Ah, OK, I didn't know that was such new ground in KVM with CS.
So, the way people use our SAN with KVM and CS today is by selecting
SharedMountPoint and specifying the location of the share.
They can set up their share using Open iSCSI by discovering their iSCSI
target, logging in to it, then mounting it somewhere on their file system.
Would it make sense for me to just do that discovery, logging in, and
mounting behind the scenes for them and letting the current code manage the
rest as it currently does?
On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 7:27 PM, Marcus Sorensen <shadow...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Oh, hypervisor snapshots are a bit different. I need to catch up on the
> work done in KVM, but this is basically just disk snapshots + memory dump.
> I still think disk snapshots would preferably be handled by the SAN, and
> then memory dumps can go to secondary storage or something else. This is
> relatively new ground with CS and KVM, so we will want to see how others
> are planning theirs.
> On Sep 13, 2013 7:20 PM, "Marcus Sorensen" <shadow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Let me back up and say I don't think you'd use a vdi style on an iscsi
>> lun. I think you'd want to treat it as a RAW format. Otherwise you're
>> putting a filesystem on your lun, mounting it, creating a QCOW2 disk image,
>> and that seems unnecessary and a performance killer.
>>
>> So probably attaching the raw iscsi lun as a disk to the VM, and handling
>> snapshots on the San side via the storage plugin is best. My impression
>> from the storage plugin refactor was that there was a snapshot service that
>> would allow the San to handle snapshots.
>> On Sep 13, 2013 7:15 PM, "Marcus Sorensen" <shadow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ideally volume snapshots can be handled by the SAN back end, if the SAN
>>> supports it. The cloudstack mgmt server could call your plugin for volume
>>> snapshot and it would be hypervisor agnostic. As far as space, that would
>>> depend on how your SAN handles it. With ours, we carve out luns from a
>>> pool, and the snapshot spave comes from the pool and is independent of the
>>> LUN size the host sees.
>>> On Sep 13, 2013 7:10 PM, "Mike Tutkowski" <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hey Marcus,
>>>>
>>>> I wonder if the iSCSI storage pool type for libvirt won't work when you
>>>> take into consideration hypervisor snapshots?
>>>>
>>>> On XenServer, when you take a hypervisor snapshot, the VDI for the
>>>> snapshot is placed on the same storage repository as the volume is on.
>>>>
>>>> Same idea for VMware, I believe.
>>>>
>>>> So, what would happen in my case (let's say for XenServer and VMware
>>>> for 4.3 because I don't support hypervisor snapshots in 4.2) is I'd make an
>>>> iSCSI target that is larger than what the user requested for the CloudStack
>>>> volume (which is fine because our SAN thinly provisions volumes, so the
>>>> space is not actually used unless it needs to be). The CloudStack volume
>>>> would be the only "object" on the SAN volume until a hypervisor snapshot is
>>>> taken. This snapshot would also reside on the SAN volume.
>>>>
>>>> If this is also how KVM behaves and there is no creation of LUNs within
>>>> an iSCSI target from libvirt (which, even if there were support for this,
>>>> our SAN currently only allows one LUN per iSCSI target), then I don't see
>>>> how using this model will work.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps I will have to go enhance the current way this works with DIR?
>>>>
>>>> What do you think?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 6:28 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
>>>> mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> That appears to be the way it's used for iSCSI access today.
>>>>>
>>>>> I suppose I could go that route, too, but I might as well leverage
>>>>> what libvirt has for iSCSI instead.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 6:26 PM, Marcus Sorensen
>>>>> <shadow...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> To your question about SharedMountPoint, I believe it just acts like a
>>>>>> 'DIR' storage type or something similar to that. The end-user is
>>>>>> responsible for mounting a file system that all KVM hosts can access,
>>>>>> and CloudStack is oblivious to what is providing the storage. It could
>>>>>> be NFS, or OCFS2, or some other clustered filesystem, cloudstack just
>>>>>> knows that the provided directory path has VM images.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 6:23 PM, Marcus Sorensen <shadow...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> > Oh yes, you can use NFS, LVM, and iSCSI all at the same time.
>>>>>> > Multiples, in fact.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> > <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >> Looks like you can have multiple storage pools:
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> mtutkowski@ubuntu:~$ virsh pool-list
>>>>>> >> Name State Autostart
>>>>>> >> -----------------------------------------
>>>>>> >> default active yes
>>>>>> >> iSCSI active no
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >> <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> Reading through the docs you pointed out.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> I see what you're saying now.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> You can create an iSCSI (libvirt) storage pool based on an iSCSI
>>>>>> target.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> In my case, the iSCSI target would only have one LUN, so there
>>>>>> would only
>>>>>> >>> be one iSCSI (libvirt) storage volume in the (libvirt) storage
>>>>>> pool.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> As you say, my plug-in creates and destroys iSCSI targets/LUNs on
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> >>> SolidFire SAN, so it is not a problem that libvirt does not
>>>>>> support
>>>>>> >>> creating/deleting iSCSI targets/LUNs.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> It looks like I need to test this a bit to see if libvirt supports
>>>>>> >>> multiple iSCSI storage pools (as you mentioned, since each one of
>>>>>> its
>>>>>> >>> storage pools would map to one of my iSCSI targets/LUNs).
