-Caveat Lector- from alt.conspiracy ----- As always, Caveat Lector. Om K ----- <A HREF="aol://5863:126/alt.conspiracy:526788">Online cults</A> ----- Subject: Online cults From: Underground Panther <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Thu, May 27, 1999 4:41 AM Message-id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello,This website: http://www.erols.com/pumacat Outlines my experinces in the Church of Satan with a level head,It explains why the Church of Satan is a cult from a person who was involved.They are all very upset at my page and will seek to discredit me,or say I have sour grapes ect.They are just disturbed at what I am pointing out.They call speaking out against the cult,shit disturbing. One thing apparent in the music put out by Satanists,or certain types of wannabes, the real problem with it people always overlook,isn't the violent lyrics.It's way more subtle,it's the unresoved angst that is glorifed in such music. Everything needs a beginning, middle and end this it taught in drama,theatre,life to be psychologically healthy. Bad feelings must end,depressed people think thier bad feelings will never end.This is not a easy concept to grasp for some people. The musicians like Marylin Manson,or Nine Inch Nails (Satanic priests)do not seek to resolve thier angst in thier music,They keep angst perptually at high levels and deliberatly un reasoned out ,un directed at why they feel angst . It leaves the listener to fill in the blanks on why they are so much in angst.Teens too often put themselves there.It never ends. Teens assume they listen because they are feeling sympathy to thier pain in life. But instead they get stuck in a vauge neverending almost addictive angst that never resolves itself.It manifests like depression. I know some teens will get mad and defensive about what I have said about thier fave tunes.Do get over my critizisms of your idols and try to understand me ,ok. Angst that is not directed at somthing in a clear way.This keeps people listening though supposed sympathy,from resolving thier own angst feelings for themselves.Instead they just get stuck and float in this poisoned 'sympathy' without realizing it is sick because the musician wants to confound,confuse and create delimma and have catchy melodies to go along with it so you will listen and enjoy it.. Satanists get off on psychological abuse.And psychological abuse is totally legal.They don't need money,they need fresh minds to play with. That is why they recruit in chat rooms and alt.satanism. They are crypto fascist but they aren't for white supremacy they are for sociopathic supremacy.Smart sociopaths obey and know how to get around the law and look so 'cultured' act so subtle but really be a cruel sadist inside.. Rambling on about thier 'Satanic genes' that make them superior to the 'herds'of everyone else. They actually get off on mindgames and glorify those who enjoy it most or perform it best.Machivelli,Darwin(social darwinism too) and Hitler are often quoted by them as exaples of great 'satanic 'thinkers. This is what,I,through my experinces with them and Anton LaVey's own words are led to understand what the church's 'primary objective 'is.To create delimma,confound,confuse in other words screw woith people,abuse them psychologically enjoy it and teach others to develop 'thick skins' so they can take it or learn to get off on it too.. Read Satan speaks then compare the additudes in that with the Satanic Bible.Feel how he hates women and people. This is a cult.And they don't have to be killing babies to hurt you. That is what makes certain music and cults dangerous,It's not just the lyrics or symbols they decorate themselves with .It is the intent and astmosphere they seek to create and NEVER seek to resolve in itself that can make music or any kind of symbols or beliefs sickening.. Feel free to ask questions but send me NO conversion messages please. Respect my choice to stay out of all organized or belief based religion until I heal from my past. Thank you, Panther ===== from: http://www.erols.com/pumacat <A HREF="http://www.erols.com/pumacat/">The Bifid Barb -- Is the CoS a Cult? </A> ----- Underground Panther, previous member of the Church of Satan, looks at cultic tendencies in that organization, and explains recent posts on alt.satanism. "It is better to be useless to someone who would be a user, than to feel it is ok to be used because you're afraid of being useless" -- The Panthers ===== Is the Church of Satan a Cult? 1.Introduction 2.Three Common Traits of Cults 3.Levels of Influence and Persuasion 4.Other Cult Issues 5.Personality Change and Behavior Modification 6.Conclusion: Who is Most at Risk? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Introduction There are many Satanic groups out there, nowadays. At first, groups like the SanFrancisco-based Church of Satan (founded by Anton LaVey) were perceived as 'sanitized' versions ofSatanism that were sane enough, or at least above-board. Over the years, that particular grouphas become more secretive, cynical, elitist, and cultic, continuing even now, after LaVey's death,under the leadership of Blanche Barton (LaVey's consort, and mother of his heir.) I was amember of this group and left in disgust, amazed at the subtlety of group pressures and theinsidiousness of the seemingly purposeless manipulation. Those who consider themselvesSatanists, Satan-friendly, or Satanic, and who are considering involvement in a group, as well asthose who are more generally concerned about cults (Christian, Satanic, or whatever), couldprofit by taking a look at the problems with what is now Blanche Barton's Church of Satan. To the outside observer, or even to those who were in Anton/Blanche's Church of Satan recentlyor who still are, peripherally, certain behaviors are seen as confusing, as in the censorship of achat-room or various ass-kissing tendencies -- this contradicts the seeming individualism espousedin the Satanic Bible. You may compare this to many dysfunctional families which behave in a waythat is extremely controlling and disturbing - too much pressure on doing things the family wayand incredible criticism for taking too much of a non-family attitude towards things. Compare it toother cults. Does anyone expect a multi-level marketing cult to tolerate people who aren'tenthused enough about the product, or who are critical of all the meetings and time expectedaway from non-cult activities? What about cultic Christians? Do you expect those who are cultiststo treat a non-cultist as a human being with a mind of their own, or dignity despite disagreements, unless that is part of a larger manipulative environment created by the cult? Don't you expectpressure from these people, sooner or later? Well Anton LaVey's/Blanche Barton's Church is verymuch like these examples, they just have very different beliefs and a different system than someother cults you might be aware of. Some cults and cult-like groups have aspects to them which are designed to counteract certain'problems' that