On 04/09/2006, at 5:58 AM, Andrew Crystall wrote:
On 4 Sep 2006 at 5:36, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 02/09/2006, at 6:41 PM, Andrew Crystall wrote:
Further, ID has very little to do with belief that G-d created the
universe...
...apart from all the major ID spokespeople have said at various
times that the designer is God, and a number of them are YECs who
Ah, kinda missing my point, Charlie. It's not to do with that, but
rather that they haven't been able to get creationism taught as
science, so this is just another shot at the pie.
Ah, I see what you mean. I thought you were making the very European
mistake that assumes that ID *is* theistic evolution and therefore
can't understand all the fuss... :-)
I, as many Jews, believe that G-d created..evoloution, and
set in chain the process which lead to Man.
This here is theistic evolution, not ID. Theistic evolution is
indistinguishable from secular evolution at the level of science.
It's only a matter of whether one is a believer in God or gods or
not, not whether one thinks evolution happened or not.
Yes. Gets back to the book _Genesis and the Big Bang_.
The Gerald Shroeder book? If so, that has big problems too, by trying
to tie the science too closely to the Genesis order of things. In
fact, most of the ancient history of the biblical texts is
archaeologically and scientifically dubious, there's a fair bit of
myth in there. Which I don't think any reasonable person should have
a problem with, as it's not supposed to be a history text any more
than stories of the Lightning Man or the halls of Valhalla are.
They're stories that bind a people culturally, that provide an anchor
to their identity.
Conflict? WHAT conflict?
The conflict is between people who think science should be science
and religion should be religion, and if you're religious you can
understand God's universe by studying it, and those who think that
studying it is anathema because we already know all the answers
through revelation.
Again yes...I'm saying that as a Jew, I don't see the conflict.
"those who think that studying it is anathema"
...are not Jews. Judaism has allways had a strong scientific
tradition, and no theory is thrown out purely because it "conflicts
religious beliefs". To do so it so limit what G-d can do.
Precisely the reasoning I have used when arguing that ID creationism
is not only bad science, it's rotten theology too.
Charlie
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