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 5:58 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>> <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> LibvirtStoragePoolDef has this type:
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> public enum poolType {
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> ISCSI("iscsi"), NETFS("netfs"), LOGICAL("logical"),
>>>>>> DIR("dir"),
>>>>>> >>>> RBD("rbd");
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> String _poolType;
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> poolType(String poolType) {
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> _poolType = poolType;
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> }
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> @Override
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> public String toString() {
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> return _poolType;
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> }
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> }
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> It doesn't look like the iSCSI type is currently being used, but
>>>>>> I'm
>>>>>> >>>> understanding more what you were getting at.
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> Can you tell me for today (say, 4.2), when someone selects the
>>>>>> >>>> SharedMountPoint option and uses it with iSCSI, is that the
>>>>>> "netfs" option
>>>>>> >>>> above or is that just for NFS?
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> Thanks!
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 5:50 PM, Marcus Sorensen <
>>>>>> shadow...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> >>>> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> Take a look at this:
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> http://libvirt.org/storage.html#StorageBackendISCSI
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> "Volumes must be pre-allocated on the iSCSI server, and cannot
>>>>>> be
>>>>>> >>>>> created via the libvirt APIs.", which I believe your plugin
>>>>>> will take
>>>>>> >>>>> care of. Libvirt just does the work of logging in and hooking
>>>>>> it up to
>>>>>> >>>>> the VM (I believe the Xen api does that work in the Xen stuff).
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> What I'm not sure about is whether this provides a 1:1 mapping,
>>>>>> or if
>>>>>> >>>>> it just allows you to register 1 iscsi device as a pool. You
>>>>>> may need
>>>>>> >>>>> to write some test code or read up a bit more about this. Let
>>>>>> us know.
>>>>>> >>>>> If it doesn't, you may just have to write your own storage
>>>>>> adaptor
>>>>>> >>>>> rather than changing LibvirtStorageAdaptor.java. We can cross
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> >>>>> bridge when we get there.
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> As far as interfacing with libvirt, see the java bindings doc.
>>>>>> >>>>> http://libvirt.org/sources/java/javadoc/ Normally, you'll see
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> >>>>> connection object be made, then calls made to that 'conn'
>>>>>> object. You
>>>>>> >>>>> can look at the LibvirtStorageAdaptor to see how that is done
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> >>>>> other pool types, and maybe write some test java code to see if
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> >>>>> can interface with libvirt and register iscsi storage pools
>>>>>> before you
>>>>>> >>>>> get started.
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 5:31 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>>> <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>> > So, Marcus, I need to investigate libvirt more, but you
>>>>>> figure it
>>>>>> >>>>> > supports
>>>>>> >>>>> > connecting to/disconnecting from iSCSI targets, right?
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> > On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 5:29 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>>> > <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >> OK, thanks, Marcus
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >> I am currently looking through some of the classes you
>>>>>> pointed out
>>>>>> >>>>> >> last
>>>>>> >>>>> >> week or so.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 5:26 PM, Marcus Sorensen
>>>>>> >>>>> >> <shadow...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> >>>>> >> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> Yes, my guess is that you will need the iscsi initiator
>>>>>> utilities
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> installed. There should be standard packages for any
>>>>>> distro. Then
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> you'd call
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> an agent storage adaptor to do the initiator login. See the
>>>>>> info I
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> sent
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> previously about LibvirtStorageAdaptor.java and libvirt
>>>>>> iscsi
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> storage type
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> to see if that fits your need.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> On Sep 13, 2013 4:55 PM, "Mike Tutkowski"
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> <mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Hi,
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> As you may remember, during the 4.2 release I developed a
>>>>>> SolidFire
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> (storage) plug-in for CloudStack.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> This plug-in was invoked by the storage framework at the
>>>>>> necessary
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> times
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> so that I could dynamically create and delete volumes on
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> SolidFire SAN
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> (among other activities).
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> This is necessary so I can establish a 1:1 mapping between
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> CloudStack
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> volume and a SolidFire volume for QoS.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> In the past, CloudStack always expected the admin to
>>>>>> create large
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> volumes ahead of time and those volumes would likely house
>>>>>> many
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> root and
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> data disks (which is not QoS friendly).
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> To make this 1:1 mapping scheme work, I needed to modify
>>>>>> logic in
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> the
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> XenServer and VMware plug-ins so they could create/delete
>>>>>> storage
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> repositories/datastores as needed.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> For 4.3 I want to make this happen with KVM.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> I'm coming up to speed with how this might work on KVM,
>>>>>> but I'm
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> still
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> pretty new to KVM.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Does anyone familiar with KVM know how I will need to
>>>>>> interact with
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> the
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> iSCSI target? For example, will I have to expect Open
>>>>>> iSCSI will be
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> installed on the KVM host and use it for this to work?
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Thanks for any suggestions,
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Mike
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> --
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >>>>> >>>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>>>> >> --
>>>>>> >>>>> >> Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>>> >> Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >>>>> >> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >>>>> >> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >>>>> >> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> >
>>>>>> >>>>> > --
>>>>>> >>>>> > Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>>> > Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >>>>> > e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >>>>> > o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >>>>> > Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> --
>>>>>> >>>> Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>>> Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >>>> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >>>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> --
>>>>>> >>> Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >>> Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >>> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >>> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> --
>>>>>> >> Mike Tutkowski
>>>>>> >> Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.
>>>>>> >> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>>> >> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>>> >> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud™
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>>>> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>>>> *™*
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>>> e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
>>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>>> *™*
>>>>
>>>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkow...@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
