Tim Williams wrote: > Ross Gardler wrote: > > Tim Williams wrote: > > > > > > I personally wasn't overwhelmed. The docs are fairly good except for > > > the pitiful email situation. > > > > Tim, can you explain what you mean by "pitiful email situation". I see > > an opportunity to improve the learning process. > > Ok, pitiful may have been a bit too strong;) > > Here are the issues I faced while setting things up. > > 1. The preferred way of sending with @apache.org address is > apparently header mangling. My problem is that gmail doesn't yet > support alternate from addresses as far as I can tell. > > 2. Setting up client for it with ssh tunneling. I read some mail > posts about setting up an ssh tunneling using port forwarding but > after an hour or so with PUTTY, I abandoned that solution. (may very > well be a firewall issue that I'm unable to figure out).
I don't use Putty, but i heard people talk on Infra@ that you now need to use ssh v2. However see below. > 3. PINE. Pine seems to be the only user-friendly client loaded on > minotaur but I wasn't able to receive email to it, but I could send > successfully. Perhaps mutt. However see below. > My current state of affairs: If I really want to send from my apache > address, I'll just ssh to minotaur and use PINE. All > twilliams((at))apache.org mail now forwards to my gmail account, > meaning if I do reply to it, it will be from my gmail account. > Alternate "from" addresses is on the gmail wishlist so hopefully this > won't be an issue any for long because I do like using gmail for all > mailing list stuff because of its labels and "conversation" views -- > don't know how I got along without it honestly. > > Numbers 2 and 3 could use some documentation that I'm not smart enough > to write. No need. See the last paragraph at [1] http://www.apache.org/dev/user-email.html The ASF does not encourage either of those methods. I am not entirely sure of the reason. I gather that we don't want to get into managing mail accounts, backing-up personal spaces, and other resaons. Probably the Infra volunteers would rather spend their time on other things. (I am not joking.) Actually someone needs to go to Infra@ and work out the exact reasons and then add that to [1]. Then work out how to provide, or explain, alternatives. Even though not encouraged, the ssh and pine/mutt methods were once documented at apache.org. Try the Waybackmachine.org, or our SVN, for dev/committers.html > All this just seems unclean to me. I suppose it just seems somewhat > ironic that apache, where everything is accomplished through email, > has such a cludgey approach. I've never looked at James but it seems > that since we have our own mail system we should be able to come up > with a secure email approach that "just works" without "figuring it > out". Until now we have not been able to run dynamic apps at a.o due to many reasons: too many services on one machine, cannot risk dynamic apps gobbling the resources, not enough volunteers, too much else to attend to. Gradually this is being fixed. > I realize documentation would help ease the burden but I guess > I've got to wonder why (given how mature a technology email is) there > is such a burden that needs easing? This is brilliant, Tim. You have identified a huge impediment for new committers. If we can clear this up, then there will be a big benefit for all of us. > As I write this, it is apparent how dumb it was of me to stumble > through some of this without at least asking a question on the list, > so hopefully I didn't miss something simple and obvious. Always ask, don't stumble. Start here on dev. If we can't answer or point to ASF doco, then someone can take it to Infra@ -David