I really don't see how it is off topic as it is relative to CSS and
CSS-hacks in general.
From: http://www.css-discuss.org/policies.html#offensensitivity
"We encourage discussion and debate, and don't mind if it gets a bit
heated. However, this does not mean you can flame other list members. If
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However, if the moderators label it as such then that is that.
If anyone is interested in continuing the Discussion, as I knew at least
a few are, I have posted it here:
http://blog.code-artist.com/?p=5
Dwight
Carole wrote:
As our Moderator said, this is off-topic for the CSS-D list. However,
you are right. My point of view, code for the current browsers,
ignore NN4, IE anything. When people discover their browsers don't
work, they'll upgrade.
Best,
Carole
On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 15:51:16 -0700, Haoshiro
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I know most people will find this to be a horrid idea, but doesn't
anyone else think it's time to deprecate to IE5 (all platforms).
I have been working in web development professionally since 1999 and
at that time I had to practically make two separate versions of a
site, one for IE and one for NS4. Cross-browser compatibility was a
necessary nightmare every web developer had to deal with; Opera
didn't even have a complete DOM.
Now it's July of 2005 - 5-6 years since the release of IE5 - and yet
still spend time working on IE5 compatibility, specifically IE5/Mac.
Consumers are an ignorant lot, work in customer support for a few
months and this will become quickly evident. They don't know how to
upgrade, many can't install/uninstall software without a very
detailed guide and explanation and even then it must be repeated
each time an action is necessary.
I personally believe Web Developers are *responsible* to educate the
Internet user and to push web technologies forward. This cannot be
done by constantly remaining backward-compatible. The consumer
won't know there is something better if they are not told.
People want the Internet, people need the Internet, if web
developers stopped supporting browsers that are holding
technological progress back people *would* do as they are told -
they would upgrade.
My stance on browsers is this:
- Opera users have bought their browser and the majority WILL upgrade
to newer versions. Compatibility can be kept to the current version
or a version on 6-12 months old.
- Linux users will use Firefox, those who don't may use Lynx... are
you going to support Lynx specifically?
- Windows users - aka The Masses - will be using some version of IE.
If they are not running IE6 then they should be. If they can't
because they are running Windows 95 then they should upgrade or
switch to Linux if they can. If you are going to support those
running Windows 95 then you should use 640x480 with 8-bit color
depth and since you are doing that go ahead and only use HTML3.2
with no CSS.
- Mac should be running X with Safari. If they are not then they
are likely using Mac OS 8/9 which were released in 1999/2000. If
your support is going back that far then support Netscape 4 also,
and if you are going there then be sure you work in 640x480 with
8-bit color depth - and don't use CSS.
The point I'm trying to make here is that for progress to really be
made on the web we need to transition the ignorant and stubborn into
modern times. If developers do not educate consumers and our
clients then the web will not move forward - at least not with much
speed at all.
Application developers do not restrain themselves nearly as much as
we as web developers due. They are quick to increase requirements
and consumers are fairly used to getting phased out. Many new
releases of applications require a current operating system -
Windows 2K/XP or OSX.
When will we do the same?
Regards,
Dwight Brown
aka "Haoshiro"
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