On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:07:05 +0200, Josip Rodin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 10:02:24AM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: >> I am of the camp that believe that the only power people have in any >> capacity in Debian flows from the constitution; which means either >> the powers listed for developers, or as delegates of the DPL. Recent >> delegation activity seems to bear this out. > That's the problem - it's supported by recent activity, but not by the > previous ten or so years. Maybe it is just me, but using a GR to tell previous DPL's what they could ahve done seems like a waste of time. We know now DPL's can and have added people to ftp/dam teams, and now we will have a GR telliong DPL's that they can do what a DPL has done already, with a whole lot of little rules for rules lawyers to haggle over. > You state the problem yourself - the *current* DPL(s) are doing > *something*, but we don't actually know much about it, or if any of it > will happen again, or if the next different DPL and his inaction will > mark the start of another fifteen years of problems... > One could argue that this pair of DPLs will lead by example, and set a > standard for all future ones. But has that historically happened, and > if so will it repeat itself? I don't know. I don't like not knowing, > when there's a reasonably simple option that can fix that. And you think a little GR telling DPL's "go ahead -- you can do it!" is going to make a whit of difference. given the precedent the current DPL is setting? You have far more faith in a GR that reaffirms stuff that DPLs have already done to make a difference about the conduct of future DPL's. > This view that GR's are a problem in itself and that we shouldn't do > them is indicative of the whole situation - nobody thinks that > calcified teams are a problem so major that they need fixing with a > big ol' GR, so the status quo can freely persist, for years at a time. Strawman. The calcified teams have been added to, and even more is being worked on, and a "Yes, we can" GR seems like a redundant, time wasting exercise of bureaucratic zeal to me. > In essence, this is analogous to the real-world issue of people not > thinking that some general problem is their problem, and nothing much > gets done before someone takes the plunge and does a more > revolutionary thing. Whereas, in the more organized societies, people > use the mutually agreed upon (constitutional) processes to create > procedures which avoid major problems before they escalate. Had nothing been done, you might have had a point. As such, this is just make work. However, feel free to go ahead with make-work; we do need to fill up the vote page with more than just DPL votes, and I'll happily run GR's. What's next, a GR determining the favourite color of the Debian collective? manoj -- Everything is possible. Pass the word. Rita Mae Brown, "Six of One" Manoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <http://www.debian.org/~srivasta/> 1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272 D093 B493 410B 924B 21BA DABB BF24 424C -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]