Are we requiring maven 3.3.z now? historically our required maven version has been 3.0.5. I don't have an objection to changing it, per se, but I'd like to make sure our docs and CI builds get updated properly.
On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: > On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:58 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: > >> Fails again when I do this: >> >> $ mvn clean install -DskipTests assembly:single >> .... >> >> > Ok. Works if I use mvn 3.3.x. > St.Ack > > > > > >> >> [INFO] ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------ >> [INFO] Building Apache HBase - Server 2.0.0-SNAPSHOT >> [INFO] ------------------------------------------------------------ >> ------------ >> Downloading: file:/home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-server/src/main/site/ >> resources/repo/org/apache/hadoop/hadoop-distcp/2.7.1/ >> hadoop-distcp-2.7.1.pom >> Exception in thread "pool-1-thread-1" ------------------------------ >> --------------------- >> constituent[0]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/aether-spi.jar >> constituent[1]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-settings-builder-3.x.jar >> constituent[2]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-artifact-3.x.jar >> constituent[3]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/commons-httpclient.jar >> constituent[4]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/wagon-provider-api.jar >> constituent[5]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-core-3.x.jar >> constituent[6]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/aether-impl.jar >> constituent[7]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/sisu-inject-bean.jar >> constituent[8]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/sisu-inject-plexus.jar >> constituent[9]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/wagon-file.jar >> constituent[10]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/guava.jar >> constituent[11]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-compat-3.x.jar >> constituent[12]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-model-3.x.jar >> constituent[13]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/plexus-interpolation.jar >> constituent[14]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/commons-codec.jar >> constituent[15]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/aether-util.jar >> constituent[16]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/aether-api.jar >> constituent[17]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-model-builder-3.x.jar >> constituent[18]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-repository-metadata-3.x. >> jar >> constituent[19]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-settings-3.x.jar >> constituent[20]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/plexus-component-annotations. >> jar >> constituent[21]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/commons-cli.jar >> constituent[22]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-embedder-3.x.jar >> constituent[23]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-plugin-api-3.x.jar >> constituent[24]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/wagon-http-shaded.jar >> constituent[25]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/commons-logging.jar >> constituent[26]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/plexus-sec-dispatcher.jar >> constituent[27]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/aether-connector-wagon.jar >> constituent[28]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/plexus-utils.jar >> constituent[29]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/sisu-guice.jar >> constituent[30]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/plexus-cipher.jar >> constituent[31]: file:/usr/share/maven/lib/maven-aether-provider-3.x.jar >> --------------------------------------------------- >> java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: org/apache/commons/lang/StringUtils >> at org.apache.maven.wagon.providers.file.FileWagon.resolveDestinationPath( >> FileWagon.java:206) >> at org.apache.maven.wagon.providers.file.FileWagon. >> resourceExists(FileWagon.java:265) >> at org.sonatype.aether.connector.wagon.WagonRepositoryConnector$ >> GetTask.run(WagonRepositoryConnector.java:577) >> at org.sonatype.aether.util.concurrency.RunnableErrorForwarder$1.run( >> RunnableErrorForwarder.java:60) >> at java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor.runWorker( >> ThreadPoolExecutor.java:1142) >> at java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor$Worker.run( >> ThreadPoolExecutor.java:617) >> at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745) >> Caused by: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: org.apache.commons.lang. >> StringUtils >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.strategy.SelfFirstStrategy.loadClass( >> SelfFirstStrategy.java:50) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> unsynchronizedLoadClass(ClassRealm.java:259) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> loadClass(ClassRealm.java:235) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> loadClass(ClassRealm.java:227) >> ... 