> > I think you'd be nuts to choose JVM Clojure over Kotlin for serious > Android development. >
Yes, totally, just to clarify: 1) I don't recommend using JVM Clojure for Android development apart for just toy projects. 2) I do recommend using ClojureScript with React Native for Android development, when it make sense, like standard apps which don't need crazy performance, or specific Android gadgetry, and also should work on iOS. 3) Kotlin is definitely a nice Imperative OOP language, which some functional sprinkle. I like it quite a bit. 4) Kotlin is more fun to use then Java, and is an officially supported language on Android, and is a great choice for Android development when ClojureScript + React Native turned out to not be enough. 5) Kotlin will not change your mental model, if you have experience with Java, C#, Pascal, C++, and other static OOP languages with sprinkles of functional programming. If that's not your goal, then there's nothing wrong with it. 6) I haven't used Kotlin enough, and I think its a little too young to know if its choices are actually better then Java's, or C#'s choices. Though probably better then Java's. 7) I recommend when learning new languages, to pick languages which will challenge and enhance your mental models, so I recommend learning Clojure for that alone. 8) If you want to learn Android development, Java or Kotlin will do, but if you already know Java, and you're focused on learning Android, that will be enough, since really its about learning the Android SDK and environment. 9) If you're going to consider building a serious Android App, and ClojureScript + React Native was not enough, then I would consider Kotlin very heavily, as it will probably make it more fun and enjoyable, while still being robust. On Wednesday, 6 September 2017 01:09:27 UTC-7, Colin Fleming wrote: > > Kotlin offers a lot more than just less verbose code and fixing quirks. > It's a sufficiently large step up over Java that the experience of using it > is completely different, in my experience. The null-safe type system is > worth the price of entry alone. I totally recommend it for Android projects. > > Sometimes a language offers a combination of existing concepts in a > coherent package which is somehow greater than the sum of its parts - > languages don't have to be innovative to be useful, pleasant and powerful. > Clojure itself is such a language. We already had good lisps. We already > had good JVM functional languages. We already had languages with persistent > data structures. We already had languages with STM, good concurrency > support, interactive development and all the rest of it. But the pragmatic > combination of those features made (and continues to make) it very > compelling. > > Kotlin is another such language. I think there's a strong case to be made > for using React Native for mobile dev, and ClojureScript's story is very > good there. But personally I think you'd be nuts to choose JVM Clojure over > Kotlin for serious Android development. > > On 6 September 2017 at 07:04, Didier <did...@gmail.com <javascript:>> > wrote: > >> I know Java and C++. A long time ago I worked with Pascal. >>> >>> What I like about Kotlin is that it is less verbose. And Clojure is >>> of-course even less verbose. :-D >>> >> >> Oh yea, and Kotlin exists pretty much only to address Java's verbosity, >> and maybe a few small other quirks, and it did a great job at that. But you >> won't learn anything new conceptually. All you will learn is a new less >> verbose syntax for the same concepts. I honestly just hope Kotlin pushes >> future Java versions to improve on their verbosity and quirks, so that we >> don't need Kotlin in the future, but Java is not a pain to use anymore. I >> like Kotlin, but its also dumb to have a whole new JVM language works the >> same conceptually, just because Java never bothered improving on its quirks >> and verbosity. >> >> On Tuesday, 5 September 2017 04:14:33 UTC-7, Cecil Westerhof wrote: >>> >>> 2017-09-03 20:23 GMT+02:00 Didier <did...@gmail.com>: >>> >>>> Kotlin is actually officialy supported on Android, so definitly a good >>>> choice there. >>> >>> >>> I started with Kotlin. I think I first learn to write some applications >>> for Android and then decide if I want to switch to Clojure(Script). >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> That said, if you know Java, C#, C++, Pascal, or even ActionScript 3, >>>> Kotlin brings nothing new to the table conceptually. It does improve on >>>> convenience over Java though. >>> >>> >>> I know Java and C++. A long time ago I worked with Pascal. >>> >>> What I like about Kotlin is that it is less verbose. And Clojure is >>> of-course even less verbose. :-D >>> >>> -- >>> Cecil Westerhof >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "Clojure" group. >> To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com >> <javascript:> >> Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with >> your first post. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> clojure+u...@googlegroups.com <javascript:> >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Clojure" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Clojure" group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Clojure" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