cults are perceived to have, at least for PR purposes. Dysfunctional families can bebrutal to a member who considers joining a cult, even if they are in a cult themselves. ManyMulti-Level Marketing (MLM) cults or product-selling cults try not to get into the problems ofpyramid schemes, which are illegal. The personality-cult mind-control aspects of suchhigh-pressure members can be tailored so as to disguise, limit, contain or distort this so that itlooks like a particularly product line thing instead of something that sounds like a cult. ManyChristians, in or outside of cults, maintain that a charismatic leader is NOT Jesus, and cannot bethe final spokesman for the Bible itself, and that individual conscience in their individual heartsshould determine what Jesus/The Bible means in their life, so long as they are true to the Bible. Inthe LaVey/Barton church, a creed of rampant individualism and atheistic tendencies areinstitutionalized, and you can see how this might protect such a group from total sheep-likefanaticism or belief and action based on "the revelation of Satan to Blanche." These protections: focusing on a 'great' product, putting authority in heaven or in the heart,individualism or atheism -- put some constraints on how new members are dealt with, and itseems that these things could be used by sane groups to keep leadership from dominating in anunhealthy way, and to avoid cultic tendencies. Groups like the San Francisco-based Church ofSatan, run by Blanche Barton, despite these apparent protections, are not immune to having culticdevelopments, or becoming cults, and in fact for every 'protection' they maintain, in those groupsand factions which are more controlling, pressured, or manipulative, there are tendencies thatreinforce cult-like behavior. If I knew more about the Temple of Set, I could comment on what Ifeel they do or what they have failed to do to prevent these scathing criticisms, but for themoment I will just say certain practices involving the hierarchy, mentors, and paranormalexperiments could blur the reality or individual judgement of someone ready to become a cultist,and are questionable, at the very least, from my outside view. I have experience with Blanche'sgroup as a member, so I focus upon them. The problem with cults is not in the belief system of the group in question, but with damagingpsychological techniques and group pressures designed to alienate and distort the individualityand personality of the members. Eventually this makes members easier to deploy by the cultleaders. This is done by subtly and gradually alienating the member from his old behavior andattitudes, previous contacts, and outside world interests. Then members are brought to associatetheir life and success more with the group or leader, as group pressures increase to reward thesechanges and punish dissent, and as dependency upon group identity and rewards increases. Manipulation like this exists upon a whole spectrum of levels of influence and persuasion. Withdestructive cults, the manipulation is very deceptive and the process of changing people'sperceptions and attitudes is subtly controlled. Someone, somewhere, in a destructive cult isenjoying manipulating people's identities and being a jerk about it -- they thrive on the control andpower at other people's expense, even those whom they say they trust and are allied with. LaVey/Blanche's group is set up well to use thought reform techniques, and in fact they do usethem. 'Cult' can mean a hierarchical group that has a system of beliefs or worship. There isanother connotation, that of thought reform techniques or personal manipulation of followers in aharmful way. If you don't like the buzzword, then get over the word and look at the group. Research several sources (other than sources from the group in question.) If you disagree, andjoin, then you do so at your own risk. At least you were informed. Learn more about groupdynamics and thought reform tactics and the utilization of group pressure in very manipulativeand damaging ways. IF you see what I am saying, then you know what to do. On the continuum of influence and persuasion tactics, LaVey/Blanche's Church is on the side ofthought reform -- which is the extreme, beyond even propaganda tactics and out-and-outindoctrination. If you don't even like advertising and find propaganda to be beneath you, youhave MUCH more manipulation in store with associations with Anton LaVey/Blanche Barton'sChurch of Satan. If you want you can call it a group that has way too many (if not all) of thenecessary conditions in place, and uses techniques of, thought reform, instead of calling it a cult,that is fine by me. I think all of the conditions are in place, and the level of persuasion andinfluence is beyond propaganda or indoctrination, as it is way more deceptive than mereindoctrination. You are told the group has no interest in changing your personality to suit itsneeds, that your individuality is not being manipulated as part of learning what they have to offer,you may be told you are dealing with individual manipulators you are encouraged to manipulateback or to develop a thick skin -- that the organization has no interest in manipulating YOU, per se. The truth is they know they may decide to have your personality molded as they see fit byalienating you from the outside world and past interests, and focusing you on their manufacturedconflicts, and new ideas and behaviors, purposely to gain control over your mind, identity, andpersonality. They will make you defensive about who and what you are, eventually, if you get indeep enough, and then they will try to convince you that you already were what they wanted youto become. I.e. that you were a born Satanist, or may have a Satanic gene. Back to the Top Like other groups that use thought reform tactics, LaVey's/Blanche's group is: 1.Authoritarian in structure. The seriousness to which the group lives up to its self-describeddictatorial structure isn't always apparent at the beginning of involvement -- reading the SatanicBible, for instance, or introductory literature and interaction in other public forums likeal t.satanism may give you the impression that the authoritarianism is mainly a pose or elitistattitude, instead of a very real component of the organization; over time the authoritarian attitudesprove to be more important than your personal, individual interests. 2.Appears to be innovative and exclusive (elite). This semblance is clung to fanatically bysome members or title holders at first glance, while other title holders seem silent on the elitenessand bashing that goes on -- until you step out of line or otherwise get closer to Central or more inon activities and official communications. (Private e-lists, later private correspondences, etc.. Asyou get more involved the eliteness of the hierarchy is more and more of a pressuring and'bashing' influence and your striving to route out non-eliteness in yourself beco mes more and moreself-censorious.) 