7 more >> Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: >> org/apache/commons/lang/StringUtils >> at org.apache.maven.wagon.providers.file.FileWagon.resolveDestinationPath( >> FileWagon.java:206) >> at org.apache.maven.wagon.providers.file.FileWagon. >> resourceExists(FileWagon.java:265) >> at org.sonatype.aether.connector.wagon.WagonRepositoryConnector$ >> GetTask.run(WagonRepositoryConnector.java:577) >> at org.sonatype.aether.util.concurrency.RunnableErrorForwarder$1.run( >> RunnableErrorForwarder.java:60) >> at java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor.runWorker( >> ThreadPoolExecutor.java:1142) >> at java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor$Worker.run( >> ThreadPoolExecutor.java:617) >> at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:745) >> Caused by: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: org.apache.commons.lang. >> StringUtils >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.strategy.SelfFirstStrategy.loadClass( >> SelfFirstStrategy.java:50) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> unsynchronizedLoadClass(ClassRealm.java:259) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> loadClass(ClassRealm.java:235) >> at org.codehaus.plexus.classworlds.realm.ClassRealm. >> loadClass(ClassRealm.java:227) >> >> >> >> Does it work for you lot? This is branch checkout. >> >> I want assembly to work so I can distribute the build around a cluster. >> >> Thanks, >> St.Ack. >> >> >> >> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: >> >>> I did a super-clean and recheck out. Now it works. Sorry for the noise. >>> St.Ack >>> >>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:10 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>> vladrodio...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> checked out HBASE-7912 >>>> >>>> ran: >>>> >>>> mvn clean install -DskipTests >>>> >>>> successfully. >>>> >>>> -Vlad >>>> >>>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:01 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> vladrodio...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> > I usually use: >>>> > >>>> > mvn clean install -DskipTests >>>> > >>>> > and it works. >>>> > >>>> > On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:01 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> vladrodio...@gmail.com >>>> > > wrote: >>>> > >>>> >> Michael, >>>> >> >>>> >> you can try master + latest patch on HBASE-14123 (v29). No need to use >>>> >> HBASE-7912 branch. I will double check HBASE-7912. >>>> >> >>>> >> -Vlad >>>> >> >>>> >> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 12:31 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: >>>> >> >>>> >>> More info: >>>> >>> >>>> >>> stack@ve0524:~/hbase.git$ git checkout origin/HBASE-7912 -b 7912v2 >>>> >>> Branch 7912v2 set up to track remote branch HBASE-7912 from origin. >>>> >>> Switched to a new branch '7912v2' >>>> >>> stack@ve0524:~/hbase.git$ java -version >>>> >>> java version "1.8.0_101" >>>> >>> Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.8.0_101-b13) >>>> >>> Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (build 25.101-b13, mixed mode) >>>> >>> stack@ve0524:~/hbase.git$ mvn clean install -DskipTests &> >>>> /tmp/out.txt >>>> >>> >>>> >>> ... >>>> >>> >>>> >>> St.Ack >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 12:29 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: >>>> >>> >>>> >>> > Interesting. When I try it fails w/ below: >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > [INFO] 26 warnings >>>> >>> > 322 [INFO] ------------------------------ >>>> >>> ------------------------------- >>>> >>> > 323 [INFO] ------------------------------ >>>> >>> ------------------------------- >>>> >>> > 324 [ERROR] COMPILATION ERROR : >>>> >>> > 325 [INFO] ------------------------------ >>>> >>> ------------------------------- >>>> >>> > 326 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexCodecV2.j >>>> ava:[48,8] >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.rowindexV2.RowIndexCodecV2 is >>>> not >>>> >>> > abstract and does not override abstract method createSeeker(org.ap >>>> >>> > ache.hadoop.hbase.CellComparator,org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io. >>>> >>> encoding.HFileBlockDecodingContext) >>>> >>> > in org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.DataBlockEncoder >>>> >>> > 327 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexCodecV2.j >>>> >>> ava:[143,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 328 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexCodecV2.j >>>> >>> ava:[147,29] >>>> >>> > incompatible types: java.nio.ByteBuffer cannot be converted to >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.nio.ByteBuff >>>> >>> > 329 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexCodecV2.j >>>> >>> ava:[148,33] >>>> >>> > cannot find symbol >>>> >>> > 330 symbol: method getKeyDeepCopy() >>>> >>> > 331 location: variable seeker of type org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io >>>> . >>>> >>> > encoding.DataBlockEncoder.EncodedSeeker >>>> >>> > 332 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexCodecV2.j >>>> >>> ava:[153,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 333 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV1/RowIndexCodecV1.j >>>> ava:[45,8] >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.rowindexV1.RowIndexCodecV1 is >>>> not >>>> >>> > abstract and does not override abstract method createSeeker(org.ap >>>> >>> > ache.hadoop.hbase.CellComparator,org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io. >>>> >>> encoding.HFileBlockDecodingContext) >>>> >>> > in org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.DataBlockEncoder >>>> >>> > 334 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV1/RowIndexCodecV1.j >>>> >>> ava:[145,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 335 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV1/RowIndexCodecV1.j >>>> >>> ava:[158,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 336 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[46,8] >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.rowindexV2.RowIndexSeekerV2 >>>> is not >>>> >>> > abstract and does not override abstract method compareKey(org.ap >>>> >>> > ache.hadoop.hbase.CellComparator,org.apache.hadoop.hbase.Cell) in >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.encoding.DataBlockEncoder.EncodedSeeker >>>> >>> > 337 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[79,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 338 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[117,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 339 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[190,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 340 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[214,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 341 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[349,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 342 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[355,3] >>>> >>> > method does not override or implement a method from a supertype >>>> >>> > 343 [ERROR] /home/stack/hbase.git/hbase-common/src/main/java/org/ >>>> >>> > apache/hadoop/hbase/io/encoding/rowindexV2/RowIndexSeekerV2. >>>> >>> java:[421,36] >>>> >>> > no suitable method found for uncompressTags(java.nio. >>>> >>> > ByteBuffer,byte[],int,int) >>>> >>> > 344 method org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.TagCompressionContext. >>>> >>> > uncompressTags(java.io.InputStream,byte[],int,int) is not >>>> applicable >>>> >>> > 345 (argument mismatch; java.nio.ByteBuffer cannot be >>>> converted >>>> >>> to >>>> >>> > java.io.InputStream) >>>> >>> > 346 method org.apache.hadoop.hbase.io.TagCompressionContext. >>>> >>> > uncompressTags(org.apache.hadoop.hbase.nio.ByteBuff,byte[],int,int) >>>> is >>>> >>> > not applicable >>>> >>> > 347 (argument mismatch; java.nio.ByteBuffer cannot be >>>> converted >>>> >>> to >>>> >>> > org.apache.hadoop.hbase.nio.ByteBuff) >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > .... >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > St.Ack >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 5:12 PM, Apekshit Sharma < >>>> a...@cloudera.com> >>>> >>> > wrote: >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> >> @stack, it compiled for me. >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> Also tried few commands, and have to say, it's well designed from >>>> user >>>> >>> >> commands perspective. >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 5:08 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> wrote: >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 1:50 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> >>> >> vladrodio...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > >>>> >>> >> > > Michael, >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > Its in HBASE-7912 >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > This is tip of git log: >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > commit a072f6f49a26a7259ff2aaef6cb56d85eb592482 >>>> >>> >> > > Author: Frank Welsch <fwel...@jps.net> >>>> >>> >> > > Date: Fri Sep 23 18:00:42 2016 -0400 >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > HBASE-16574 Book updates for backup and restore >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > commit b14e2ab1c24e65ff88dd4c579acf83cb4ed0605e >>>> >>> >> > > Author: tedyu <yuzhih...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > Date: Wed Oct 5 16:29:40 2016 -0700 >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > HBASE-16727 Backup refactoring: remove MR dependencies >>>> from >>>> >>> >> HMaster >>>> >>> >> > > (Vladimir Rodionov) >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > Thanks. I have that. I tried it and it doesn't compile for me. >>>> Does >>>> >>> it >>>> >>> >> > compile for you? >>>> >>> >> > Thanks, >>>> >>> >> > M >>>> >>> >> > >>>> >>> >> > >>>> >>> >> > >>>> >>> >> > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 1:44 PM, Stack <st...@duboce.net> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > Which branch do I check out to try it? HBASE-7912 is not >>>> it. I >>>> >>> don't >>>> >>> >> > see >>>> >>> >> > > an >>>> >>> >> > > > HBASE-16727... >>>> >>> >> > > > Thanks, >>>> >>> >> > > > M >>>> >>> >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 11:41 AM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> >>> >> > > > vladrodio...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > The last patch is on review board: >>>> >>> >> > > > > https://reviews.apache.org/r/52748 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 3:52 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> >>> >> > > > vladrodio...