Hey Tison,
only people we have manually given write permission to the Wiki are able to
add a blog post. If somebody is posting something we don't want there, we
can just revoke that person's permission to write on the blog.
It is definitely something we should keep an eye on, but I don't think we
need to get active beforehand.
Best,
Robert
On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 10:02 AM tison <wander4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thank Arvid & Robert for the effort. Amazing!
>
> I'm curious the procedure a blog get posted. Follow the discussion so far
> it seems any contributor can post his blog under the directory as he
> wishes,
> is it the case?
>
> Best,
> tison.
>
>
> Arvid Heise <ar...@ververica.com> 于2020年3月9日周一 下午4:54写道：
>
> > Dear all,
> >
> > Robert added a link to the engine room blog on the Apache wiki [1]. It's
> > currently empty except for one test post. To add a new post, you just
> > create a new blog post from the top menu ("engine room" is just a fancy
> > link to the default blog).
> >
> > Robert would like to write about the migration to Azure Pipelines and I
> > would write a post about plugins in the next days. After having these
> > ready, I'd start a shorter round of discussion about style guidelines
> (more
> > meant as a guidance than restriction). I'd explicitly ask for feedback on
> > user ML as well at this point. Of course, we are happy about any early
> > contribution of more blog posts.
> >
> > If we have more posts at a later point in time, we would discuss blog
> > structure and find out easy ways/tools to migrate revised articles to the
> > official Flink blog.
> >
> > [1] https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/FLINK/Apache+Flink+Home
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 7, 2020 at 7:51 PM Rong Rong <walter...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > +1 on Arvid's proposal. looking forward to the "Engine Room" blog
> series.
> > > :-D
> > >
> > > --
> > > Rong
> > >
> > > On Sat, Mar 7, 2020 at 12:08 AM Yu Li <car...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > +1 to Arvid's proposal, thanks for the efforts!
> > > >
> > > > Best Regards,
> > > > Yu
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, 5 Mar 2020 at 23:04, Zhijiang <wangzhijiang...@aliyun.com
> > > .invalid>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Thanks for this proposal Arvid!
> > > > > +1 and looking forward to the wiki structure and more following
> > blogs.
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > > Zhijiang
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > From:Dian Fu <dian0511...@gmail.com>
> > > > > Send Time:2020 Mar. 5 (Thu.) 19:08
> > > > > To:dev <dev@flink.apache.org>
> > > > > Subject:Re: Flink dev blog
> > > > >
> > > > > +1 to Arvid's proposal
> > > > >
> > > > > > 在 2020年3月5日，下午6:49，Jark Wu <imj...@gmail.com> 写道：
> > > > > >
> > > > > > +1 to Arvid's proposal.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Thu, 5 Mar 2020 at 18:13, Robert Metzger <rmetz...@apache.org
> >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> +1 to Arvid's proposal.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 4:14 AM Xingbo Huang <hxbks...@gmail.com
> >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >>> Thanks a for this proposal.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> As a new contributor to Flink, it would be very helpful to have
> > > such
> > > > > >> blogs
> > > > > >>> for us to understand the future of Flink and get involved
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> BTW, I have a question whether the dev blog needs a template
> like
> > > > FLIP.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> Of course, There is no doubt that dev blogs do not need to be
> as
> > > > formal
> > > > > >> as
> > > > > >>> FLIP, but templates can be more helpful for developers to
> > > understand
> > > > > >>> articles.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> Best,
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> Xingbo
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> Arvid Heise <ar...@ververica.com> 于2020年3月5日周四 上午2:55写道：
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>>> I see that the majority would like to have an uncomplicated
> > > process
> > > > to
> > > > > >>>> publish an article first to gather feedback and then like to
> > have
> > > > > >>> polished
> > > > > >>>> versions on the blog with official review process.
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> Then, the obvious solution is to have a process that is
> > two-fold:
> > > > > >>>> * First a draft is published and reviewed by peers. The draft
> > > could
> > > > be
> > > > > >>>> polished in smaller increments including proof-reading by
> > > > native-level
> > > > > >>>> writers.
