At least nobody used the word "methodology", which rightly should describe
the study of method, though that's not how it ever gets used...
Anyway, when I first read Charles' post, and Howard's reply, I was certian
that Charles needed more beer... but now, contemplating the donut and coffee
cup thing, I have come to the conclusion that it is I that needs more beer -
promptly. With the holiday weekend upon me, this I now do...
Guiness anyone?
>From: Priscilla Oppenheimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: Priscilla Oppenheimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: Webster's Dictionary: Network topologies,technologies, and
>types : what's it all mean?
>Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 11:43:26 -0700
>
>I dated a topologist once. Really I did. He claimed the most useful thing
>he learned from his studies was how to get a woman's brassiere off without
>taking her blouse off. ;-) It is possible, assuming a certain level of
>stretchiness.
>
>He also claimed that, topologically, a donut and a coffee cup are the same
>shape. Think about it!
>
>Priscilla
>
>
>At 01:36 PM 5/26/2000 -0400, Howard C. Berkowitz wrote:
> >>Hi, all
> >>
> >>At the risk of touching off a word war here, I wanted to see if I could
> >>get some verification from the group. This is sort of a Howard B.
> >>question in that it has philosophical undertones. What I am trying to
> >>accomplish is to cement my understanding of the terms below.
> >
> >Wondering if it is better or worse to be typecast as a network
> >philosopher or a network theologian.
> >
> >>
> >>I have been studying OSPF very heavily, and as you know, OSPF can pretty
> >>much work over anything. It is the MIRACLE routing protocol, if you ask
> >>me. However, OSPF can be confounding in that it can treat the
> >>underlying network as something that it is not. For example, OSPF can
> >>run on a broadcast network as it the broadcast network were actually a
> >>point to multipoint network by executing the command ip ospf network
> >>point-to-multipoint. This brings me to the point of my post:
> >>
> >
> >A couple of quotes come to mind. Butler Lampson once said "There is
> >no problem in computer science that is not solvable with a sufficient
> >level of indirection."
> >
> >There's a tale told of Stephen Hawking giving a lecture on the
> >origins of the universe. Afterwards, a very proper dowager came up
> >to him and said, "Young man, I don't hold with these big bang
> >theories. The ancient Chinese understood these things properly, with
> >their legend that the world stands on the back of a giant turtle."
> >
> >Hawking, no fool he, responded, "But on what does the turtle stand?"
> >
> >"Another turtle."
> >
> >Hawking, seizing on a potential weakness, started to ask the obvious
> >question, but his questioner cut him off. "And before you ask what it
> >stands on, it's turtles all the way down."
> >
> >>
> >>What is the topology in my example? Broadcast? Point to multipoint?
> >>Bus?
> >>What is the network technology? Broadcast (such as Ethernet).
> >>What is the OSPF network type? Point to multipoint (as set by me).
> >>
> >
> >I would prefer to say that you are dealing with several levels of
> >virtualization or abstraction.
> >
> >There is the abstraction seen by OSPF.
> >There is the abstraction seen by IP.
> >There is the abstraction seen by the MAC sublayer.
> >
> >Each of these abstractions has a topological view, or, perhaps more
> >correctly from a mathematical standpoint, assumes a different graph.
> >Bearing in mind the very proper corrections I have undergone from Dr.
> >Peter Welcher on being imprecise with mathematical terminology, I no
> >longer throw around the term topology with great abandon. Pete, if
> >you are reading this, please join in!
> >
> >>
> >>Would it be accurate to say that term, "network topology" describes the
> >>arrangement of the network's links or amount of connectivity between the
> >>routers on the network? On a broadcast network, what is the topology?
> >>Would I consider it to be fully meshed as each router on a broadcast
> >>network such as Ethernet would have a link to every other router? Or
> >>does network topology describe an integration of the links and the
> >>network technology?
> >
> >Unfortunately, you are running into the problem of using natural
> >language to describe formal systems.
>
> >
> >>
> >>Network technology is an easy one to define, so I think. It is the
> >>complete _____________ compromising access methods, packet formation,
> >>transmission methods, and so on. I am not sure what would fill in the
> >>blank best: protocol? suite? means? mechanism?
> >
> >Informally, I tend to call what I think you're describing a "protocol
> >stack." When I was working in formal OSI protocol stuff, we called
> >it a "functional profile," defined as a set of protocols and a set of
> >protocol options at each layer.
> >
> >>
> >>OSPF network types are OSPF's description of what it or you describe the
> >>network as. It does NOT have to match the actual topology of the
> >>network.
> >
> >The network types are less a medium type description as a set of
> >rules for finding neighbors and adjacencies
> >
> >>
> >>Full mesh vs. partial mesh are somewhat easy to understand (amount of
> >>connectivity between network devices on a network). Would it be fair to
> >>say that the amount of meshing defines the topology?
> >>
> >>I feel better after sharing my muddled thoughts with the group. Am I
> >>overthinking this?
> >>
> >>Flames to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>
> >>Somewhere on the tank range...
> >>
> >>Charles
> >
> >___________________________________
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> >
>
>__________________________________
>Priscilla Oppenheimer
>Phone 541-482-5685
>Fax 541-488-1708
>Web http://www.priscilla.com
>
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