пн, 11 дек. 2023 г., 16:13 Terje J. Hanssen via Cin < [email protected]>:
> > > Den 08.12.2023 23:56, skrev Terje J. Hanssen: > > > > Den 08.12.2023 12:50, skrev Andrew Randrianasulu: > > > > пт, 8 дек. 2023 г., 13:57 Andrew Randrianasulu <[email protected]>: > >> >> >> пт, 8 дек. 2023 г., 13:37 Terje J. Hanssen via Cin < >> [email protected]>: >> >>> >>> >>> Den 03.12.2023 22:29, skrev Terje J. Hanssen: >>> >>> Already touched this topic barely in another thread >>> https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/pipermail/cin/2023-December/007346.html >>> >>> But so many SW and HW pieces are mentioned around, it is almost a >>> full-time reading and study: >>> VAAPI, MESA, VULKAN, Intel Quick Sync Video etc...... >>> >>> I realize my aging hardware which is fast enough for other tasks, needs >>> some "AV1 upgrade", if possible. >>> >>> But first I wonder, what is expected possible to do (obtain) with AV1 >>> de-/encoding on my existing 64bit hardware: >>> >>> 1) laptop 2018: Dell XPS 13-9370: quad core i7-8550U CPU (8. gen >>> Kabylake) and Intel UHD Graphics >>> >>> 2) WS infinity: MSI Z170A mobo: quad core i7-6700K CPU (6. gen >>> Skylake), NVIDIA GeForce GT-730 graphics >>> >>> >>> A budget friendly first "AV1 HW upgrade" of the workstation 2) if >>> possible, would be to add a new GPU as Intel Arc A380. >>> But the question is if this will work at all on that much older (2015) >>> Skylake platform with i7-6700K CPU? >>> I've seen CPU bottlenecks has been mentioned and that Arc A380 is >>> targeted at newer generations CPU ... >>> >>> >>> Extracted from the first wikipedia reference below about Intel Alchemist >>> GPUs: >>> >>> - Featuring 8 Xe-cores, the* A380 supports PCI Express 4.0* and has >>> a total board power (TBP) of 75W. The graphics card is equipped with 6GB >>> GDDR6 memory and a graphics memory interface of 96 bits, providing a >>> memory >>> bandwidth of 186GB/s. >>> - Bus interface A380: PCIe 4.0 x8 and for >=A580: PCIe 4.0 >>> x16 >>> >>> That is, the keyword here seems to be PCIe 4.0 bus speed as a >>> requirement to utilize the Arc A380 GPU for HWA AV1 encoding (maybe also >>> for other GPUs?) >>> >> >> well, despite so much time spend looking at dev process for mesa3d I >> still do not know full details and media encoder process. But isn't it like >> putting uncompressed frame in vram (as long as you have enough of it - so >> probably n raw frames between keyframe ideally?) let media engine chw on >> it, pull resulting compressed bitstream out of vram via pci-express? >> >> So I speculate pcie bandwidth in itself will only matter if you compress >> both big frame size and long keyframes, so dma engine on card must >> constantly pump new raw frame data via bus. >> >> I saw some mention of big (resizeable) BAR as requirement for good >> performance, but opengl/vulkan IMO a bit different because they send often >> big amount of tiny objects (vertices) via bus for each frame. But may be >> default 256 Mb in size bar feels a bit small for sending like 1 second of >> 25 4k frames (300 mb/s)? >> > > > Nothing would be better than that A380 does work with older PCIe 3.0 > motherboards and CPUs and without too much decrease in performance. > > > Then I got the following reply to my support request from ASRock TSD > regarding > > https://www.asrock.com/Graphics-Card/Intel/Intel%20Arc%20A380%20Challenger%20ITX%206GB%20OC/index.asp > > Skylake platform does not match the system minimum requirements. > Please refer to the below link for further information. > > https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000091128/graphics.html > > well, if you can get card for brief (two weeks?) testing and return if it really does not work - it will be better than leaning on official answer, IMO. after all, Intel, like any company tries to sell you a bridge ..... > > > > I've also extracted from the following two articles: > > Intel Arc Desktop Graphics Card Gets Requirement List: Resizable BAR > Enabled & Support on 10th Gen and Above CPUs > > > https://wccftech.com/intel-arc-desktop-graphics-card-gets-requirement-list-resizable-bar-enabled-support-on-10th-gen-and-above-cpus/ > *We are supporting Intel platforms with resizable BAR and will add support > for AMD platforms with Smart Access Memory as Intel Arc graphics cards > become available for sale as components. Motherboard requirement:* > > - Full-size PCIe 3.0 (or newer) x16 slot > - Resizeable BAR > > > Arc A770 Loses Up to 24 Percent Performance Without Resizable Bar | Tom's > Hardware > > > https://www.tomshardware.com/news/arc-a770-loses-25-percent-performance-without-resizable-bar > > > - Arc