Dear Dr. Sebastian, If I understand what a BDM is, I'm sure it would be very useful some fields, such as medicine. If the decision ends up in my hands (and, if the decision isn't made for a few years, it might not be), then what I will want to see is a clear explanation of what problem such a system solves, whether a system available to us would actually solves them efficiently, and what further problems it might generate. In other words, a project proposal together with an exploration of the relevant arguments, and technical requirements. This then would be given to the Executive Committee that I want to set up soonish.
Let me explain one of my own constraints on making such decisions. A problem that Wikipedia has had is that people (programmers and people who just like to make small edits to the system) have had all sorts of "cool ideas" for new stuff, and no one was around to say "no" or simply "let's think about this more systematically please." So templates, categories, portals, instructions, etc., to say nothing of new projects that were never very well thought out, just kept getting piled on top of each other. The result is a bit of a mess for the user and a headache for the contributor. (Ultimately, I think the problem is that Wikipedians think of themselves too often as first and foremost a community, so that what they do is done to make contributors happy, rather than to produce high-quality work.) Something that *used* to be a constraint on Wikipedia feature proposals (when I was around ;-) ) was that new features should not make it appreciably more difficult for people to dive in and get to work. Now, I can understand that some really useful things might require a bit more complexity, but more complexity really has to pay for itself. Why? Because the payoff of simplicity is extremely high. A large part of the reason for Wikipedia's take-off is precisely that it's simple--the wiki markup is easy to master, and the concept of what we're doing (writing encyclopedia articles) is pretty simple, too. Frankly, I think we need to discuss in some more detail what the basic principles of citation should be. If we want to create an *expert-level* encyclopedia of medicine, then of course there should be many citations. But the notion that some Wikipedians have forwarded, that there should be citations for virtually every positive claim, is simply ridiculous. Wikipedians may feel they need that simply to satify themselves that people aren't adding information fraudulently. But with expert editors able to make decisions about articles, we will not have that same motivation. To get really clear about this, I think we need an answer to a fundamental question, namely, "What is the purpose of citations in encyclopedia articles?" Notice I do not say "What is the purpose of citations?" simply. Citations serve different purposes in different works. What purpose do they serve *in encyclopedia articles*? And in encyclopedia articles of different levels? Note, for instance, that a BDM would presumably not pay its own way if we were writing a children's encyclopedia--even if the children's encyclopedia had some citations. --Larry > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Anthony Sebastian > Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 3:55 PM > To: [email protected] > Cc: 'Larry Sanger' > Subject: Re: [Citizendium-l] Include in Citizendium a > built-in bibliographicdatabase manager for authors & editors > > > Sunday, October 29, 2006 > > Dear Mr. Sanger: > > I have participated in the Citizendium forums (as > Anthony.Sebastian) and have suggested in the technical forum > consideration of incorporating a bibliographic database > manager (BDM) in Citizendium. I received favorable > responses. Incorporating a BDM, like Reference Manager, > Endnote or Pro-Cite, would greatly assist author/editors in > including source-citations in the text, and in generating > reference lists. Most academics I know depend on the > functionality of BDMs. > > Citizendiums BDM would allow authors/editors to cite while > they wrote, automatically generate reference lists, and > search of many online database from outside sources (e.g., > Library of Congress, individual university library catalogs, > PubMed, Agricola, LexisNexis Academic). An enormous number > of such databases exist (e.g., see > http://www-sul.stanford.edu/catdb/alldata.html#l), giving > author/editors access to millions of citation-sources for > documenting their articles. > Citizendiums BDM would allow easy copying of > citation-sources (articles, books, websites, etc.) from those > databases to an article's individual database. > > Citizendium needs to make it easy for an author/editor to > render her article scholarly and authoritative, to maximize > the quality and instructiveness of the article, to facilitate > completing the article, and thus to facilitate the growth of > Citizendium. > > Below, see a letter I composed to the president of Thomson > ResearchSoft, maker of the three major BDMs, urging him to > contact you to consider the possibility of incorporating the > functionality of Reference Manager into Citizendiums writing > tools. I would not transmit it without your okay. You might > want to consider a different approach if the BDM idea appeals. > > Sincerely yours, > > Anthony Sebastian, M.D. > Professor of Medicine > UCSF > > > To: President of Thompson ResearchSoft > > Dear Sir: > > You undoubtedly have heard of Wikipedia, the online, > user-developed encyclopedia. The premiere science journal, > Nature, gave it high marks in comparison with Encyclopedia Britannica. > > Now, the originator of Wikipedia, Larry Sanger, has started a > new "version", Citizendium, targeting more authoritative > articles. See his introductory > essay: http://citizendium.org/essay_shorter.html. > > The start-up team has not incorporated a bibliographic > database manager in their writing tools for authors. That > oversight will make it much more difficult for expert authors > to reference their articles comprehensively. > > I believe they should incorporate Reference Manager in > Citizendium. I would expect a mechanism of incorporation that > precludes private use of the program, so that it would have > no negative effect on your sales of the product. Indeed, as > users become familiar with the use and advantages of > Reference Manager (e.g., Cite-While-You-Write, internet > searching for sources), they might want to purchase a copy > for their own use. In any event, your company would get a > lot of public exposure and free publicity. > > I would urge you to contact Mr. Sanger > ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and discuss possibilities. Yours > and his technical teams could work out the security issues. > > Perhaps you would consider donating the product > functionality, once you see the potential of its success in > establishing an authoritative, constantly updated online encyclopedia. > > Anthony Sebastian, M.D. > Professor of Medicine > UCSF > > > > > > > _________________________ > Anthony Sebastian, MD > [EMAIL PROTECTED] [preferred email address] > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Citizendium-l mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.purdue.edu/mailman/listinfo/citizendium-l > > > > _______________________________________________ Citizendium-l mailing list [email protected] https://lists.purdue.edu/mailman/listinfo/citizendium-l