> > > > > >>>> * Second, when the draft converged enough, we would then make
> an
> > > > > >> official
> > > > > >>>> pull request for the dev blog, which would (hopefully) be
> merged
> > > > > rather
> > > > > >>>> quickly.
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> For the draft, we would have a wiki subarea "Engine room",
> which
> > > > would
> > > > > >> be
> > > > > >>>> the default location for such drafts. Pages in the wiki would
> > > allow
> > > > > >> for a
> > > > > >>>> gradual polishing and may even live comparably long if the
> > author
> > > > does
> > > > > >>> not
> > > > > >>>> find the time for polishing. The information is in a
> > > semi-published
> > > > > >>> state,
> > > > > >>>> where devs and experts can already find and use it, but it
> would
> > > not
> > > > > >>>> attract as many views as in a blog.
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> But I'd explicitly also allow drafts to go directly to a PR
> > (with
> > > > risk
> > > > > >> of
> > > > > >>>> having many iterations). I'd even say that if someone feels
> more
> > > > > >>>> comfortable to online editors such as google docs and has
> enough
> > > > > >>> reviewers
> > > > > >>>> for that, they could go with it. Here, the author needs to
> > ensure
> > > a
> > > > > >>> timely
> > > > > >>>> progress or revert to the wiki, since all intermediate
> versions
> > > are
> > > > > >>>> effectively hidden for non-reviewers.
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> Would the community agree with this approach or do you have
> > > > concerns?
> > > > > >> If
> > > > > >>> no
> > > > > >>>> major concerns are raised, I'd start preparation with the wiki
> > on
> > > > > >> Monday
> > > > > >>>> (03/09/2020).
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> I'd raise the issue about wiki and blog structure, when we got
> > > some
> > > > > >>>> articles to avoid too many concurrent discussions.
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 5:54 PM Zhijiang <
> > > wangzhijiang...@aliyun.com
> > > > > >>>> .invalid>
> > > > > >>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>>> Big +1 for this proposal and second Ufuk's feeling!
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> I guess "Engine room" section in Wiki would attract lots of
> > > > technical
> > > > > >>>>> fans.:)
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> Best,
> > > > > >>>>> Zhijiang
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >>>>> From:Yu Li <car...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >>>>> Send Time:2020 Mar. 4 (Wed.) 14:42
> > > > > >>>>> To:dev <dev@flink.apache.org>
> > > > > >>>>> Cc:vthinkxie <vthink...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >>>>> Subject:Re: Flink dev blog
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> Big +1 on adding a dev blog and starting with wiki. And +1 to
> > > > promote
> > > > > >>> the
> > > > > >>>>> fully polished articles to blog web with a formal process.
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> The latter one also brings up another good-to-have
> improvement
> > > that
> > > > > >>>> adding
> > > > > >>>>> categories and navigation in our blog so people could easily
> > find
> > > > > >>>> different
> > > > > >>>>> topics like release-announcement/events/tech-articles, etc.
> > but I
> > > > > >> think
> > > > > >>>>> we'd better open another thread to keep this one on track
> > > (smile).
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> I'd also like to add one potential topic around in-production
> > > > > >> practice
> > > > > >>> of
> > > > > >>>>> using RocksDB state backend (which seems to be a popular
> topic
> > in
> > > > ML
> > > > > >>>>> discussions), such as how to enable and monitor RocksDB
> metrics
> > > and
> > > > > >> do
> > > > > >>>>> debugging/perf-tuning with the metrics/logs, and introduce
> > > > > >>>>> internals/details around the RocksDB memory management
> > mechanism.
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> Best Regards,
> > > > > >>>>> Yu
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>> On Wed, 4 Mar 2020 at 11:07, Xintong Song <
> > tonysong...@gmail.com
> > > >
> > > > > >>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> I also like Ufuk's idea.
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> The wiki allows people to post on their works in a quick and
> > > > easier
> > > > > >>>> way.
> > > > > >>>>>> For me and probably many other Chinese folks, writing and
> > > > > >> polishing a
> > > > > >>>>>> formal article in English usually takes a long time, of
> which
> > a
> > > > > >>>>> significant
> > > > > >>>>>> portion is spent on polishing the language. If the blog does
> > not
> > > > > >>>> require
> > > > > >>>>>> such formal and high quality languages, I believe it will
> make
> > > > > >>> things a
> > > > > >>>>> lot
> > > > > >>>>>> easier and encourage more people to share their ideas.
