Your message dated Thu, 18 Mar 2021 21:28:12 +0100
with message-id <e02725dd-f2b9-d34a-a094-42c1ec7ef...@debian.org>
and subject line Re: Bug#977477: release-notes: Update apt upgrade guidance
(Was: Re: Bug#977477: apt: Adding progression indication to apt-get output)
has caused the Debian Bug report #977477,
regarding release-notes: Update apt upgrade guidance
to be marked as done.
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977477: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=977477
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--- Begin Message ---
Package: apt
Version: 2.1.12
Severity: normal
Hello,
The release notes tell people that they should basically use
apt-get upgrade
apt-get dist-upgrade
But people tend to rather use
apt upgrade
apt dist-upgrade
I guess essentially because apt provides progression indication.
The problem is that these are not equivalent: apt upgrade will attempt
to install additional packages required by newer versions of existing
packages. That can lead to conflicts/breaks with other existing
packages, and thus get into all the complexity that using apt-get
upgrade first avoids.
The problem is then that actual users end up in *other* situations than
what would typically be tested according to the release notes.
We can try to insist on making people use apt-get upgrade instead of apt
upgrade, but I believe that can only work if apt-get provides at least
*some* progress indication, especially for distribution upgrades, whose
duration are quite unknown before doing them.
Alternatively, we could fix apt into behaving really like apt-get, to
avoid that discrepancy between what debian developers actually test and
what users actually use.
Samuel
-- System Information:
Debian Release: bullseye/sid
APT prefers testing
APT policy: (990, 'testing'), (500, 'unstable-debug'), (500,
'testing-debug'), (500, 'stable-debug'), (500, 'proposed-updates-debug'), (500,
'proposed-updates'), (500, 'oldoldstable'), (500, 'buildd-unstable'), (500,
'unstable'), (500, 'stable'), (500, 'oldstable'), (1, 'experimental-debug'),
(1, 'buildd-experimental'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386
Kernel: Linux 5.9.0-4-amd64 (SMP w/8 CPU threads)
Kernel taint flags: TAINT_WARN, TAINT_OOT_MODULE, TAINT_UNSIGNED_MODULE
Locale: LANG=fr_FR.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=fr_FR.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8), LANGUAGE not set
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system)
LSM: AppArmor: enabled
Versions of packages apt depends on:
ii adduser 3.118
ii debian-archive-keyring 2019.1
ii gpgv 2.2.20-1
ii gpgv1 1.4.23-1+b1
ii libapt-pkg6.0 2.1.12
ii libc6 2.31-5
ii libgcc-s1 10.2.1-1
ii libgnutls30 3.6.15-4
ii libseccomp2 2.5.0-3+b1
ii libstdc++6 10.2.1-1
ii libsystemd0 247.1-3
Versions of packages apt recommends:
ii ca-certificates 20200601
Versions of packages apt suggests:
pn apt-doc <none>
ii aptitude 0.8.13-2+b1
ii dpkg-dev 1.20.5
ii gnupg 2.2.20-1
ii gnupg1 1.4.23-1+b1
ii gnupg2 2.2.20-1
ii powermgmt-base 1.36
ii synaptic 0.90.2
-- no debconf information
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Samuel,
On 18-03-2021 12:04, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Paul Gevers, le jeu. 18 mars 2021 12:01:33 +0100, a ecrit:
>> On 17-03-2021 19:40, Samuel Thibault wrote:
>>> Paul Gevers, le mer. 17 mars 2021 19:38:16 +0100, a ecrit:
>>>>> "apt upgrade --without-new-pkgs"
>>>>
>>>> Looking into history, I see we did this because of
>>>> https://bugs.debian.org/931637. I guess your suggestion is a better
>>>> alternative?
>>>
>>> It would probably fill both the objective of upgrading without new
>>> packages, and letting users have a progression bar, yes.
>>
>> Sanity check, does the attached patch do what you mean?
>
> Yes!
>
> Samuel
Committed, thanks.
Paul
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--- End Message ---