Rick,
That 50-60K spin is pocket change relative to the cost of the hydraulic
pumps that we designed for the AC boats. 2 speed, 9 piston axial
pumps. Coffee grinder driven. The components were literally made by
the providers of F-18 flight controls, engine controls and engine
accessories. My team designed the pumps and the DC motor pumps used for
the practice boats.
The Electro Hydraulic Servo Valves (EHSV) that my former division
provided for Formula one racing were used for one race and replaced. We
sold about 50-100 units for a season of racing (depending on whether
they controlled fuel, suspension or both).
Neil Schiller
1983 C&C 35-3, #028, "Grace"
Whitehall, Michigan
WLYC
On 1/29/2019 8:45 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List wrote:
Joe;
I do agree that the foiling cats were radically different than the
conventional sailboats we are accustomed to. And the crew work and
training is more demanding than on a monohull. The J class boats have
hugely higher sheet loadings and hardware that is light years bigger
than what we have on your 35 or my 38, but the boat itself is just
bigger and not much faster. Whether a J class or a catamaran, the
sailing is still pretty much the same as on one of our boats.
Did you realize that Oracle was actually the faster boat in the AC
finals in Bermuda? Her average top speed was a smidgen over 41 knots,
while the Kiwi boat was between 40.5 and 41. Which is, on the whole,
pretty cool since none of the races was run in over about 12 knots of
wind.
So why did Oracle lose? Certainly there were slight difference in the
foils, the soft headsails, and the leg powered hydraulics of the Kiwis
gave a lot more consistent power for foils and trimmers than the
coffee grinders on Oracle. But from watching the races on the Jumbo
Tron at the AC pavilion, I’m pretty much convinced the margin was crew
practice and work load management.
The skipper of Oracle was driving. He was calling tactics. He was
trimming the foils. He had a really cool steering wheel designed by
BMW to control all that, plus a suite of gauges and Heads-Up displays
that would probably rival an F18 fighter/bomber. In one race Oracle
lost because, when they tacked the boat, they went about 15’ outside
the boundary of the race course and had to do a 360. (The promo stuff
in the BMW display area talked about how the boat positon on the race
course and other tactical data was updated like 1000 times per minute.
How could you run outside the boundary?) In pretty much every race
they fell off the foils once or twice while tacking and jibing. And
every time they fell off the foils (and dropped to about 9 knots) the
Kiwis picked up a couple of hundred yards before Oracle got back up to
speed. Spithill was just flat too busy and had too many tasks to manage.
The Kiwis almost never fell off the foils. The race commentators
thought the bicycle powered hydraulics had something to do with it
because trimming and changing foils was faster and perhaps had more
reserve pressure in the accumulators. But the skipper of the Kiwi boat
was calling tactics and trimming the foils. The helmsman was doing
only that – driving. Someone else was trimming the main. When the
helmsman ran to the cockpit on the other side of the boat a few
seconds before each tack or jibe, the skipper held the wheel to keep
the boat in a straight line until the helmsman was back in place. So I
think superior crew work and coordination, and probably more practice
during the LV Cup races, was the winning margin for the Kiwis.
Pretty similar to the J Class or 12 meter boats – just about 4 or 5
times faster.
Three of us on the list went out into the sound to watch the J Class
races in Bermuda. And I’ll admit that it was probably my most favorite
part of the trip. We are all familiar with the groaning of a loaded
jib sheet when you are grinding in those last few inches. Well, on a J
class the winch is about 4 feet tall and the sheet is an inch or more
in diameter. And the groaning of the winch was loud enough the be
heard from my boat 100 or more yards away. The J boats are romantic –
majestic even – but one of them blew out a spinnaker just after
rounding the windward mark we were near – and the spin that exploded
probably cost $50 0r $60K. “Real” sailors can only fantasize about
sailing one. Hull speed on my boat is a bit over 7 knots – on a J
class about 40% more. Romantic as it is, J class or 12 meter racing is
basically a very expensive, though sexy and more closely competitive,
version of the beer can racing we all do.
Now I don’t think I would go out and buy a foiling boat. There ARE
options: a Moth, one of the mid-20’ foiling monohulls Benneteau
announced it planned to build, an A Cat (think 40% scale AC
catamaran, 20+ knots in 12 knots of wind, and a race ready used one
can be had for about 20K), whatever the new maker calls the Gunboat G4
(though a Gunboat 55 or 60 might be cool if I ever win big in the
lottery). Those boats are just too athletic for a fat 68 year old
cruiser, and take too much practice and crew work for racing in the
occasional charity regatta. As Charlie said, “To each his own”.
The boats are all different, but the tactics, the teamwork, and the
skills needed to be successful at sailing are pretty constant.
Rick Brass
Washington, NC
*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of
*Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List
*Sent:* Tuesday, January 29, 2019 9:11 AM
*To:* 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
*Cc:* Della Barba, Joe <joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: AC75 boats
Foiling cats running around at 30-50 knots are an entirely different
universe. Racing them is a sport of some kind, but it does not
resemble what we think of as sailboat racing whatsoever to me. Among
all the other reasons, the traditional AC race was between boats that
were very close in speed. Absolutely superb tactics and boat handling
were required to keep ahead of the other boat. It was pretty rare for
there to be enough speed difference for a good crew to lose to an
average one. 6.9 knots losing to 7.1 knots is one thing, the 7.1 knot
boat is just one mistake away from losing. 45 vs. 55 knots, well you
can still crash but it isn’t at all the same.
Joe
Coquina
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every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal
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