> > Besides,
> > > it
> > > > > >>> also
> > > > > >>>>>> avoids putting more review workloads on committers.
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> Regarding promoting wiki post to the main blog, I think the
> > wiki
> > > > > >>>>> feedbacks
> > > > > >>>>>> (comment, likes, etc.) could be a great input. We can also
> > > contact
> > > > > >>> the
> > > > > >>>>>> original author before promoting posts to the main blog to
> > > refine
> > > > > >> the
> > > > > >>>>>> article (responding to the wiki comments, polishing
> languages,
> > > > > >> adding
> > > > > >>>>>> latest updates, etc.).
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> Thank you~
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> Xintong Song
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 10:25 AM Jark Wu <imj...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>> +1 for this.
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>> Regarding to the place to hold blogs. Personally, I prefer
> to
> > > use
> > > > > >>>>>> existing
> > > > > >>>>>>> blog and separate by tags/categories and title names.
> > > > > >>>>>>> Because, the dev blogs are very good learning materials. I
> > > > > >> believe
> > > > > >>>> many
> > > > > >>>>>>> users will be interested in these posts. It's just like
> > > > > >>>>>>> "Technology Deep Dive" talks in Flink Forward which
> attracts
> > > many
> > > > > >>>>>>> audiences. Putting them with main blog together can help
> > > > > >>>>>>> to give the dev blogs more exposure.
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>> But I also share Robert's concern. So I'm in favor of
> Ufuk's
> > > > > >> idea:
> > > > > >>>>>> starting
> > > > > >>>>>>> with Wiki, and moving good posts to the main blog
> gradually.
> > > > > >>>>>>> We should also improve our current blog web to support
> > > > > >>>> tags/categories.
> > > > > >>>>>>> Maybe @vthink...@gmail.com <vthink...@gmail.com> Yadong
> can
> > > help
> > > > > >>> on
> > > > > >>>>>> this.
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>> Best,
> > > > > >>>>>>> Jark
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>> On Wed, 4 Mar 2020 at 05:03, Ufuk Celebi <u...@apache.org>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>> +1 on starting with the Wiki. I really like the name
> "Engine
> > > > > >>> room".
> > > > > >>>>> Can
> > > > > >>>>>>> we
> > > > > >>>>>>>> name the section in the Wiki like that? In general, if we
> > > think
> > > > > >>>> that
> > > > > >>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>> post
> > > > > >>>>>>>> or a series of posts would be a good fit for the main
> blog,
> > it
> > > > > >>>> would
> > > > > >>>>> be
> > > > > >>>>>>>> pretty straightforward to promote a post from the Engine
> > room
> > > > > >> to
> > > > > >>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>> main
> > > > > >>>>>>>> blog (including further edits, focus on language, etc.)