isn't for older systems. > - Intel has revitalized the midrange graphics card market with the > company's latest Arc A770, which will make its way into the list of best > graphics cards. Starting at $329, the Arc Alchemist graphics card brings > GeForce RTX 3060-like performance to the table with Resizable BAR (ReBAR) > enabled, of course. But, without ReBAR or similar technology like Smart > Access Memory (SAM), it's another story. > > > - With Arc, Intel recommends potential consumers make sure their > systems support ReBAR or SAM. > > > - In addition to testing ReBAR, TechPowerUp also evaluated whether the > speed of the expansion slot impacts the Arc A770's performance. As a > reminder, the Arc A770 comes with a conventional PCIe 4.0 x16 interface. > However, the tests revealed that PCIe 3.0 is still plenty for the Arc A770 > as long as ReBAR is enabled. Furthermore, TechPowerUp only recorded a > performance difference of up to 2% between PCIe 3.0 and PCIe 4.0, so ReBAR > support is more important than the expansion slot. Regarding ReBAR, only > Intel 10th Generation Comet Lake > > <https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-comet-lake-s-cores-53-ghz-high-power-better-pricing>, > 11th Generation Rocket Lake > > <https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-11th-gen-rocket-lake-s-specifications-pricing>, > and 12th Generation Alder Lake > > <https://www.tomshardware.com/features/intel-shares-alder-lake-pricing-specs-and-gaming-performance> > processors support that feature. As for AMD, SAM support is only present > on Ryzen > 3000 > > <https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-third-gen-ryzen-7nm-launch-intel-cpu,39449.html> > Zen 2 chips and newer. So while Arc's performance looks attractive and > priced fairly, its requirements effectively lock out users with older > systems. Arc also demands Windows 10 20H2 or Windows 11 > <https://www.tomshardware.com/tag/windows-11> as the operating system, > so Windows 7 users, who are reluctant to upgrade, are also out of the > picture. > > > > > > https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1165048.html?sid=1b9518b86afdcd1fa5e7710f16cd6893 > > not exactly about av1 in ffmpeg 6.1 but lists some components you need for > vaapi/qsv encoder on Arc 380 - also from dmesg resizeable bar support is > not essential ? > > > >> gpus today use their own memory paging system, so may be this add >> additional restriction on how fast you can push frames to them. .... >> >> Also, windows and Linux drivers might differ ( I bet most reviews are >> from windows land). >> >> May be someone will post linux review of this particular aspect of Arc >> graphics, either video or text ... >> >> If this Suse Studio service still works may be you can compose your own >> live image with all components required to test that and walk to some >> offline place where you can testdrive new card .... { If weather feels >> favourable enough - we have around -14 C airtemp so I and my dog prefer >> short dashes around and back to warm place shortly} >> >> >> My existing Skylake WS 2) above has PCie 3.0 only. >>> >>> PCIe 4.0 >>> https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Express >>> https://www.techreviewer.com/learn-about-tech/what-is-pcie-40/ >>> >>> Motherboards Support PCIe 4.0 >>> https://www.makeuseof.com/best-budget-pcie-4-motherboards/ >>> >>> https://www.techreviewer.com/tech-answers/which-motherboards-support-pcie-40/ >>> >>> Maybe also information of interest for WS building will be clarified >>> within a week, when Intel release their new "Meteor Lake, Core Ultra mobile >>> processors(?) >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meteor_Lake >>> >>> >>> References: >>> AV1 Encoding on a Budget: The Intel Arc A380 Approach >>> >>> https://medium.com/@contact_45426/av1-encoding-on-a-budget-the-intel-arc-a380-approach-d72367f2f349 >>> >>> https://history-computer.com/intel-arc-a380-full-review-of-intels-entry-level-gpu/ >>> >>> AV1 fixed-function hardware encoder is included in Alchemist GPUs as >>> part of the Intel Quick Sync Video core. >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Arc#Alchemist >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AV1#Hardware >>> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Quick_Sync_Video#Hardware_decoding_and_encoding >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cin mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/mailman/listinfo/cin >>> >> > > -- > Cin mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.cinelerra-gg.org/mailman/listinfo/cin >
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