3.Tends to have a double set of ethics (in this case, the double standard is most obvious forproven members/higher ups vs. lower downs) -- i.e. the hierarchy can never be accused of beingtoo much of a psychic vampire of its members, it is ok to manipulate one way, once inside, but therules may change, or it is arbitrary and only the higher ups can claim to truly understand LaVey'swill of the matter, LaVey's (or Blanche's) MEANING -- although few people join the SanFrancisco Church of Satan to be told the totality of LaVey's meaning on how to behave or thinkwhen there is a difference of opinion that matters to the hierarchy! The double standard hitsoutsiders, as they are expected to think for themselves, and are attacked for not being elite orcreative or intelligent enough to question. But insiders are expected to believe the 'elite' ideas ofthe hierarchy, or are treated like dirt. Intelligence, creativity, and productivity must be subvertedto the needs of the organization, in which case any means are justified, in the end. Back to the Top Levels of Influence and Persuasion If you want to look particularly at what is thought reform, compare it to influence and persuasion through propaganda, indoctrination, or advertising, as it relates to LaVey/Barton's group: I.The focus of the body of knowledge of thought reform centers on changing people without their knowledge. In other words, for this group, Lesser Black Magic is used againstmembers. Any manipulations against the masses of people on the outside (propaganda) is really avery limited focus, comparatively, and most people would not join to be indoctrinated into thisgroup's values, as most who want to join do so because of the individualism espoused in theSatanic Bible. Advertising, in comparison, is regulated by consumer law and involves a product,instead of personality and behavior control for its own sake. So Blanche's group is in league withthought reform groups, here, compared to the other types of persuasion and influence. All thegroup has to offer is information on Lesser Black Magic, and that information is learned bybecoming a guinea pig. There are more things involved in thought reform, however. II.The direction and degree of exchange is nil. One-sided. This occurs when you questionhow your membership (or other information you provide) is used or molded by the hierarchy, as itIS a dictatorial and secretive organization. You will be told how hierarchical it is if you dare tosuggest someone is "just a priest, so what, I am an individual, screw him, I like other priestsbetter." You may be told simply to ignore the priest, or associate with others, but this amounts tobeing told to shut up or be labeled more and more inferior. On a simple level, no one is voted bythe membership to lead them, but more importantly, any input is squelched to the point of it notbeing worth saying, unless it is an offer for you to cooperate and put in more effort and trust. Instead of earning trust, they request you trust them, as if you were inferior if you expected themto trust you by showing you they are productive and worth listening to. The degree ofone-sidedness is greater than the one-sidedness of advertising, propaganda, or indoctrination, atthe point of hierarchical issues, at the priest level and higher. You are suggested how to play bythe rules, and MUST. Even if they contradict or are not upheld by your priest, etc.. or aremodified later on as you get further within. III.Ability for the organization to change is artificially restrained. Blanche (and LaVeybefore her) claim Satanism is the same as it always was, and always will be, having no need tochange. They change as to whether grottoes are shut down, in use, or not the thrust oforganizational activity. They change when Blanche asks for money for the Black house or isselling the LaVey archives that the Black house money was supposed to go into. This is relatedto getting money for the moment, or improving thought reform effectiveness by reducing criticismof out-of-control grottoes, or by increasing group pressure, or by appealing to loyalty andcommitment by members when the organization needs money or control. Alt.satanism and chatrooms can be used instead of grottoes to form group pressure, for instance, as technology evolveda new tool. Change occurs rarely, however, and the organization remains fairly rigid. The groupis not merely indoctrinating or propagandizing, and the style is different. Indoctrination tacticscan allow for change through very formal channels via written suggestions to higher-ups. Blanche's group is too dictatorial to need such accountability to members, however. They usepropaganda and advertising, but are more interested in influencing members, so changes based onproducts, consumer law, consumer complaints and requests, demands, or changing political tides,are not the major focus of change. The real change is in the identity and personality of themember. IV.The group takes an authoritarian and hierarchical stance. There is no full awareness onthe part of the 'learner' (member) of lesser black magic in the group as to what kind ofmanipulations he should expect to be subjected to, from the leaders. Often, in mereindoctrination, the individual is aware of the degree of hierarchical and authoritarian stance takenby the group, and the nature of what he is supposed to do, and where it is designed to lead him. Similarly with propaganda, directed towards the masses. Advertising instructs to persuade theconsumer or buyer, through comparison. Again this group is clearly set up more along the linesof a group using thought reform. Members aren't stock holders or employees (they receive nodividends or pay), and they aren't joining to be cannon fodder for an army, and most don't want tobe told who to be or how to act. Instead, the member is a subject for covert, authoritarian,psychological and group tactics. Being overtly told to change ideas, attitudes, or personalitywould be resisted, but the hierarchical attitudes are either accepted, or not. If they are accepted,then covert persuasions to change are utilized by the hierarchy. V.Often a group using thought reform attempts to retain people forever. All religions dothis, it would seem, and this is why this quality of thought reform groups is interdependent uponthe other qualities. Hence the 'Satanic lifestyle' and the 'born Satanist.' Retaining people foreveraids thought reform, and so on the spectrum of manipulation and pressure tactics of persuasionand influence, retaining people forever is on the extreme side. Christianity wants to retainconverts forever, but a particular protestant Church may not care if someone joins a similarprotestant Church with a different founder, if 'salvation' is not jeopardized. All cults, even theones that REALLY want to keep people forever, and kidnap runaways, will kick out orexcommunicate some members at points, and in many cults people leave after a shortinvolvement, with hard-core members staying for longer periods. Some types of member are lessuseful or difficult to deal with, so a cult may decide