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>> – Ufuk
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 5:58 PM Rong Rong <
> > walter...@gmail.com
> > > >
> > > > > >>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Big +1 on this. Some of these topics are not only for
> > > > > >>>> contributors,
> > > > > >>>>>> but
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> would also be super useful for advance users.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> One topic I can think of in addition is:
> Security/Kerberos.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Echo on Both Seth's idea, we could have both wiki and PR
> > > > > >>>>> submission:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> As Robert mentioned - wiki submission would make the
> > > > > >> experience
> > > > > >>>>> more
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> frictionless.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> I was having concerns splitting the blog posts in two
> > places,
> > > > > >>>> but I
> > > > > >>>>>>> also
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> think adding the banner/blog-series of "Flink Engine
> Room"
> > > > > >>> would
> > > > > >>>>> help
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> readers distinct between the two.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> --
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> Rong
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 8:39 AM Dian Fu <
> > > > > >> dian0511...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Big +1 on this idea. It will benefit both the developers
> > > > > >> and
> > > > > >>>>> users
> > > > > >>>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>> lot.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Regarding to the place to hold these blogs, my
> preference
> > > > > >> is
> > > > > >>> 3)
> > > > > >>>>> as
> > > > > >>>>>> I
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> notice that there are already a few high quality blogs
> on
> > > > > >>> flink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> web-site[1]
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and I guess that may be a good place to start with. We
> > just
> > > > > >>>> need
> > > > > >>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> figure
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> out a way to let contributors clearly mark the audience
> of
> > > > > >>>> their
> > > > > >>>>>>>> articles
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and also help users to easily determine whether the
> > content
> > > > > >>> is
> > > > > >>>>> what
> > > > > >>>>>>>> they
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> want.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Regards,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Dian
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> [1] https://flink.apache.org/blog/ <
> > > > > >>>>> https://flink.apache.org/blog/
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> 在 2020年3月3日，下午11:14，Yadong Xie <vthink...@gmail.com>
> 写道：
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi all
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> maybe we can use markdown & GitHub to make the
> submission
> > > > > >>>> easy
> > > > > >>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> review
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I have set up a similar blog for Flink-china blog
> > > > > >>>>>>> before(deprecated),
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> glad
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to offer help if needed
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> here is the link: https://github.com/flink-china/doc
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Seth Wiesman <sjwies...@gmail.com> 于2020年3月3日周二
> > > > > >> 下午10:51写道：
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> For lack of a better way to put this, I think the
> > > > > >> location
> > > > > >>>>>> depends
> > > > > >>>>>>>> on
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> level of effort you want to put into writing these
> > > > > >>> articles.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> If they are informal design documents then I think the
> > > > > >>> wiki
> > > > > >>>> is
> > > > > >>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>> way
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> go.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> If you want to have them be more polished then the
> > > > > >>> existing
> > > > > >>>>>> blog.
> > > > > >>>>>>>> This
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> means going through a PR on the flink website,
> thinking
> > > > > >>>> about
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> language,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> etc. If we go this route we can distinguish them with
> a
> > > > > >>>> series
> > > > > >>>>>>> title
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> like
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> "Flink Engine Room" and a disclaimer at the top.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> "Flink Engine Room: Plugins"
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> "Flink Engine Room is a series of blog posts covering
> > > > > >>>> ongoing
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> development
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> on Apache Flink internals, why decisions were made,
> and
> > > > > >>> how
> > > > > >>>>> they
> > > > > >>>>>>>> will
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> impact future development. The information described
> in
> > > > > >>> this
> > > > > >>>>>> post
> > > > > >>>>>>> is
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> not
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> required to successfully write and deploy Flink
> > > > > >>> applications
> > > > > >>>>> in
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> production."
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Seth
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 8:29 AM Arvid Heise <
> > > > > >>>>> ar...@ververica.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I think there is enough to positive to start setting
> it
> > > > > >>> up.
> > > > > >>>>>> That
> > > > > >>>>>>>> begs
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> question: in which format.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Following possibilities exist:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Use wiki as Robert pointed out.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Add new blog.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) Use existing blog and separate by tags #user,
> > > > > >> #expert,
> > > > > >>>>> #dev
> > > > > >>>>>>> (can
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> be
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> mixed). Start page could filter on #user by default.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 4) ???
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm assuming only few have a strong opinion, so I'd
> be
> > > > > >>>> happy
> > > > > >>>>> if
> > > > > >>>>>>>> you'd
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> just
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> drop your numbers in order of highest to lowest
> > > > > >>> preference.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 2:48 PM Piotr Nowojski <
> > > > > >>>>>>> pi...@ververica.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 for the idea :) And fully agree to clearly
> separate
> > > > > >>>> them.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think the original idea was writing about some
> > > > > >> recent
> > > > > >>>>>> changes
> > > > > >>>>>>> in
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flink’s code base, that could affect other Flink
> > > > > >>>> developers
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (contributors/committers). Like for example some new
> > > > > >>>>>>> ideas/future
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> directions that we want to follow. Especially if
> they
> > > > > >>> are
> > > > > >>>>> work
> > > > > >>>>>>> in
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> progress
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and there is lots of old code not adhering to those
> > > > > >> new
> > > > > >>>>> ideas.
