On 5 Feb 2003 at 17:25, Jon Gabriel wrote:

> > > Several reasons.  First, I think the European Union is
> > > profoundly anti-democratic.  It concerns me greatly,
> >
> >What's so wonderful about *reprisentative* democracy? Every time I
> >read about how wonderful it is, I remember that Hitler being elected.
> >
> 
> Representative democracy doesn't prevent Hitler's from attaining
> power.  The purpose of representative democracy is to 'theoretically'
> allow the will of the majority of the people to be heard.

I agree. And that's the problem with reprisentative democravcy as 
practiced. And I'd leave the ' ' s off theoretically.

> >Democracy is fine in theory, but I have a HUGE problem with how it
> >works in practice. Especially in the USA.
> >
> > > The central thrust of the European Union the way it is
> > > structured is a transfer of power from the elected
> > > representatives of the various nations of Western
> > > Europe to an unelected bureaucracy in Brussels.  It's
> >
> >*snicker*
> >
> 
> Could you elaborate, please?

Judicial. Branch.

> >Okay. This is what convinces me you're not looking at the situation
> >anything like clearly. The Franco-German axis is NOT popular right
> >now inside Europe. If anything, England, Spain and other countries
> >have the whip hand.
> 
> Do they?  I haven't seen anything that reflects this on, say the BBC,
> FREX.  Can you point me in the direction of a credible news source
> that could explain further?

The BBC is one of the most biased news sources in the world...
(don't get me started on their coverage of Israel either...)
The news links I were off Baen's Bar, I'll find them after this (you 
tend to need to dig for them a bit).

It's what I'm seeing from the overall picture as well, mind you.

> Also, France is a permanent member of the UN Security Council. 
> Germany's term doesn't end until 2004. All it takes is one French
> vote, and any proposal is outta there.

Thank for for nicely illustrating why I don't like the UN as 
currently structured.
Dawn Falcon

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