I'm happy working on a design doc. I don't think Sankeys are the way to go as they are typically used to show some metric (say number of users flowing through pages on a website), and even if we'd have something like row count throughout I don't think we'd want to make it that centric to the visualization.
I think good old graphs are where it's at. Either overloading the current graph view with extra options (current view untouched, current view + lineage (a graph where nodes are tasks or data objects, data objects have a different shape), lineage only view). On Mon, Jan 23, 2017 at 11:16 PM, Gerard Toonstra <gtoons...@gmail.com> wrote: > data lineage is one of the things you mentioned in an early presentation > and I was wondering about it. > > I wouldn't mind setting up an initial contribution towards achieving that, > but would like to understand > the subject a bit better. The easiest MVP is to use the annotations method > to simply show how > data flows, but you mention other things that need to be done in the third > paragraph. If a wiki could > be written on the subject, explaining why those things are done, we can set > up a discussion and > create an epic with jira issues to realize that. > > The way I think this can be visualized is perhaps through a sankey diagram, > which helps to make > complex systems more understandable, eg: > - how is transaction margin calculated? What is all the source data? > - where does customer data go to and are those systems compliant? > - what is the overall data dependency between systems and can these be > reduced? > - which data gets used everywhere? > - which end systems consume from the most diverse sources of data? > > and other questions appropriate for data lineage. > > Rgds, > > Gerard > > > On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 2:04 AM, Maxime Beauchemin < > maximebeauche...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > A few other thoughts related to this. Early on in the project, I had > > designed but never launched a feature called "data lineage annotations" > > allowing people to define a list of sources, and a list of targets > related > > to a each task for documentation purposes. My idea was to use a simple > > annotation string that would uniquely map to a data object. Perhaps a URI > > as in `{connection_type}://{conn_id}/{something_unique}` or something > to > > that effect. > > > > Note that operators could also "infer" lineage based on their input > > (HiveOperator could introspect the HQL statement to figure out input and > > outputs for instance), and users could override the inferred lineage if > so > > desired, either to abstract complexity like temp tables and such, to > > correct bad inference (SQL parsing is messy), or in cases where operators > > wouldn't implement the introspection functions. > > > > Throw a `data_object_exist(data_object_uri)` and a > > `clear_data_object(data_object_uri)` method in existing hooks, and a > > `BaseOperator.use_target_presence_as_state=False` boolean and some > > handling > > of in the dependency engine and while "clearing" and we're not too far > from > > a solution. > > > > As a more generic alternative, potentially task states could be handled > by > > a callback when so-desired. For this, all we'd need to do is to add a > > `status_callback(dag, task, task_instance)` callback to BaseOperator, and > > evaluate it for state in place of the database state where user specify. > > > > Max > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2017 at 12:23 PM, Maxime Beauchemin < > > maximebeauche...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Just commented on the blog post: > > > > > > ---------------------------- > > > I agree that workflow engines should expose a way to document data > > objects > > > it reads from and writes to, so that it can be aware of the full graph > of > > > tasks and data objects and how it all relates. This metadata allows for > > > clarity around data lineage and potentially deeper integration with > > > external systems. > > > Now there's the question of whether the state of a workflow should be > > > inferred based on the presence or absences of related targets. For this > > > specific question I'd argue that the workflow engine needs to manage > its > > > own state internally. Here are a few reasons why: * many maintenance > > > tasks don't have have a physical output, forcing the creation of dummy > > > objects representing state * external systems have no guarantees as to > > > how quickly you can check for the existence of an object, therefore > > > computing what task can run may put a burden on external systems, > poking > > at > > > thousands of data targets (related: the snakebite lib was developed in > > part > > > to help with the Luigi burden on HDFS) * how do you handle the > "currently > > > running" state? a dummy/temporary output? manage this specific state > > > internally? * how to handle a state like the "skipped" in Airflow > > > (related to branching)? creating a dummy target? * if you need to > re-run > > > parts of the pipeline (say a specific task and everything downstream > for > > a > > > specific date range), you'll need to go and alter/delete the presence > of > > a > > > potentially intricate list of targets. This means the workflow engine > > needs > > > to be able to delete files in external systems as a way to re-run > tasks. > > > Note that you may not always want to take these targets offline for the > > > duration of the backfill. * if some tasks are using staging or > temporary > > > tables, cleaning those up to regain space would re-trigger the task, so > > > you'll have to trick the system into achieving what you want to do > > > (overwriting with an empty target?), perhaps changing your unit of work > > by > > > creating larger tasks that include the temporary table step, but that > may > > > not be the unit-of-work that you want From my perspective, to run a > > > workflow engine at scale you need to manage its state internally > because > > > you need strong guarantees as to reading and altering that state. I > agree > > > that ideally the workflow engine should know about input and output > data > > > objects (this is not the case currently in Airflow), and it would be a > > real > > > nice thing to be able to diff & sync state across its internal state > and > > > external one (presence of targets), but may be challenging. > > > > > > Max > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2017 at 8:05 AM, Bolke de Bruin <bdbr...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > >> Hi All, > > >> > > >> I came by a write up of some of the downsides in current workflow > > >> management systems like Airflow and Luigi ( > > http://bionics.it/posts/workf > > >> lows-dataflow-not-task-deps) where they argue dependencies should be > > >> between inputs and outputs of tasks rather than between tasks > > >> (inlets/outlets). > > >> > > >> They extended Luigi (https://github.com/pharmbio/sciluigi) to do this > > >> and even published a scientific paper on it: > > >> http://jcheminf.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s13321-016-0179-6 . > > >> > > >> I kind of like the idea, has anyone played with it, any thoughts? I > > might > > >> want to try it in Airflow. > > >> > > >> Bolke > > > > > > > > > > > >