> > > > > >>>>>>> In
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> some
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> later responses, it seemed like people are more
> > > > > >> thinking
> > > > > >>>>> about
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> presenting
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> some more advanced features, like a deep tech dive
> for
> > > > > >>>> power
> > > > > >>>>>>>> users.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I’m not opposing the deep tech dives, but I just
> > > > > >> wanted
> > > > > >>> to
> > > > > >>>>>> note
> > > > > >>>>>>>> that
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> is a
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> different target audience. I think the dev blogs
> could
> > > > > >>>> cover
> > > > > >>>>>>> both
> > > > > >>>>>>>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> them.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> At least initially. Later on we can decide to put
> more
> > > > > >>>>>> emphasis
> > > > > >>>>>>> on
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> power
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> users or Flink devs, or split them, or whatever.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Piotrek
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3 Mar 2020, at 12:37, Jingsong Li <
> > > > > >>>>> jingsongl...@gmail.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 for this proposal. I have a lot of desired
> topics
> > > > > >> in
> > > > > >>>>> table
> > > > > >>>>>>> and
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> batch.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I also second Seth and Stephan 's comment separate
> > > > > >> this
> > > > > >>>> in
> > > > > >>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>> clear
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> way.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Have concerns that maybe easy to confuse new users.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If I am a beginner and find a bunch of deep
> > > > > >> documents,
> > > > > >>> I
> > > > > >>>>> need
> > > > > >>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> further
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> distinguish which is effective and which is invalid
> > > > > >> for
> > > > > >>>> me,
> > > > > >>>>>>> which
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> may
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> cause
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me a lot of trouble.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jingsong Lee
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 6:36 PM Flavio Pompermaier <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> pomperma...@okkam.it>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Big +1 from my side. I'd be very interested in
> what
> > > > > >>> Jeff
> > > > > >>>>>>>> proposed,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> in
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular everything related to client part (job
> > > > > >>>>>> submission,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> workflow
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> management, callbacks on
> submission/success/failure,
> > > > > >>>> etc).
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Something I can't find anywhere is also how to
> query
> > > > > >>>> Flink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> states..would it
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be possible to have something like the Presto UI
> > > > > >> [1]?
> > > > > >>>> Does
> > > > > >>>>>>> Flink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> implement
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> some sort of query queuing? I heard about a query
> > > > > >>> proxy
> > > > > >>>>>> server
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> but I
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know if there's a will to push in that direction.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For Stateful Functions it would be nice to deeply
> > > > > >>>> compare
> > > > > >>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>> taxi
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> driver
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> solution with a more common implementation (i.e.
> > > > > >>> using a
> > > > > >>>>>>>> database
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> persist the legal data..is it safe to keep them
> as a
> > > > > >>>> Flink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> state?).
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [1]
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>
> > > >
> https://www.tutorialspoint.com/apache_presto/images/web_interface.jpg
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flavio
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 10:47 AM Jeff Zhang <
> > > > > >>>>>> zjf...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 for this proposal. I am preparing some
> articles
> > > > > >>> for
> > > > > >>>>> how
> > > > > >>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> use
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Zeppelin, although it is not closely related with
> > > > > >>> this
> > > > > >>>>>> topic,
> > > > > >>>>>>>> but
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> should
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> helpful for users to get started with Flink.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Till Rohrmann <trohrm...@apache.org>
> 于2020年3月3日周二
> > > > > >>>>>> 下午5:39写道：
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like the idea. +1 from my side.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Potential topics:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Scheduling
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Cluster partitions
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Memory configuration
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Recovery
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Till
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 3:56 AM Xintong Song <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> tonysong...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Big +1. Thanks for the idea, Arvid.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd be excited to read such blogs.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And we would also be happy to contribute some
> > > > > >>>> contents
> > > > > >>>>> on
> > > > > >>>>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> newest
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> efforts from our team.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Potential topics:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Memory configuration
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Active Kubernetes integration
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - GPU support
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Pluggable (dynamic) slot allocation
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you~
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Xintong Song
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 9:59 AM Benchao Li <
> > > > > >>>>>>>> libenc...@gmail.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 for this proposal. As a contributor, it
> would
> > > > > >>> be
> > > > > >>>>> very
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> helpful
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> such blogs for us to understand status and
> > > > > >> future
> > > > > >>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>> Flink.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Robert Metzger <rmetz...@apache.org>
> > > > > >> 于2020年3月3日周二
> > > > > >>>>>>> 上午6:00写道：
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would be excited to read such a blog (can I
> > > > > >>>> request
> > > > > >>>>>>>> topics?
