Hi Daniel,

Regarding SNAPSHOTs - I would be glad to see all the moving parts working, e.g. 
generated artefacts, Hayes, signatures and upload :-)

Thanks in advance, 

Siegfried Goeschl



> On 13.08.2020, at 02:16, Daniel Dekany <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> A SNAPSHOT version is not public, so it's not really a release, and for
> internal testing you can build stuff.
> 
> Also, I don't remember right now anything super important, but there are
> mails where I listed things.
> 
> Yeah, I'm still in debt with the docgen conversion. It kind of works, if
> you saw that branch. I will continue to copy the md content into it, and
> hopefully won't run into any more stuff that makes me add Docgen features.
> (Like last time I started shoveling in the Examples section, only to
> realize that we need to be able to insert external files, so now we don't
> have to copy-paste templates and such into the documentation, each time
> they are changed in the source code.) Though it's not strictly a blocker
> for any kind kind of release.
> 
> On Wed, Aug 12, 2020 at 8:53 PM Siegfried Goeschl <
> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Daniel,
>> 
>> Anything other things in the way for preparing a SNAPSHOT release?
>> 
>> Thanks in advance,
>> 
>> Siegfried Goeschl
>> 
>> 
>>> On 11.08.2020, at 22:57, Siegfried Goeschl <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Daniel,
>>> 
>>> Just pushed the changes
>>> 
>>> freemarker-generator -t freemarker-generator/info.ftl
>>> 
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>> 
>>> Siegfried Goeschl
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 11.08.2020, at 22:44, Daniel Dekany <[email protected]
>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> OK, no classpath loading for now. Can be done later if it will be a
>> problem
>>>> with Maven plugin or other non-CLI thing. After all, it's pretty
>>>> transparent where the templates are coming from.
>>>> 
>>>> So, what about the reserved directory that holds all these built in
>>>> templates? See earlier in this thread. That also eliminates the issue
>> with
>>>> colliding with user templates (which you listed above). That's why I
>>>> brought it up actually, and for understability for the users. (I don't
>> get
>>>> why you relate name clashes with loading from jar VS from plain
>> directory.
>>>> The name clash problem happens in both cases, and modifying the
>>>> installation is not an acceptable solution anyway.)
>>>> 
>>>> Users can supply their own templates in their home directory, or maybe
>> in
>>>> the future in /etc/freemarker-generator, and again, not by replacing
>>>> installed templates. (Even then, shadowing a standard template is
>> something
>>>> I would prevent. Preventing unwise users from hurting themselves is a
>>>> pretty important design goal.)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Aug 11, 2020 at 9:49 PM Siegfried Goeschl <
>>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> 
>>>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>>
>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Daniel,
>>>>> 
>>>>> yesterday's email was a bit short since I was drained from the heat :-(
>>>>> 
>>>>> * I would like to provide a bunch of useful / generic templates
>> together
>>>>> with the FreeMarker Generator CLI - if those templates solve or mostly
>>>>> solve one's problem we successfully increased the community
>>>>> * The useful / generic templates will be relying on code from
>>>>> freemarker-generator-tools so they are currently not generic since the
>>>>> Maven plugin will not use freemarker-generator-tools due to the
>> transitive
>>>>> dependencies
>>>>> * Bundling useful templates can be done as file or from a JAR -
>> personally
>>>>> I prefer files to make things more visible by having files but class
>> path
>>>>> resources are also possible
>>>>> * Strictly personal opinion - problem with bundled templates is that
>> they
>>>>> might collide with user-supplied templates (rather theoretical issue
>> but
>>>>> log4j.properties picked up from the class path drove me crazy in the
>> past)
>>>>> * Consequently if a user really wants to remove / modify provided
>>>>> templates or add some new templates that's fine for me - it is a free
>>>>> country and they obviously know what they are doing
>>>>> * On my last cloud project it would have been actually feasible to
>>>>> assemble a custom "freemarker-generator-cli" with more / other
>> templates,
>>>>> e.g. dumping Java keystores (which was done by some ugly shell script)
>>>>> 
>>>>> So at the end of the day I think we are discussing a very minor point
>>>>> where we have different opinions and I don't see any real benefit from
>>>>> using class path loading
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Siegfried Goeschl
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 11.08.2020, at 09:30, Daniel Dekany <[email protected] 
>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>
>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 10, 2020 at 8:53 PM Siegfried Goeschl <
>>>>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> 
>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected] 
>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>>>
>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The fundamental problem with that is this. Currently, if you pull in
>>>>>>>> freemarker-generator-cli as Maven dependency, the templates will
>> not be
>>>>>>>> available. Surely, because it's the CLI, you could say that it's not
>>>>>>>> supposed to be used without the FreeMarker Generator Home Directory
>>>>>>> created
>>>>>>>> somewhere, which contains the launch script and templates/ and all.
>>>>> But,
>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>> these templates are guaranteed functionality in FreeMarker
>> Generator,
>>>>>>> then
>>>>>>>> they don't strictly belong to the CLI. When we will have a proper
>> Maven
>>>>>>>> plugin for example, they should be still accessible. In that  case
>> you
>>>>>>> only
>>>>>>>> have your Maven dependencies, so the templates must come from there.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Regarding visibility, it's a bit like with Java. Java classes are
>> not
>>>>> too
>>>>>>>> readable without looking at the source code either. That's not an
>>>>>>> advantage
>>>>>>>> when it comes to "visibility", sure. But luckily this is open
>> source,
>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> it's very easy to get to the source code, if someone really cares
>> (like
>>>>>>>> from the Maven source artifact). That applies to core stuff
>> implemented
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> FTL as well. So, the previously mentioned advantage (that they are
>>>>>>>> available from a plain dependency) certainly overweights this
>>>>>>> disadvantage
>>>>>>>> (less visibility).
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I currently disagree here - I like the visibility aspect and it is
>>>>> pretty
>>>>>>> difficult to get rid of templates loaded from the classpath.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What do you mean by getting rid of them? I hope you agree that users
>>>>>> shouldn't remove or modify these templates directly in the FreeMarker
>>>>>> Generator installation.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What do you intend to do about the dependency problem, described
>> above?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> Daniel Dekany
>>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Best regards,
> Daniel Dekany

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