to cut its losses. But the intent of theLaVey/Barton Church of Satan is to BREED a sense of fatalistic determinism, genetic eliteness,elitism, and supremacy to such a pressuring degree that leaving would be consigning yourself tofailure in the outside word that is weak, 'herd' and inferior. Satanists are said to be born, andthough it is said 'you can always leave' (many cults say this, actually) it is also said in the samebreath, that if you do nothing along the lines of getting kicked out or sending a letter ofresignation, you will be on their lists forever. I would say that keeping people forever appliesmore to the higher levels of the group. The lower levels (Grotto Masters, and common members)are a kind of weeding-out level where you are tested to see if you are not suitable formanipulations, in which case you may be ignored or kicked out. I believe they wants to havepeople's MINDS forever, or at least long after they leave, if they do leave. Compare this toindoctrination in the Marines, where instruction is contractual and consensual, in other words, youare paid and retirement is expected at some point and you sign up for training in techniques, etc. In Barton's group you are manipulated without there ever needing to be a course or trainingsession with a higher up -- they are not instructional in that way, and you do not get paid for yourdevotion. Propaganda expects that the learner will be supportive and engrossed, while thoughtreform intends to keep the mind of the member forever -- a subtle difference. Of course, you canturn off the tv if you don't want an advertisement, accept or ignore the influence. In a thoughtreform environment, the ideas are intended to be with you, and the learning techniques andinfluences, pressures, and persuasion is designed to effect you even with non-group interactions,or with 'casual' interactions with associates of the group, and also if you work, have friends, etc. This Satanic cult varies between propaganda level of relationship with the member, to thoughtcontrol, to education, depending upon the specific interaction between a supporter and theorganization, and how deeply involved the person is. VI.A group using thought reform (it comes as no surprise) is deceptive. Even indoctrination isnot as deceptive as thought reform in the sense that you are told you will become X and you signup, etc., or you are in a setting of learning and you are persuaded. In thought reform, you canthink you are doing something that is NOT an attempt at persuasion, and it IS, and you didn'tknow you signed up, and have no clue you are being punished, prodded, or pushed. Granted, weall can be deceptive, and so can a Sunday School teacher or a Satanist. But as a point to notice,when advertising is deceptive, it is usually to only select positive views of the product, and it is apotential, not a main interest of advertising, which CAN be deceptive, but wants you to get theproduct name right, and what it does, usually. And it's manipulation isn't about personalitymodification!! Propaganda exaggerates, to be sure, but out and out deception as a major tool ofpropaganda is a thought reform level of persuasion used on the masses. Regular education isNOT deceptive by nature. Thought reform is deceptive about the fact you are changing yourpersonality to fit the needs of the organization at the whims of the hierarchy whom you trust andusually do not think want that kind of control over you. Blanche's group is deceptive, but put it incontext. Deception alone is just one quality of a thought reform environment that is very useful tothe controller. These things work together dynamically. The point of the deception: manipulationand control -- this is the issue. VII.The extent of learning in thought reform is the ability to influence an individualized target, and there is a hidden agenda. This is EXTREMELY relevant to LaVey/Barton's group. You will be changed one step at a time to become deployable to serve leaders. You may becomemore and more like Tani, Balaack, or some quiet behind the scenes observer or apologist for thehierarchy. You have to use your judgment on this. Who knows what is in store for you, from thehierarchy's point of view. I have seen this happen to an extent that is too great to be simpleloyalty or cohesiveness or obedience. People involved with the group over time repeatedlyrationalize and excuse things about the hierarchy or their actions, or the things they do, whichthey would not have liked before involvement. Even people who join and already like or acceptthe environment of the group I describe, learn to expand their horizons as to how they manipulate,and they often loose some of their previous interests or are encouraged to slowly erode them. Look to see it, and you may see it. If you don't, then at least consider the other qualities ofthought reform versus other levels of persuasion. VIII.Intolerance -- no respect for differences. This helps a group using thought reform, and thisgroup definitely uses disrespect for differences as a tool, particularly on matters they choose tosee as important to their designs. Communistic types, Fascist types, and apolitical types seem tobe tolerated. However, there is increasing intolerance of an individual member's flaws,weaknesses, misgivings, doubts about leadership, standards of conduct, expectations from people,herd pursuits like TV, criticisms or reality checks about LaVey (some mere Book Club !!), etc. This creates quite a bit of pressure, particularly in form of elitist ego-bashing. The elitist mayego-bash a member, but the member may easily ego-bash himself, thus helping the process along.Members forget why they joined and how manipulative guilt is in Christian groups that they hate. The intolerance isn't limited or focused upon lessening opposition, as with propaganda, or toputting down competition, as in advertising. Intolerance toward internal psychological doubtsabout loyalty increases as you get involved, and intolerance towards dissent on key issues iscrucial to the group, to a degree NOT based solely in dealing with 'enemies' like the ToS orChristians or opponents, but this comes up even when the issue is solely between MEMBERS. Of course, propagandic hatred of construed or very real enemies is whipped up to a frenzy atpoints, and putting down competition can become an obsession in the group, and this adds to thepressures specifically related to thought reform usage of intolerance. Apparently, diversity ofpolitics is allowed to the extent that such a diversity is not a threat to hierarchical control -- thepolitics that matters to the cult. IX.Methods of thought reform include improper and unethical techniques -- as in pantypissing to show devotion to the leader, non-consenting personality molding from the hierarchy orleader (Blanche Barton has been reading EVERY one of the Active Membership Forms, for quitesome time, according to Priest Balaack, Reverend Ventrue of Satannet, and web master used byCentral Grotto of Church of Satan, who had the honor of meeting Anton