(this thread went to different depths on different lists, but I saw some consensus that planners@ was where it was at, so replying only there)
I would like to see many more references to specific policies and their non-hypothetical outcomes. Myrle mentioned Christina Ford on dev@diversity as an example, and a couple other helpful links. I don't see ASF as the right entity to attempt innovation / philosophizing / guesswork / first-principles policy in this area. Of course do our own thing. But look at a half dozen* or more similar things and how they turned out, and then tweak them. Kenn *number chosen to be deliberately way too low to be less intimidating On Sat, Nov 9, 2019 at 7:38 PM Charles Givre <[email protected]> wrote: > I thought I'd throw my .02 here. Firstly, whatever your political > opinions are, this really isn't something that should have been done in > public. I'd have to agree with uncle Bob here that CoC complaints should > be made in confidence and dealt with in confidence. > > Secondly, while kicking someone out may seem like the easy way to avoid > controversy, I would suggest to you that it is equally likely to have the > opposite effect. Consider the case where someone wearing some political > attire is kicked out of a conference, and that person then goes and gets > 200 of their friends to protest the conference at the front gate. Then > that person goes and speaks with the media and all of a sudden, that small > issue of someone wearing a political hat that offended someone has now > attracted all kinds of unwanted attention. > > I would strongly suggest that unless the individual in question is being > disruptive or otherwise behaving inappropriately, it is probably best to > ignore the person. > > Respectfully, > -- C > > > > > > On Nov 9, 2019, at 5:45 PM, Joshua Poore <[email protected]> wrote: > > My .02– > > It’s virtually impossible to write laser-accurate policy on what people > can or can’t wear to neutralize politics. More specificity will likely get > you in more trouble. > > Best you can do: > > 1) enforce a standard dress policy (shirts, shoes, etc) > 2) disallow clothing that represents known hate or terrorist groups > 3) disclaim that the views of attendees do not reflect the values or > policies of ASF > 4) strictly enforce a BEHAVIORAL code of conduct with zero tolerance for > aggression > 5) strictly enforce that this is a private event and any groups that > desire to protest (anything) must do so with the right permits and in > approved locations (like outside) > 6) write a values statement highlighting community and inclusion, and put > that in your program. > > Best you can do... > > Joshua Poore > > > On Nov 8, 2019, at 5:03 PM, Rich Bowen <[email protected]> wrote: > > > (Dropping the lists where this is not particularly on topic..) > > I have no interest in discussing what LF did other than to say I don't > envy Angela what she is dealing with today. :( > > But, it's worth asking, what do people think I should do were this to > happen at one of our events? > > I'll start. > > Ideally I would address this as follows. > > 1) ask the individual privately to remove attire which is causing the > problem. Note that this particular case is tricky. The attire in question > is merely a political slogan. At the same time it is not merely a political > slogan. > > Discussion question: Should we amend the event CoC to discourage political > slogan-wear? I already tell speakers to avoid any political remarks but I > don't know whether this is heeded. > > In normal times, political slogan-wear is no more offensive than, say, a > Dallas Cowboys shirt. These are not normal times. > > 2) if the individual insists that they will not remove the offending > attire, remove them from the event. > > Which raises the additional question - should I do the same for a Bernie > Sanders shirt? A Clinton hat? > > These may seem easy questions to those simply raging on Twitter but > they're not easy and no matter what one does will be seen as wrong by some > people. > > > On Fri, Nov 8, 2019, 15:18 Kevin A. McGrail <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> https://blog.cleancoder.com/uncle-bob/2019/11/08/OpenLetterLinuxFoundation.html >> >> -- >> Kevin A. McGrail >> Member, Apache Software Foundation >> Chair Emeritus Apache SpamAssassin Project >> https://www.linkedin.com/in/kmcgrail - 703.798.0171 <(703)%20798-0171> >> > >