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> :)
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> )
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We could start very low key by using our
> wiki's
> > > > > >>>> blog
> > > > > >>>>>>>> feature:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/viewrecentblogposts.action?key=FLINK
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 8:26 PM Stephan Ewen <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> se...@apache.org>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Great idea, but I also second Seth's comment
> > > > > >> to
> > > > > >>>>>> separate
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> this
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> clear
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way. It's easy to confuse new / potential
> > > > > >> users.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 8:15 PM Seth Wiesman
> <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sjwies...@gmail.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 on the idea.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My only request would be they are clearly
> > > > > >>> marked
> > > > > >>>> as
> > > > > >>>>>>> being
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> internals /
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for advanced users to not give typical
> users
> > > > > >>> the
> > > > > >>>>>> wrong
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> impression
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much they need to understand to use Flink.
> > > > > >>> Nico's
> > > > > >>>>>>> network
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stack
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blog
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> post
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does this well[1].
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Seth
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [1]
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> https://flink.apache.org/2019/06/05/flink-network-stack.html
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 10:39 AM Ufuk
> Celebi <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>> u...@apache.org>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd be happy to read such a blog. Big +1
> as
> > > > > >> a
> > > > > >>>>>>> potential
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reader.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ;-)
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> – Ufuk
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 11:53 AM Arvid
> Heise
> > > > > >> <
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ar...@ververica.com
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear devs,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> development speed of Flink has steadily
> > > > > >>>>> increased.
> > > > > >>>>>>> Lots
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> concepts
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> introduced and technical debt removed.
> > > > > >>> However,
> > > > > >>>>>> it's
> > > > > >>>>>>>> hard
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keep
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> track
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> these things if you are not directly
> > > > > >>> involved.
> > > > > >>>>>>>> Especially
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contributors, it's often not easy to know
> > > > > >>> what
> > > > > >>>>> the
> > > > > >>>>>>> best
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> practices
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there are related work streams going on.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In the runtime team, we had the idea to
> set
> > > > > >>> up
> > > > > >>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>> dev
> > > > > >>>>>>>> blog
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> where
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> introduce newest developments. The scope
> > > > > >>> should
> > > > > >>>>> be
> > > > > >>>>>>>> expert
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> users
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contribute to the project. Of course,
> some
> > > > > >>>>> articles
> > > > > >>>>>>> may
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> broader
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> scope and even be linked from release
> > > > > >> notes.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Examples from our team to give a more
> > > > > >>> specific
> > > > > >>>>>> idea:
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Deprecated checkpoint lock and mailbox
> > > > > >>> model
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Revised interface for two phase commit
> > > > > >>> sinks
> > > > > >>>>> and
> > > > > >>>>>>> new
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JDBC
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sink
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * N-ary input operators
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Unaligned checkpoints
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Operator factories
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Plugins
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> These articles would be less formal than
> a
> > > > > >>> FLIP
> > > > > >>>>>> (but
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> link
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> avoid redundancy) and focus more on how
> > > > > >> other
> > > > > >>>>>>>> developers
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> actually
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> impacted by the changes. It can also be
> > > > > >> used
> > > > > >>> to
> > > > > >>>>>> share
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experiences
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> during
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the implementation.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We would like to ask the other teams if
> > > > > >> they
> > > > > >>>> see
> > > > > >>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> benefit
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> such
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blog
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and would like to contribute. Bonus
> points
> > > > > >> if
> > > > > >>>> you
> > > > > >>>>>>> could
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> provide
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> examples
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your topics.
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best,
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arvid
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Benchao Li
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> School of Electronics Engineering and Computer
> > > > > >>>>> Science,
> > > > > >>>>>>>> Peking
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> University
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tel:+86-15650713730
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Email: libenc...@gmail.com;
> > > > > >> libenc...@pku.edu.cn
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best Regards
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jeff Zhang
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best, Jingsong Lee
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > >>>>
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