LaVey in person. Baalack's form was 14 pages long, when asked by us about the form, and other members report30 or 40 page Active Membership Forms.) Anything from manufacturing a crisis to flattery tototalitarian pressures pointed towards willing and supportive, reasonable volunteers (by scoldingvolunteers who aren't even being unreasonable, etc.) used in an unethical or improper way maymean ATTEMPTING TO GAIN CONTROL OF PERSONALITY AND MIND THROUGHMENTAL TERROR, MISDIRECTION, AND BREAKING THE PERSONALITY OF THEMEMBER, AS NEEDED. When we say unethical, we aren't talking about consensual sodomy orjust being a jackass, we are talking about attempts to brainwash. By disorienting the personality,and then introducing changes to the personality, and solidifying loyalty and devotion for thepurposes of control over the member's mind, thought reform is very damaging to an individual. Itstunts people, at best, and ruins them, at worse. Your own personality and identity (howeverchaotic or shaky) is way too precious to subject it to being stunted, toyed with, or destroyed by afriend or lover, much less an impersonal organization using techniques specifically designed to dothis for the sake of their power trip, and using every bit of information you give them tomanipulate you, as they see fit. This is NOT just a game of 'learn how con games work' this isyour life. The San Fransisco-based Church of Satan, as run by LaVey and now by Blanche Barton, has stepped over the line and joined the list of groups that have dangerous cultic tendencies. Like many dysfunctional families which function as if they were small cults, protecting family members from being revealed as abusers or criminals, sometimes exerting thought reform pressures, notjust typical cultural programming and dogmatic upbringing, this is not a joking matter. The groupis indeed a cult in the pejorative sense of that word. Not just any group becomes a cult, and not allradical, fringe, or weird and hierarchical groups have such negative cultic tendencies. Not all dysfunctional families are small cults, and not all MLM, anti-Christian, Satanic, or conservativeChris tian groups need be cultic in the sense I am using the word, either. The potential for danger is great. Back to the Top Other Cult Issues Some other things associated with cults: Recruitment: "Well to understand Satanism just read the Satanic Bible." How many times has that been said inchat rooms or alt.satanism? Why isn't _Satan Speaks_ recommended as first reading? Or TaniJantsang? Maybe because it's not reasonable or convincing enough or pleasing or flatteringenough or making as much common sense like the _Satanic Bible_ to a new recruit? Recruitment becomes an issue when a group wants more people to manipulate, get kicks out of controlling, or get money. Manipulation and psychological dependance are the issue with cultic relationships, regardless of how involved with recruitment a group or person is. The Satanic Bible does NOT give you an accurate picture of the type of group LaVey and Blanche Barton created. Inprisonment/Extreme Loyalty: "Either you are with us or you are not." What a victim stance!! Oh the detractors ..so manyenemies these elitists have, more than a sprinkle....WHY! Pressure pressure pressure. "Leave atanytime."Hmm they have never sent us, whom all the LaVeyans on alt.satanism call shitdisturbers, a letter kicking us out, is it because they have given up on manipulating us? Weobviously question the Church's validity and purpose and openly dislike and disagree with thechurch yet they haven't excommunicated us. They DID excommunicate Rick Rinker (KarlaLaVey supporter) -- we helped bust him for spreading info. He still believes LaVey is valid, I think. It would make them look like a cult if we were more quiet and then were excommunicatedfor questioning group tactics. Encouraging the idea that being in the specific group is the onlyreal worthwhile way to live is the dangerous manipulation, especially when coupled with othertactics. Physical aspects of enforced loyalty and membership are not required to bepsychologically manipulative and coercive. Attempts to psychologically imprison people can bejust as dangerous as physical coersion. Requests to do things for the org as a way to increase the manipulative hold of the group: I was asked to do an article for Not Like Most magazine. I was asked to do a book review forthe Black Flame. Not right off but when I got involved and had already put up a not asked forweb site, and showed support (for free) I was asked to join the S-word e-list. Which led to mydisgust of the group. As I questioned the trustworthiness of various members of the hierarchy,Magistra Nadramia indicated that if I was more productive and shared my successes with thehierarchy, I would see that the group was indeed productive and worthwhile. It seemed thesolution to my criticisms was for me to contribute more of my life to the organization. Divine leadership: Sure LaVey never claimed "divinity" but his AMAZING insight and grasp of the importance of his"satanism" and it's impact in the Satanic new world order outlined in pentagonal revisionism, therules of the earth, etc., and the way LaVeyans tout this sure sets the dead old codger up to begodlike -- look at his fan books look at how propagandic it is set up to be, notice theheadquarters' address is always there, for those ready to subject themselves to group membership. 'Special status' of the founder or leader is suitable, in the place of divinity. Remember Stalin and Hitler? Exploitation: How many girls adopt "Satanic witch" attire to get ahead, at work to get a date, thinking dressingwith an old geezer's beauty tips that reflect HIS tastes would do anything better for them thanwhat they do for themselves! How many women have explored their submissive side when beforeinvolvement they didn't know they HAD one? What about the convenient interview of laveypraising co-dependency. What about the article on sycophants? Yet the SB touts itsindividuality. What about all the manipulation tactics glorified in various other group materials,including the panty pissing article in _Satan Speaks_? Exclusivity: We're IT, True Satanists the alien elite blah blah blah. Sounds like cult talk to me. OOOh the evilherd....they can't fathom our insights.....uh huh Authoritarian Structure: Level 1,2,3,4,5 Member, Active Member, GM, Priest, Magister, Council of Nine, HP. Need I say more? Each lower level is made to feel BENEATH the higher one, without anyrequirement for the higher ups to prove their worth as leaders, to prove they deserve loyalty fromlower-downs. In fact, it is the other way around, lower-downs must prove their worth to be'trusted' or shown how positive the group can be. Appearance of Innovation, Eliteness: Oh yessss LaVey had so much insight and was such a great MAN!! an elitist who couldn't affordto keep his house on WELFARE!! An elitist who's own kids HATE him!! I was told "YOU have NO idea what THE MAN'S plans are!" shouted by a sheepy little priest! Oh and