Are you sure about this Doug? Scroll down to the bottom of this message where there's a post from Hal himself on this thread in which he says "You're right, Dave. We're not looking to be able to incorporate Fusebox 3 (or 4) with Mach-II." ...
Unless somebody's impersonating Hal by "forging" an email from [EMAIL PROTECTED] (there's a legacy :) that sounds to me like Hal's saying they're not the same thing. I haven't followed the thread closely enough (or done enough research) to know who's in charge or or responsible for this new mach-ii stuff... I'd been under the impression it was Hal -- that's what I'd read on the list anyway, but now I'm thinkin' that's a nasty rumor. :) Isaac Original Message ----------------------- FB4 = Mach-II = Hal Helms nuff said ====================================== Stop spam on your domain, use our gateway! For hosting solutions http://www.clickdoug.com ISP rated: http://www.forta.com/cf/isp/isp.cfm?isp_id=772 ====================================== If you are not satisfied with my service, my job isn't done! ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Paul Ashenfelter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "CF-Talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 3:12 PM Subject: When to use Mach-II vs FB4? [Re: RE: re: Mach-II] | I tend to agree that it sounds like a troll.... but it does ask one valid | question -- how involved has Hal been in FB4? (Hal?) FB3 and FB4 are pretty | different animals. FB4 answered a lot of issue with FB3. Doesn't mean it | fits all problems -- no framework does that. FB4 solves a certain set of | general problems well. I'm still grokking mach-ii, but I'm not sure I | understand yet when I'd choose it over FB4 for a given CF project. | | So from someone with more mach-ii experience (and FB4 experience. Cmon, | they've been out a couple days/weeks each.... :), what would help you decide | which framework is right for a given project -- in other words, what's a | specific example that would be better suited to one or the other. Looking | head to head, they're both MVC (to an extent), they both are new without | lots of production apps running in them, they both come from smart people. | I've read the paper and seen the discussion threads (eg ContactManager with | mach-ii is overkill) -- but am curious about the nitty gritty -- what's an | example that would clearly favor one framework over the other? | | Regards, | | John Paul Ashenfelter | CTO/TransitionPoint | ----- Original Message ----- | From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | To: "CF-Talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 4:42 PM | Subject: RE: RE: re: Mach-II | | | > Well since Hal co-authored the Fusebox book with me in 2002, I think it's | > safe to say he knows something about Fusebox :) | > | > (And if this were April 1st, I'd think for sure your posting was a troll!) | > | > Original Message: | > ----------------- | > From: Angus McFee [EMAIL PROTECTED] | > Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2003 13:08:53 -0700 (PDT) | > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | > Subject: RE: RE: re: Mach-II | > | > | > Hal - | > | > I've heard from plenty of people looking for a way to beat up on Fusebox, | > but usually they have nothing to say when it comes to building a better | > framework. This is the first time in a long time anyone has suggested an | > alternative approach, and I really don't see how any of this benefits | > developers. This mach-ii stuff looks like just another petty attack on | > Fusebox. | > | > It's pretty clear we see things differently when it comes to building Web | > applications. I don't know you, but I can tell you are a pretty | intelligent | > person, so you probably have some good reasons for why you don't like or | > hate fusebox. | > | > What I have to ask you is: do you use fusebox? Becuase there are plenty of | > people who are ready to attack it anytime and don't even know ColdFusion, | > much less what a framework is. You will probably never be convinced about | > the benefits of fusebox, all I can do is disagree with you, and point out | > all the great things fusebox does for developers: | > | > * it separates business logic from presentation logic, making for more | > organized, efficent code | > * it gives developers a common set of rules and methods to work from, so | > that everyone can understand what the other people are doing on a project | > regardless of the size of a team | > * it modularizes and encapsulates code, making it easier to reuse and thus | > to maintain | > * it is self-documenting, containing a complete, inline XML standard for | > documenting your applications | > * most importantly, there are thousands and thousands of fusebox | developers | > out there, and more and more shops are choosing to use it every day. it is | > close to becoming a de-facto standard, which I doubt your mach-ii | > 'framework' will ever be able to match | > | > Angus McFee | > | > | > -----Original Message----- | > From: Hal Helms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | > Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 2:16 PM | > To: CF-Talk | > Subject: RE: RE: re: Mach-II | > | > You're right, Dave. We're not looking to be able to incorporate Fusebox 3 | > (or 4) with Mach-II. We think that Fusebox is a great framework for | > procedural programmers. (Please, God, don't let this degenerate into yet | > another pro/con Fusebox debate...) | > Mach-II, though, is meant to be a pure OO framework. Fusebox and Mach-II | > have in common some good software engineering principles, but are very | > different things. I'm really referring to (a) backwards compatibility and | > (b) cross-language compatibility. | > Hal Helms | > "Java for CF Programmers" class | > in Las Vegas, August 18-22 | > www.halhelms.com | > | > | > | > --------------------------------- | > Do you Yahoo!? | > Yahoo! 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