-Caveat Lector-
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 18:25:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Party of Citizens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [U-S-A] Re: [biblicalpoliticaltheory] Re: The Deal
********* <http://www.geocities.com/partyofcitizens> **********
On Sun, 8 Jun 2003 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Brad:
>
> How do you know what Paul had in mind when he wrote Romans 13 apart from what he
> says in Romans 13? You cannot. You cannot even prove he knew about them.
>
> It is clear FROM THE PASSAGE that Paul was not talking of the
"civil government" in Rome when authoring Romans 13, for Rome certainly
did not enforce God's Law (verse 2), did cause fear of good behavior
(verse 3), did not praise righteousness (verse 3) and did not avenge
evildoers as God defined good and evil (verse 4).
Thank God for George Bush, eh? And do you see how eagerly all those
religiocrats in U-S-A rush forward with their faith-based public works
proposals for Whitehouse consideration? Consider that just one pagan
Canadian university <http://www.UniverCity.ca> is literally building a
'shining city on a hill' (Burnaby Mountain) as a cultural manifestation
of its salt and light for North America. Now how would the good-doers of
Bob Jones U or Liberty U do by comparison?
What would Jesus build?
POC
Indeed, part of who was oppressing the Christians that Paul did not want them
seeking vengeance from in chapter 12 was the Roman "government." Instead, Paul tells
them to trust God's minister of vengeance, which is the properly instituted civil
government.
>
> Instead, Paul was giving a declaration of the basis of all authorities' (plural)
> power in Romans 13, giving Christians the hope that it was these authorities through
> which they could expect temporal salvation from their oppressors.
>
> Brad, let us stick with sola scriptura, ok? Quite frankly, I do not trust
> uninspired men, their histories or their correlations based on timing or otherwise.
>
> Tim
>
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> I'll make that deal with you, Tim, but I would like to expand it. Let us not just
> quote the Bible solely, but let us interpret it correctly. Let us not form our
> political opinions first and then search through the Bible to find verses that,
> taken out of their historical context, seem to support the political opinions we
> have already formed. (If anyone does not understand hermeneutics, or biblical
> interpretation, there is book titled "How To Read the Bible For All Its Worth" that
> is an excellent guide.) People use the Bible to seemingly support almost anything,
> which is why there are so many "Christian" sects. We should not merely point to a
> passage and interpret it word for word without understanding the context.
>
> In a previous email, I discussed Romans 13:1-7 and explained the occassional nature
> of that passage, but let me explain further here. Not only must we consider that
> Paul was writing to Christians living in a pagan Empire, we also must consider
> specific events occurring at the time of the writing. Prior to Paul writing Romans,
> there had been tax riots instigated by certain Jewsih groups in neighboring towns.
> These riots had gotten out of hand, and the government was apprehending those Jews.
> Paul had this in mind when he wrote, "For rulers hold no terror for those who do
> right, but for those who do wrong...If you owe taxes, pay taxes," (vv. 3, 7) This
> passage had everything to do with the historical occassion he was writing in. Paul
> was not writing a universal civil mandate for Christians living under any type of
> government. Think about the statement, "For rulers hold no terror for those who do
> right." If that was a universal statement, then the apostles would never !
have had anything to fear when spreading the gospel, but we know from Acts they were
persistently persecuted, even by Paul himself, prior to his conversion. Consider
Paul's other statements regarding civil authorities, written on other occassions to
different audiences. In 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 he writes, "We do, however, speak a
message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of
this age, who are coming to nothing. No, we declare God's wisdom, a message that has
been hidden and that God destined for our Glory before time began. None of the rulers
of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of
glory." In Acts 5:29, the apostles state, "We must obey God rather human beings."
Obviously, neither Paul nor the rest of the apostles regarded Paul's statement, "For
the one in authority is God's servant for your good," (v.4) as a universal statement.
He wrote Romans 13:1-7 as a means to insure the Christi!
ans in Rome would not participate in the rebellious tax riots occurri
ng
> at that time. He did not write it as a mandate for Christians everywhere living
> under any type of government.
>
> So, let us quote Scripture and use it correctly, rather than use it incorrectly to
> supoort the political opinions we have already formed.
>
>
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