When we purchased Persistence in 2014 we engaged a Buyer’s agent. In fact I had already negotiated the sale and price directly with the owner and then we upped the price by 10% and went thru his broker and mine (my idea not his). He had an arrangement where he could get out of the brokered sale but wished to give some token amount to his broker anyway for good will.
From my point of view there was much more comfort factor in dealing with a broker when doing long distance transactions than doing everything yourself from afar. First off a friend with the same model in Nova Scotia knew of this boat and brought it to my attention as a good boat. From there we saved the cost of airfare and accommodations and did not visit the boat in advance of the sale. This likely saved us half of the broker fee all by itself. With this list there are a number of extremely knowledgeable persons who can see as much or more than I can and are scattered all over North America and beyond. Harry Hallgring visited the boat in person to lend me his thoughts. This on top of a thorough marine survey gave me the comfort I needed. Brokers. I worked with a local broker who I knew beforehand. I also listed our J/27 with the same broker to further cement our relationship. Since I do not happen to be an expert on purchasing boats in foreign countries, dealing with customs agents, finding reputable surveyors near the boat etc … this was very helpful. On top of that his office was walking distance from my bank and I was much more comfortable making the financial transactions locally than over a distance by wire etc … My buyer’s broker helped to make the transaction and importation from US to Canada a very smooth process. My broker found me a surveyor that he trusts, had all the customs dealings taken care of in advance and overall ensured a smooth transaction. It costs a buyer no more to do this than to deal directly with selling agent as the same commission is now split in two. Anyway. My dealings with brokers in this transaction and in previous ones has always been very positive Mike Persistence 1987 Frers 33 #16 Halifax, Nova Scotia http://users.eastlink.ca/~mhoyt From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dave S via CnC-List Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2016 9:28 AM To: C&c Stus List Cc: Dave S Subject: Re: Stus-List Brokers and surveyors To add to Chuck's thoughts: A buyer's agent (or even a helpful broker) will be able to provide you with information on asking and actual selling prices for broker-sold boats for the model you are after. This is a huge help as there can be a large range as we know (in 2013, it was around 30% for the models I was looking at) As mentioned, many of the boats owned by those on this list are now out of the broker market - too cheap - nonetheless, the broker can still make this info available to you. Even with a very high level of trust, every expectation you can dream of should be stated in writing, to both the broker and the surveyor. (or the seller if applicable) Good fences make good neighbours, and this is not an imposition, it protects everyone and maintains friendships. For most items, clear, friendly, communication in an email trail is fine. Surveyors/surveys are highly variable, and will not be as thorough or effective as you would like. I have read surveys while looking at boats that missed obvious problems, bent rudder shaft, (2 C&C 34s) buckled topsides at the chainplates...(several older boats with hydraulic backstay adjusters fitted) Specific known issues should be researched by the buyer and specifically referenced to the surveyor and broker - again, in writing. Forums and lists like this are fantastic sources of info, and the list members know more than surveyors, generally. (Examples would be banging kanazaki transmissions, worn folding props, rod/wire rigging, keel stub/mast step issues on 33-2, 35-3, 41, cracking keels in frozen parts of the world... - no doubt there are many many others) It is rare indeed that a surveyor will be that knowledgable or thorough with regard to a particular model. (unless he owned one, as in Chuck's case) If I were remote- buying a boat that was worth any sort of money I would make a point of inspecting it with the surveyor. You can often get a survey from the seller. If available, it makes nice light reading while you wait for your own. ;-) Already mentioned - check the paperwork for the FOB point. This is where you take title. Figure out what constitutes your acceptance of the boat's condition, document all. Already mentioned - hold back. Chuck makes an interesting point - wariness about a price drop. For someone who is handy, this might actually represent an opportunity. yards are expensive to operate and charge a lot of money, (for anything) and any sailboat can be hard to sell. Depends on the seller's frame of mind, the issue and the labour involved. (I rebuilt windstar's keel stub/maststep as much as a preventative measure as anything, and would not hesitate to buy a 33-2, 35iii, or 41 with an issue identified, provided the price had been adjusted by the C$20-30k a yard would ask for the same work.) I think the "pipe dream" when buying is the overly optimistic assessment of things like canvas, sails, upholstery/foam, prop, running rigging, galley stove, "secondary" systems and wear-out items that are normally not carefully inspected and can quickly add up to tens of thousands. (good bones are not the whole story) A surveyor can't really help much with that. Coffee's done... Dave - 33-2 windstar
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