then onalt.satanism they say to some recruit, that the Satanic Bible is all you need to understand thewonders of LaVeyan Satanism....well which is it??? Double Ethics/Agendas: So, how does someone get to be a priest, magistra or title-bearer? I was told NEPOTISM and usefulness.... hmmm, take that with all the rest and it sounds like a cult, a butt-kiss sycophantcontest to see who's the best devoted slave to the "cause" and mouthpiece for LaVey or HPBarton... Loaded language: LBM (lesser black magic)=manipulation. So as you seek attention or favoritism, things you use everyday becomewhat LaVey calls LBM. Since he called your attention to it you don't call it shmoozing you call it LBM. Your success, your activities, LBM, LaVey, Blanche and their organization are all wrapped into a ball. The more you use the term for your activities, the more time you put in withtheir ideas and control. UR song=a nice soothing melody now called UR song by various LaVey cultists. It is just asoothing melody pleasing to the ear given a name and trumped up as a "brilliant Lavey insight intothe workings of the human animal." Stratification=being an asshole or stomping someone who is weak. Similar to LBM. Look in the back of Secret life of a Satanist and Devil's notebook, there is a dictionary of ordinary things that everyone experiences couched in the loaded language of LaVey who deems it"Satanic" and since LaVey deems it Satanic YOU MUST TOO!!! (by implication if you are elite,you KNEW it all along, right!!!) You simply focus upon the loaded terms that interest you, at first, and use them more and more. How many people knew shmoozing and flattery , feminine charms or seduction was LBM beforeLavey defined it like that? You saw it the same way without his terms, perhaps, but now it's HISterms defining YOUR success wrapped together -- you didn't seduce so-and-so, you used LesserBlack Magic on him....yeah....How many people call a soft sweet melody an UR song out in thestreet who don't give a rat's ass about LaVey yet produce Ur songs for a living?? How manypeople get ahead with Stratification on the job, or when they deal with an asshole enemy? Was itStratification, LBM, etc., before group involvement? Was it called Satanism before you read theSatanic Bible? Is Blanche's group now an inspiration for things you did before you met them, orhave you changed? Back to the Top Personality Change and Behavior Modification "Unfreezing" of the member's previous personality: Anton's/Blanche's group relies upon members and supporters not knowing what's going on -- notfully understanding the changes taking place. They do this by controlling time and environment,on alt.satanism, in chat rooms, through contacts, mystique and aloof pretentions, and by loadinglanguage. They control the atmosphere often through good cop/bad cop games (good priest/badpriest) on phone, email, elist, writing, chat rooms, web sites, etc.. Also, in these environmentsyou are shunned for bringing up Zeena (Anton's daughter) and what she says about all this, youget excommunicated like Rick Rincker if you tell Karla's side of the story (She's Anton's otherdaughter), gee, information gets limited if you don't want to be lambasted as herd, inferior, orshit-disturbing!! As for time, the more you experiment with lesser black magic to get ahead, themore you use their terms Stratification, LBM, etc., the more surrounded you are by theirexpectations and assumptions, the more devoted, the more benefit you see in the group andculture of the cult, without knowing anything else about them. They create a demand for purity,confession, powerlessness, covert fear, and dependency: after an experience with a shitty higherup, you confide to a nicer or less mouthy, more respectful and listening type of higher up,eliteness is used to induce pressure, conformity, and purity. IF you send in the Activemembership form, you confess a lot about yourself they do not need to know, except tomanipulate you (it goes beyond finding out if you are nuts or incompatible, it asks who yourfavorite parent is, etc.) Outsiders, opponents to the group, critics, non-members are mere 'herd,'not elite, inferior, expendable, etc. Common human attributes, interests, hobbies, and attitudes,are vehemently spoken of as weaknesses, inferiority, stupid, etc., in a shaming atmosphere. This isgreatly encouraged, and it increases the pressure for you to shy away from much of your previous identity. Suppression of the member's old behavior and attitudes: "That's NOT satanic, move on to something better" in a chat room, etc., e-list, private phoneconversation. Sometimes this comment is warranted, but often the pressure amounts to theattitude that whatever interests you personally is shunned or criticized. Things like Not LikeMost's articles on why Matt Paradise isn't a Goth, the shunning of the Marylin Manson style whilekeeping him a priest, are designed by higher ups to confuse identities of new members (many areteens or young adults) with contradictory group expectations. One priest harped on his girlfriendfor wearing sandals, just to be controlling. The hierarchy benefits from this type of priest. The hierarchy implies or directly states that watching Jerry Springer, Wrestling, TV in general,wearing typical clothes, driving a regular car, doing ANYTHING that connects you to millionsand millions of fellow human beings is a sign of their pernicious influence against your Satanicelite self!! The pressures, etc., get worse and more manipulative the more time you spendsupporting the group on alt.satanism, in chat rooms, e-lists, etc., or practicing/exploring lesserblack magic (whether inspired from the SB or any other book by Anton.) The more you assumethat the elite of the world are sharing Anton LaVey's philosophy, the more you assume the groupis connected to powerful, amazing people. If you send in your active membership form or contactother members, you may be drawn in closer to various other people and tensions in the group, andused quite effectively, as is Baalack (LeStat Ventrue of Satanic Network, and the group's HTMLguru), who is called 'troll' behind his back at Central. As they want you to believe: "It's better to be used than useless" -- LaVey, often quoted by Blanche Barton. Replacing the personality void with new behaviors and loyalty to the cult: If you have noticed any changes in your personality since involvement with Satanism or any newlifestyle, philosophy, religion, or politics, especially when it is attached to new contacts or groupinvolvement, and if you are becoming more identified with particular Satanists, or others tied tothe new influence in your life, you may wish to take a deeper look at the changes. If you do notlike the changes taking place, or if you feel they are not contributing to your self-sufficiency, confidence, and independence, you may consider that the people you are involved with could behindering your growth and individuality. If you feel that you are being used, stay clear of suchpeople completely. If someone can isolate you