Thanks Val, and no worries. I'm looking forward to seeing some updated guidelines for the workflows, incorporating what we've discussed on the mailing list; if I know what to do, I'm happy to put in the effort on my end.
-Aaron ________________________________ From: Obenchain, Valerie <valerie.obench...@roswellpark.org> Sent: Friday, 6 October 2017 6:36:44 AM To: Aaron Lun; Wolfgang Huber; bioc-devel@r-project.org Subject: Re: [Bioc-devel] library() calls removed in simpleSingleCell workflow Glad this sparked some interesting dialogue! Regardless of what's decided, this change should have been announced on the list before implementing it. Sorry for changing the package out from under you. I recognize these workflows are the author's unique work and style will vary with personal preferences. I've reverted simpleSingleCell to -r132062 which was prior to us making any vignette/DESCRIPTION changes. Valerie On 10/04/2017 05:12 PM, Aaron Lun wrote: Here's another two cents from me: The explicit library() calls allow for easy copy-pasting if people only want to use/adapt a section of the workflow. In such cases, calling "library(simpleSingleCell)" could drag in a lot of unnecessary packages (e.g., which could hit the DLL limit). Reading through the text to figure out the requirements for each code chunk seems like a pain, and lots of "::" are unwieldy. More generally, the removal of individual library() calls seems to encourage the use of a single "library(simpleSingleCell)" call at the top of any user-developed custom analysis scripts based on the workflow. This seems conceptually odd to me - the simpleSingleCell package is simply a vehicle for the compiled workflow, it shouldn't be involved in analyses of other data. -Aaron ________________________________ From: Bioc-devel <bioc-devel-boun...@r-project.org><mailto:bioc-devel-boun...@r-project.org> on behalf of Wolfgang Huber <wolfgang.hu...@embl.de><mailto:wolfgang.hu...@embl.de> Sent: Thursday, 5 October 2017 8:26 AM To: bioc-devel@r-project.org<mailto:bioc-devel@r-project.org> Subject: Re: [Bioc-devel] library() calls removed in simpleSingleCell workflow I find `eval=FALSE` chunks not a good idea, since - they confuse users who only see the rendered HTML/PDF (where this flag is not shown) - they are not tested, so more prone to code rot. I'd also like to object to the idea that proximity of a `library` call to code that uses a package is somehow didactic. It's actually a bad habit: the R interpreter does not care. The relevant package - can be mentioned in the narrative, - stated in the code with the pkgname:: prefix. The latter is good didactics to get people used to the idea of namespaces, especially since there is an increasing frequency of name clashes in CRAN, tidyverse, BioC (e.g. consider the various functions named 'filter' and the obscure malbehaviors that can result from these). Best wishes Wolfgang On 04/10/2017 22:20, Turaga, Nitesh wrote: Hi Aaron, A work around solution maybe to, put all libraries in a �eval=FALSE� block in the r code chunk ```{r, eval=FALSE} library(scran) library(scater) ``` etc. This way the users can see the library() calls in the vignette. Best, Nitesh On Oct 4, 2017, at 4:14 PM, Obenchain, Valerie <valerie.obench...@roswellpark.org><mailto:valerie.obench...@roswellpark.org> wrote: Hi guys, A little background on this vignette -> package conversion. The workflows were converted to package form because we want to integrate them into the nightly build system instead of supporting separate machines as we're now doing. As part of this conversion, packages loaded in workflow vignettes were moved to Depends in DESCRIPTION. This enables the user to load a single package instead of many. Packages were moved to Depends instead of Suggests (as is usually done with software packages) because these vignette is the only thing these workflow packages have going - no defined classes or methods. This seemed a more tidy approach and the dependencies are listed in Depends for the user to see. This was my (maybe bad?) idea and Nitesh was the messenger. If you feel the individual loading of packages in the vignette is a key part of the instruction/learning we can leave them as is and list the packages in Suggests. I should also mention that incorporating the workflows into the build system won't happen until after the release. At that time we'll move the repositories from svn to git and it's likely we'll have to ask maintainers to abide by some time/space guidelines. At that point the build machines will be building software, experimental data and workflows and resources aren't unlimited. When that time comes we'll update the workflow guidelines and contact maintainers. Thanks. Valerie On 10/04/2017 12:27 PM, Kasper Daniel Hansen wrote: yeah, that is super super useful to people. In my vignettes (granted, not workflows) I have a separate "Dependencies" section which is basically a series of library() calls. On Wed, Oct 4, 2017 at 3:18 PM, Aaron Lun <a...@wehi.edu.au><mailto:a...@wehi.edu.au><mailto:a...@wehi.edu.au><mailto:a...@wehi.edu.au> wrote: Dear Nitesh, list; The library() calls in the simpleSingleCell workflow have been removed. Why is this? I find explicit library() calls to be quite useful for readers of the compiled vignette, because it makes it easier for them to determine the packages that are required to adapt parts of the workflow for their own analyses. If it doesn't hurt the build system, I would prefer to have these library() calls in the vignette. Cheers, Aaron [[alternative HTML version deleted]] _______________________________________________ Bioc-devel@r-project.org<mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org><mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org><mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org> mailing list https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/bioc-devel [[alternative HTML version deleted]] _______________________________________________ Bioc-devel@r-project.org<mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org><mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org><mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org> mailing list https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/bioc-devel This email message may contain legally privileged and/or confidential information. 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This provides only mild security, but should prevent others from messing with ... -- With thanks in advance- Wolfgang ------- Wolfgang Huber Principal Investigator, EMBL Senior Scientist European Molecular Biology Laboratory (EMBL) Heidelberg, Germany wolfgang.hu...@embl.de<mailto:wolfgang.hu...@embl.de> http://www.huber.embl.de [http://www.huber.embl.de/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/helix.jpg]<http://www.huber.embl.de/><http://www.huber.embl.de/> Huber Group - Huber GroupHuber Group<http://www.huber.embl.de/><http://www.huber.embl.de/> www.huber.embl.de<http://www.huber.embl.de> Multi-omics and statistical computing The Huber group aims to understand inter-individual differences by large-scale statistical modelling and integrating multiple ... _______________________________________________ Bioc-devel@r-project.org<mailto:Bioc-devel@r-project.org> mailing list https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/bioc-devel Bioc-devel Info Page - ETH Zurich<https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/bioc-devel><https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/bioc-devel> stat.ethz.ch Your email address: Your name (optional): You may enter a privacy password below. 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