(not harsh at all, Joseph!)

Yes! I think everyone agree to that. The engine and the gui should be
separated in two processes with a protocol between them.

BTW. There is a new initiative to develop a new backgammon engine. So far
it has been some discussions. It will be coded from scratch in Rust. If
anyone wants to participate, I can send an invite to a slack workspace.

-Øystein


On Fri, 4 Aug 2023, 19:38 Joseph Heled, <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> I don't want to sound harsh, but if we lost all GUI support then GNUbg is
> no more alive than XG.
>
> -Joseph
>
>
> On Sat, 5 Aug 2023 at 02:07, Øystein Schønning-Johansen <
> [email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Yes!
>>
>> We could actually train neural networks with different characteristics.
>>
>> Let's say we do one loop through the training dataset, and for each
>> position we add a little notch to the winning probabilities for all
>> positions that have an opponent checker on the bar (and maybe even a bigger
>> notch if there's two or more checkers on the bar). Then we do supervised
>> training with this modified trainset. This will hopefully create a more
>> aggressive player that will be more eager to hit loose on checkers, and
>> hopefully create a player with an attacking style.
>>
>> Then - Let's say we do one loop through the training dataset, and for
>> each position we subtract a little notch to the winning probabilities for
>> all positions that have a blot that can be hit (and maybe even a bigger
>> notch if there's several of it's blot that can be hit). Then we do
>> supervised training with this modified trainset. This will hopefully create
>> a more careful player that will rather create high stacks than playing
>> flexible. Typically seen by beginner players. 4-1 opening roll is then
>> played 13/8, they seldom split backcheckers etc.
>>
>> Of course I have no idea if this will work or not. But I think I will be
>> able to do something like this. (But not now as I'm leaving for vacation
>> tomorrow morning)
>>
>> We probably need some interface that can read custom neural networks. I
>> have lost the touch when it comes to GTK coding, but someone may be able to
>> specify.
>>
>> -Øystein
>>
>>
>>
>> fre. 4. aug. 2023 kl. 15:39 skrev Superfly Jon <[email protected]>:
>>
>>> Different nets sound like a good addition for people who want to play
>>> against the computer.  This could be combined with an old idea of having a
>>> list of opponents with different characteristics (e.g. more / less
>>> aggressive) where the move equities are adjusted based e.g. on the number
>>> of blots, leading to weaker play with different styles.  Maybe the
>>> different neural nets already do this to some degree?
>>>
>>> Unfortunately I haven't the time to commit to this currently, but maybe
>>> others might and I may have more time in the future.
>>>
>>> Jon
>>>
>>> On Tue, 1 Aug 2023 at 06:52, Joseph Heled <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> As part of my recent research (Elo systems and PR) I generate a number
>>>> of neural nets, ranging from 500 Elo to about 1800.
>>>>
>>>> I thought it might be a nice feature to have for beginners, to play a
>>>> weaker, less frustrating, computer opponent. Might also be useful for
>>>> stronger players - practicing playing against weaker players.
>>>>
>>>> I am willing to adapt the nets to GNUbg. If anyone wants to collaborate
>>>> with me on the rest, i.e. user interface and glue to the rest of the
>>>> system, please contact me and we can discuss feasibility.
>>>>
>>>> -Joseph
>>>>
>>>

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