from your old life and replace it with theirstandards and attitudes, and commit you to dependence upon them, or intense group pressures ofapproval, they can gain a perverse level of control over you. Isolation, followed by increasedidentification and growing dependance, is a formula for mind control. Even if you are in controlof changes to yourself, if you become too dependant on a group or others who are more like yourchanged self, you are narrowing your feeling of choice in the matter, and your flexibility. If yoususpect that someone is manipulating you in this way, you need some distance from them to sortthings out. You may wish to look at the changes some Satanists may experience frommanipulative interactions with other Satanists. It is important for you to have personal standards,and to maintain those standards, independently of any group norms, before and after associatingwith groups and charming people. Back to the Top Conclusion: Who is Most at Risk? The more you communicate with members, especially those who are dealing a bit with grottoes, priests, or higher, the more you may be sucked into artificial, contrived pressures to manipulateyou. The risk to low-level members is only as great as their involvement or exposure tomanipulations. THAT IS WHY the _Satanic Bible_ is so touted as the best primer to LaVeyanSatanism and the cult. Supporters of the cult who are not members are used on alt.satanism andelsewhere, to feed the atmosphere of elitist bashing of non-LaVeyans, arbitrary definitions of'inferior' -- and group pressures in general. Why else do people who are new to Satanism on theWeb bash people they do not know, when they are new to the org? How many people givecredence to the idea that the Black House kind of DID have roots going "all the way down toHell?" More involved people are used on a more personal level. The degree of two-way exchange with the hierarchy may as well be nil. You ask why in the hell amagistra talks like a street bum schizophrenic Theist and why a priest who claims knowledge ofSatanism and to be Laveys mouthpiece an official Rep, breaks Satanic SINS left and right, whythey are titled and there is no comment except to trust the judgment of the hierarchy -- the samejudgment you complained about in the first place? The organization is rigid, as it is designed touse members, not to reflect any value of an individual member. How many time have you heard"we'll take care of it" or "don't concern yourself" or "don't subject yourself to it, or stopcomplaining" from central and see no evidence of your legitimate concerns being heard or beingtaken seriously when these questions are expressing valid comments about group dynamics theypretend don't exist. And do you feel 'maybe if I showed my merit more....' How about thosegrottoes disbanded awhile back when the church was stable they never directly say WHY theywere disbanded the REASONS behind it openly, but they open them up just when they areweakened by the approaching death of their great leader and founder who left them homeless andselling off the archives they solicited money for on alt.satanism and pretty pink letters sent tomembers that they are selling off to the highest bidder on ebay..coincidence? I think not. The combined effect of all of this is Russian-roulette upon the psyche of members. Healthygroups aren't as dangerous to their own members as this. Some Multi-Level-Marketing (MLM)groups are either a border-line situation or considered by some to be a cult, for example. Yet theymay be legal, and others consider them harmless. It depends upon the personality of the particularmember or founder, or upon other chance factors, like who in particular a member meets, andwhat they do, which particular seminars they go to, and how they are treated there, how theyreact, personally. Many leave rather than be harmed, and some stay but have built-in safeguardson some level, or have not been exposed to the wrong people. Others hook up with someone whois high-pressure and persuasive, and meet others like that in seminars, and loose perspective oftheir own life. Certain Born-Again Christian study groups and the Church of Satan are more deeply cultic, by some standards, by some people, than the MLM types, but prosperity cults do exist and thrive onthe basis of multi-level marketing scams combined with controlling social settings and pressuretactics. No one expects all of these groups (at least, not reasonable people who I have met whohave any real knowledge of them) to kill defectors, unless you try to make these larger, moreidentifiable movements responsible for some off-shoot in the woods (you know, some KentuckyNatural Foods cult with a dictatorial sales-representative or some other similar analogy.) No one who is in-the-know expects every member of these cults to loose all their money or windup psychologically regressed/damaged to one of those damaged cultists that get to Geraldospecials, or out-and-out sadistically verbally abused, humiliated, beaten or raped. The factremains, however, that joining ANY of these movements could result in psychological regressionor retardation of psychological development, lack of autonomy, and artificial stresses you wouldnot expect to find manufactured in healthy groups. There is a possibility that you could meet upwith some truly controlling and sadistic people ready to manipulate you without you being awareuntil some damage is done (and who knows how deep it could get) and the leadership of thegroup would ignore, poopoo, sidetrack, or blame YOU for seeing this potential or feelingdamaged in some way. This is incredibly sick, psychologically, and in each of these groups, youcan be so sucked into arguments, reforms, defending the hierarchy, or being manipulated thatleaving will be far more difficult, emotionally and otherwise, than it should be. The typical member or person who is associated for only a short time may not say much aboutthis, and people who leave quickly might not ever notice a hint of the problem. They might noteven be aware that an intuition of this controlling potential lead them to leave. It is the cases ofthe people who leave and explain this, that explain exactly what the problem is. Again, it is amatter of chance who you meet in the org (any of the above) or group, and if you meet them inperson or at a seminar (the more prolonged and devoted and the more effort, time, or money youspend, the more the tendrils are likely to come out.) Who knows what each level of involvementbrings? Both me and Jill decided it wasn't worth the risk, as both of us felt certain explanations,expectations, and behaviors were designed to increase the potential for manipulation, and theorganization was deaf to this, or actively enjoyed awareness of this fact. If you look at Anton LaVey's writings, you will notice that over time his tune gradually changed._The Devil's Notebook_ is interesting mainly for the Lycanthropy ritual, and the things ontrapezoids and construction of humanoids. Otherwise, the book is all about power-games