Hi Michael, I just want to say thank you, and I appreciate you taking this issue further and thinking about it. I know that it is not ever easy to change a long-held opinion and of course I would not expect you to do a 180-degree about face over the course of a weekend; that's crazy. But the fact that you would even bring up the topic at all, let alone start to challenge your own preconceptions about it, is something that warms my heart. The best thing I can do to change someone's opinion is not to convince them to change it - it's merely to convince them to think about it.
Thank you for sharing - this actually means a lot to me as an activist. David Churvis -----Original Message----- From: Michael Grant [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:28 PM To: cf-community Subject: Tyranical bigot can't stop thinking Since the numerous forum posts on the gay marriage subject I haven't been able to stop thinking about this issue. I have a tendency to be a little o.c. when I have a problem to solve. It's a blessing when it comes to app development, but a bit of a curse in everyday life. So I've been running this over and over in my brain the past couple of days. Trying to analyze the reason for my opinions, if I feel it's right etc etc. Well last night we had dinner with Peter and Brian, a gay couple that have been friends of my wife and I for years. P&B are the straightest gay couple you've ever met. You'd be very hard pressed to discern they're gay unless they tell you. We've never discussed the issue of gay marriage before. In fact our conversations rarely have anything to do with sexual orientation. So I brought it up with them after dinner and over our second bottle of shiraz. We have a very open and honest friendship and there's never any need to not say exactly what's on your mind for fear of being judged. So in our usual fashion I just laid it on the table exactly what I thought about marriage and my views on gays marrying. They both listened to what I had to say and when I was done Peter looked at me and said "after all these years I had no idea you were retarded. You hide it very well Michael." This of course got a laugh but spurned one of the most honest and open discussions I've ever had. Peter and Brian both told us about what it was like growing up 'different' and the self loathing they felt for so many years. The shame of growing up gay in 70's and 80's and the absolute joy of finding each other and becoming a couple. They talked about how different times are now than they used to be, but how far things still need to go. After about an hour of stories Brian asked me "since you've known us have you ever questioned our devotion to each other?" I said no. "And do you want us to be happy?" I said yes. "And has having us around ever made you love your wife less?" By this time I knew where the conversation was going and I was already feeling a little embarrassed by my comments at the start of the conversation. I said no, of course not. I was expecting some Bill Cosby-esque moral to the story when Brian said in a deadpan voice "Then quit being such a fucktard." That was pretty much the end of the conversation. We played Euchre for a couple of hours and they went home. Now I'm not saying I've made a 180 degree turn. There's still a part of me that's holding on to the idea of "between a man and a woman" but I definitely realise that I don't have much of a leg to stand on. They happen to not really care one way or the other about being married but that's not really the point. The point is that I wouldn't want to deny P&B the same happiness or opportunities that I have. I've read through that whole thread again, and know that other than my first post all of the posts I made were from a defensive position. I was being forced to defend an opinion that from the start I knew I hadn't put a whole lot of thought into. When one has to defend something there is a tendency to stop thinking about what it is you are defending and simply put your energies into the defense itself. Us and them syndrome as it were. So that's that. My mind isn't completely changed. This isn't an after school special or a p.s.a. However I felt I owed it to you all to share it. Cheers ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:281202 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5
