On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 5:14 AM, Rob Landley <[email protected]> wrote: > On 01/25/2011 09:42 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote: >> at 28nm it's going to be... irrelevant that the main RISC CPU is >> 74,000 transistors (MIPS 64-bit) because it'll be running at 2ghz, be >> running in a quad-core or even 16-core arrangement and... who gives a >> damn if an x86 gets even 100% more performance at those kinds of >> speeds! especially when x86 does so by having to still be a thousand >> times more transistors and so uses vastly more power. >> >> ... or am i preaching to the converted, here? :) > > No, you are not preaching to the converted. Underestimating the ability > to adapt a specific instruction set to take advantage of manufacturing > improvements is something you'd think people would grow out of after 30 > years. > > I'm saying that network effects mean the system with the most users is > the one everybody wants to write code for, and the system with the most > software is the one everybody wants to use. Costs are almost entirely a > question of unit volume, it's all start-up amortized over a production > run. When you say "RISC will make chips cheap", you're making arguments > that people made 30 years ago and it simply did not happen.
rob - with respect, you are making a lot of assumptions about what i've said, and are placing words into my mouth that i haven't said, and then making points supporting your position based on that. on a completely new list, ordinarily i would simply let your points ride. however what i'm going to do in this case is provide some additional information and then i'm going to leave the other people on this list to assess the proposal based on that additional information. * take a look at the specifications for the upcoming version of android (2.3), and the recent report from a korean CTO stating that the minimum requirements to run it are a 1ghz *dual* core CPU... with hardware-accelerated OpenGL ES 2.0. * two Set-Top-Box companies are already crossing over from "set-top-box" into "general purpose" SoC CPUs. one of them has a 500mhz (MIPS) CPU with 1080p60 Video decode. the CPU costs **** 6 **** - i repeat - *SIX* - i repeat, that's $USD 6.00 - i repeat - that's six United States Dollars - in mass-volume. they are now doing a 1.5ghz version. another of them has a dual-core 750mhz (MIPS) CPU again with 1080p60 Video decode. i have not been able to establish the cost of their CPU, but in order to remain competitive it has to be somewhere below $USD 10. this same company is coming out with a *QUAD* core MIPS version, running at 1ghz. this company has access to 28nm. unfortunately this same company is a massive GPL violator, who are so paranoid that they will not even let manufacturers of products utilising their CPUs even design the PCB. they have android running on a reference-design netbook, utilising their dual-core 750mhz MIPS CPU. android is (unfortunately) what smashes the linux kernel into mainstream prominence - exactly as you stated is required, rob, to begin the cycle of acceptance of these much more cost-effective SoC CPU solutions. no mention of x86 or microsoft was made at any time in that sentence. l. _______________________________________________ Celinux-dev mailing list [email protected] http://tree.celinuxforum.org/mailman/listinfo/celinux-dev