andbullshit. _Satan Speaks_ article on panty-pissing control games blatantly admits the whole sickdynamic of the Church of Satan. Mind-games are enjoyed and expected by far too many who arehigher up, and they don't care if members are hurt by them. As games, who knows what the oddsare, it is freeform up to a point, and contacts with the Church and members are kept to aminimum often through a phone call or a letter or through the Internet. But there are problems even with this LIMITED involvement, and now the grottoes are back up, so the potentialincreases again. See Expected responses from CoS members, #5, where I copied some exchanges I had with CoS hierarchy. I can imagine that Anton LaVey's Church all started off as an informal talk on occult subjects, butthe grottoes were unpredictable -- it just depended on who was in control of a particular grotto. Alot of 'loose cannons' and 'internecine strife' from what some higher ups have said."Shit-disturbing." Wonder what that means. Once you suspect that mind-games are tolerated,practiced, or endorsed, in any group, remember the full meaning of the term 'mind-games' and'psychological damage' and you will leave if it gets too sick. I can imagine Aquino, founder of the Temple of Set, being one of those loose cannons with battycontrol fetishes and hallucinations, but there were other grottos just as bad or worse, probably.Very recently, Anton was engaging in panty-pissing control games, 'voluntarily' with people whowanted to be controlled and manipulated (like Blanche?) -- and we are to take these people asgood leaders with sound judgement in matters concerning our own involvement with theirorganization? I think not. See various essays in _Satan Speaks_ particulary "A Secret (Well, Sortof)." Controlling people to the pont where they urinate in their pants is a mind-control tactic thathas been used in cults. Consider also Zeena's picture of Anton. Zeena Schreck, one of Anton'sdaughters, paints him as a common pimp and con man who beat his dog, his women, andprostituted his female 'students' -- and stood by idly as his grandson was molested by one ofAnton's old buddies. I think it probably is not entirely accurate, as there are weird issues going onbetween Zeena and Anton, and between the ToS and LaVey, but it probably isn't too far off themark, and isn't a complete exaggeration, as the cult heirarchy maintains. In any event, the behavior of Magistra Tani Jantsang, Rev. Brent (Satannet's Baalack, LestatVentrue), and their favorite defenders, is incredibly manipulative, ego-bashing, and controlling.Magisters like Peggy Nadramia and Peter Gilmore have an attitude that after paying $100 to beinsulted by the likes of those mind-fucking creeps, you should 'know your place' and give theorganization more of your energy, time, and trust, to reap real rewards~! Tani Jantsang'sfollowers WANT to be cultists, and Tani herself is 'reluctantly' shepherding them, while fuelingtheir sick dynamics. This is 'no problem'!! Balaack expects people to bow down and respect himjust because he met Anton (did he have to piss his panties?) And has a controlling reputation ifyou ask certain ex-girlfriends or people on his chat room. What bothers me, and what is a trulydangerous tendency that is what helps make it a cult, is the lack of humor and honesty exhibitedby others. But humor alone is not protection. The fact is that though atheism can protect you from manipulators with mystic visions, andindividualism can protect you from large amounts of sheep-herding behavior, and selfishmaterialism can protect you from losing total sight on material goals and demands to sacrificewith no benefit, all of these protections can be eroded by other cult dynamics, and the result canbe anything from a Russian roulette with game-players, to a deliberate and very effective systemof brainwashing, depending upon who you come in contact with, and whether you see theproblem and get away. The above 'protections' might have worked for a time against the problemswith grottos with charismatic grotto masters who dabbled in mind-control games or out-and-outplans to manipulate. It is more likely that shutting down the grottos simply helped control scrutinyby outsiders or new members. Lacking a clear agenda to rally behind and demand sacrifice (which would have eroded theselfishness and individualism controls), Anton/Blanche's Church of Satan has still been able toattract enough psychologically disturbed people ready to manipulate on their whims, and alsoenough people ready to give some of their mind, emotions, will, or behavior-decisions over to theright type of controller. I suspect many groups could do this, but ultimately protect themselvesfrom possible damages. To ACTUALLY be protected from such damage, however, a group or anindividual considering joining such a group must REALLY and truly be disgusted by the mostdamaging and sick manipulation tactics, and disgusted also by the manipulators and game-playingassholes. AND that cannot be eroded by any gain the group or individual perceives from thosetactics or those assholes. Many groups open up these possibilities, but Anton/Blanche's group seems to enjoy theprospective danger in the future brought by all of this. That is why they are a cult that has thepotential to do some serious damage to individuals, over time, given enough exposure to Central,to certain members or people in the hierarchy, to certain grottos. And this doesn't bother them.They seem to WANT it. I have to ask myself, if they can't handle being asked about Zeena'sclaims about Anton, what is there problem? On our own e-list, we were verbally threatened inmore or less pressure-tactic levels, for ASKING (not even judging!) about this. For Anton & Blanche's Church of Satan, the hierarchical attitude and structure also reinforces the attitudes which encourage such manipulations of members. We found our standards towardsmanipulations (our inner code of honor) erode and change within their group, and this disturbedus, that is another reason why we left. I am curious as to what other former members have to sayabout this, and what their perspective is on this, whether it is a more recent tendency in the group,or whether it was present from the beginning. Most groups suck people in through groupmeetings in person, but damage can be done without that. The Internet culture of the cult is damaging in itself, and so are contacts with Central, if you ever consider yourself allied with them and a member. It is a matter of time, chance, and depth of involvement. And it isn't worth associating with a group like that, because groups don't HAVE to be that way, especially to their own members. If you really like the ideas of the groups you hang around you won't want this to happen to YOU. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to the Top Questions to Ask About CoS Involvment ----- Aloha, He'Ping, Om, Shalom, Salaam. Em Hotep, Peace Be, Omnia Bona Bonis, All My Relations. Adieu, Adios, Aloha. Amen. 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