mandoras with up to a maximum of three basses are not known in the period covered by the dating of D-189. Accordingly, the most likely, and reasonable, identification of the couple of works for an instrument with seven extra basses is the arch/theorboed guitar. 5.2. The six course guitar is not known in the period covered by this collection (est. 1690 - 1720) and thus could not have been the instrument employed for the pieces requiring a sixth course. 5.3. The tuning chart 'Accordo Gytarra et Mandora' gives the octave checks for tuning instruments with up to six courses, and thus serves for the upper five courses of both the gytarra and the mandora - but only the mandora for the sixth course . ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------ 6. Finally, when I first came across this MS some years ago, I wondered if Gytarra (or Chytarra) might be a colloquial Bohemian/Moravian synonym for the Mandora. But there was no independent supporting evidence and, moreover, strongly against this proposition is the precise wording of 'Accordo Gytarra et Mandora' (ie tuning of gytarra AND mandora) which requires two clearly different instruments - but both having the same basic tuning for five courses. As mentioned earlier, if it had said ' Gytarra aliter Mandora' (or similar) things might be different....................... regards Martyn ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------- PS Incidentally I don't know why the duet Boure (f. 69v) for Mandora 1 and 2 does not employ the sixth course: perhaps the composer preferred this particular piece with these instruments this way or maybe they didn't have two guitars available? The last is not as daft as it may seem: at this time the mandora was immensely popular in this part of the world with almost all known mandora makers working in this area of Bohemia, Moravia, upper Austria and South Bavaria (roughly bounded by Wurzburg, Innsbruck, Linz and Prague) - see Kirsch. MS sources with music for mandora outnumber those for guitar from this area. Also note Molitor's report. Similarly, regarding f. 48r with the 'Fundamenta Gytarra', this simply contains common thoeretical information for beginners as frequently found in tablature books from these lands. They generally (as with D-189) cover the generic principles of notation (tablature letters), time signatures, note values and tablature flags, ornaments, etc. and, as in this case, apply to all the plucked instruments represented in the following tablatures - here the mandora, gytarra, and theorboed guitar. Obviously, a seperate 'Fundamenta' page is not needed for each plucked instrument represented in the same MS! The practical information overleaf ('Accordo Gytarra et Mandora') gives the more specific information on tuning, etc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------- PPS The dotted separation lines are an attempt to avoid Wayne's robot collapsing paragraphs etc in general circulation - we'll see if it works..................................... MH .
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