LGTM2 On Thu, Jan 16, 2025 at 5:28 PM Chris Harrelson <chris...@chromium.org> wrote:
> Great! LGTM1 > > On Thu, Jan 16, 2025 at 8:02 AM 'Alan Baker' via blink-dev < > blink-dev@chromium.org> wrote: > >> We've just merged the spec after it got its final approval. >> >> On Wednesday, January 15, 2025 at 11:13:34 AM UTC-5 Chris Harrelson wrote: >> >>> Great thanks, sounds like a very useful OT. >>> >>> Now we're just waiting for the spec PR to land, since it seems to be >>> approved. >>> >>> On Wed, Jan 8, 2025 at 7:13 PM 'Alan Baker' via blink-dev < >>> blin...@chromium.org> wrote: >>> >>>> The origin trial resulted in the following findings: >>>> >>>> 1. This functionality can achieve the performance improvements we >>>> expected. Meet integrated the functionality into some of its ML shaders. >>>> Benchmarking subgroups vs integer dot products (previous best) for >>>> matrix-vector multiply shaders resulted in speed ups of 2.3 - 2.9x >>>> depending on the device. >>>> 2. Limits were not the right design choice for subgroup size >>>> reporting in the API. They have since been moved into GPUAdapterInfo as >>>> they are really more static properties of a device. >>>> 3. The initial design contained an extra diagnostic that defaulted >>>> to an error to increase portability, but was found to hamper the user >>>> experience more than the value it added. It prevented very common code >>>> patterns unrelated to the subgroup functionality from compiling >>>> cleanly. It >>>> was decided to remove it from the design. >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 8, 2025 at 4:16 PM Chris Harrelson <chri...@chromium.org> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Ok thanks for clarifying that this is shipping and not further >>>>> experimentation. >>>>> >>>>> Could you share the findings from the origin trials? >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 8, 2025 at 11:31 AM 'Alan Baker' via blink-dev < >>>>> blin...@chromium.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I've filed the standard's position issues (and added to the feature). >>>>>> Here they are for reference: >>>>>> >>>>>> - Mozilla: >>>>>> https://github.com/mozilla/standards-positions/issues/1160 >>>>>> - WebKit: https://github.com/WebKit/standards-positions/issues/446 >>>>>> >>>>>> The name was a bad choice. I wasn't familiar with this process >>>>>> initially and only thought of the name with the Origin trial in mind. We >>>>>> don't consider this an experiment anymore. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Jan 8, 2025 at 11:31 AM Chris Harrelson <chri...@chromium.org> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Also: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> * The spec PR needs to land >>>>>>> * What do you mean by "experimentation" in the title of this Intent? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Jan 8, 2025 at 8:30 AM Alex Russell <sligh...@chromium.org> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hey Alan, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just for the avoidance of future friction, we try to use the >>>>>>>> explicit signals systems from Apple and Mozilla because they've asked >>>>>>>> us >>>>>>>> not to use their rep's statements in WGs as assent. Is it possible for >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>> to file those? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Alex >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Monday, January 6, 2025 at 10:48:36 AM UTC-8 Alan Baker wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Contact emailsalan...@google.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Explainer >>>>>>>>> https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/blob/main/proposals/subgroups.md >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Specificationhttps://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/pull/4963 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Approved by Apple rep, editorial comment by Mozilla rep. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Summary >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Adds subgroup functionality to WebGPU. Subgroup operations perform >>>>>>>>> SIMT operations to provide efficient communication and data sharing >>>>>>>>> among >>>>>>>>> groups of invocations. These operations can be used to accelerate >>>>>>>>> applications by reducing memory overheads incurred by inter-invocation >>>>>>>>> communication. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Blink componentBlink>WebGPU >>>>>>>>> <https://issues.chromium.org/issues?q=customfield1222907:%22Blink%3EWebGPU%22> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> TAG reviewNone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> TAG review statusNot applicable >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Origin Trial NameWebGPU Subgroups Features >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Chromium Trial NameWebGPUSubgroupsFeatures >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Origin Trial documentation link >>>>>>>>> https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/blob/main/proposals/subgroups.md >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WebFeature UseCounter namekWebGPUSubgroupsFeatures >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Risks >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Interoperability and Compatibility >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> None >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *Gecko*: No signal >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *WebKit*: No signal >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *Web developers*: No signals >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *Other signals*: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Security >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> None. This feature exposes functionality for operations only >>>>>>>>> within a single draw/dispatch. Data is contained within a single >>>>>>>>> users run. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WebView application risks >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Does this intent deprecate or change behavior of existing APIs, >>>>>>>>> such that it has potentially high risk for Android WebView-based >>>>>>>>> applications? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> None >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Debuggability >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> No special debugging is available for this feature as it resides >>>>>>>>> solely on the GPU. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Will this feature be supported on all six Blink platforms >>>>>>>>> (Windows, Mac, Linux, ChromeOS, Android, and Android WebView)?No >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Is this feature fully tested by web-platform-tests >>>>>>>>> <https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/main/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md> >>>>>>>>> ?No >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Flag name on about://flagsNone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Finch feature nameNone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Non-finch justificationNone >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Requires code in //chrome?False >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Availability expectationBoth Apple and Mozilla have indicated >>>>>>>>> they plan to support this feature in the future. Those >>>>>>>>> implementations are >>>>>>>>> catching up to Chrome in terms of core functionality currently. >>>>>>>>> WebGPU is >>>>>>>>> part of Safari technical previews and Mozilla nightly builds. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Adoption expectationThis feature should have wide adoption for >>>>>>>>> specific use cases. It is not expected that all WebGPU shaders would >>>>>>>>> utilize subgroups, but many applications (e.g. ML) could. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Non-OSS dependencies >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Does the feature depend on any code or APIs outside the Chromium >>>>>>>>> open source repository and its open-source dependencies to function? >>>>>>>>> No >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Estimated milestones >>>>>>>>> Shipping on desktop 134 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial desktop first 128 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial desktop last 131 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial extension 1 end milestone 133 >>>>>>>>> Shipping on Android 134 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial Android first 128 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial Android last 131 >>>>>>>>> Shipping on WebView 134 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial WebView first 128 >>>>>>>>> Origin trial WebView last 131 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Anticipated spec changes >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Open questions about a feature may be a source of future web >>>>>>>>> compat or interop issues. Please list open issues (e.g. links to known >>>>>>>>> github issues in the project for the feature specification) whose >>>>>>>>> resolution may introduce web compat/interop risk (e.g., changing to >>>>>>>>> naming >>>>>>>>> or structure of the API in a non-backward-compatible way). >>>>>>>>> Editorial changes only. Future features are likely to build on top >>>>>>>>> of this extension. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Link to entry on the Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>>>> https://chromestatus.com/feature/5126409856221184?gate=5073549680443392 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Links to previous Intent discussionsIntent to Experiment: >>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB67gB5gUeDVPaMZ7fZwmeARTUsizs1BTXFXKGpJ%3DpF1TQ%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>>>> Intent to Extend Experiment 1: >>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB5jfO13yZGBxMAHRgZX_P0qbixCKSK10SujYkBxftujnQ%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This intent message was generated by Chrome Platform Status >>>>>>>>> <https://chromestatus.com/>. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to blink-dev+...@chromium.org. >>>>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/1969ee25-f88c-482d-adb1-88846d1d4e64n%40chromium.org >>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/1969ee25-f88c-482d-adb1-88846d1d4e64n%40chromium.org?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to blink-dev+...@chromium.org. >>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB7yinOiFXX1ud4hLU9Y2F-9w8O1EL4KZ-KTWDOGCt-B2A%40mail.gmail.com >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB7yinOiFXX1ud4hLU9Y2F-9w8O1EL4KZ-KTWDOGCt-B2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "blink-dev" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to blink-dev+...@chromium.org. >>>> >>> To view this discussion visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB5PA7QJku0dWkS2_jXOVC4V6dWAttbF850jEZmKu684Fg%40mail.gmail.com >>>> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CABg%2BrB5PA7QJku0dWkS2_jXOVC4V6dWAttbF850jEZmKu684Fg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "blink-dev" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to blink-dev+unsubscr...@chromium.org. >> To view this discussion visit >> https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/19c91865-372f-43f8-86c1-484b3856cb58n%40chromium.org >> <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/19c91865-372f-43f8-86c1-484b3856cb58n%40chromium.org?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "blink-dev" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to blink-dev+unsubscr...@chromium.org. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAOMQ%2Bw_%2Bmsmzhau1A-h_2ixJgWgddmdpD33rdQpeHf4BNrSsyg%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/d/msgid/blink-dev/CAOMQ%2Bw_%2Bmsmzhau1A-h_2ixJgWgddmdpD33rdQpeHf4BNrSsyg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "blink-dev" group. 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