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >> How hard to put in an hbase-backup module? >>>> hbase-server >>>> >>> is >>>> >>> >> fat >>>> >>> >> > > > enough >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >> already. Could be done as a follow-up. >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HBASE-16727? >>>> >>> >> > > > > > focusedCommentId=15531237&page=com.atlassian.jira. >>>> >>> >> > > > > > plugin.system.issuetabpanels:c >>>> >>> omment-tabpanel#comment-15531237 >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > Can we do merge first? Then we can discuss separate >>>> module. >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Ted Yu < >>>> >>> yuzhih...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Looks like the first quote was cut off. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> The original sentence was: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> bq. no mapreduce job launched from master or region >>>> server. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> mapreduce job is launched from the node where command >>>> line >>>> >>> >> tool is >>>> >>> >> > > > run. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Stack < >>>> st...@duboce.net> >>>> >>> >> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > bq. launched from master or region server. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > What does this mean please? Has to be run from >>>> Master or >>>> >>> >> > > > RegionServer? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > it be run from another node altogether? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 1:44 PM, Vladimir Rodionov < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> vladrodio...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >> mapreduce dependency has been moved to client >>>> side >>>> >>> - no >>>> >>> >> > > > mapreduce >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> job >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 1. We have no code in the client module anymore, >>>> due to >>>> >>> >> > > dependency >>>> >>> >> > > > > on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > internal server API (HFile and WAL access). >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 2. Backup/ restore are client - driven operations, >>>> but >>>> >>> all >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > code >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > resides >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > in the server module >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > How hard to put in an hbase-backup module? >>>> hbase-server >>>> >>> is >>>> >>> >> fat >>>> >>> >> > > > enough >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > already. Could be done as a follow-up. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > Thanks, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > St.Ack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 3. No MR in Master, no procedure - driven >>>> execution. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 4. Old good MR from command-line. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 5. Security was simplified and now only super-user >>>> is >>>> >>> >> allowed >>>> >>> >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > run >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > backup/restores. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > 6. HBase Backup API was gone due to 1. Now only >>>> >>> >> command-line >>>> >>> >> > > > access >>>> >>> >> > > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > backup tools. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > These consequences of refactoring has been >>>> discussed in >>>> >>> >> > > > HBASE-16727. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 1:31 PM, Ted Yu < >>>> >>> >> yuzhih...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Reviving this thread. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > The following has taken place: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > mapreduce dependency has been moved to client >>>> side - >>>> >>> no >>>> >>> >> > > > mapreduce >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> job >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > launched from master or region server. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > document patch (HBASE-16574) has been integrated. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Updated mega patch has been attached to >>>> HBASE-14123: >>>> >>> this >>>> >>> >> > > covers >>>> >>> >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > refactor in #1 above and the protobuf 3 merge. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > If community has more feedback on the merge >>>> >>> proposal, I >>>> >>> >> > would >>>> >>> >> > > > love >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > hear >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > it. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Thanks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 10:31 AM, Sean Busbey < >>>> >>> >> > > > > bus...@cloudera.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > I'd like to see the docs proposed on >>>> HBASE-16574 >>>> >>> >> > integrated >>>> >>> >> > > > into >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> our >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > project's documentation prior to merge. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 9:02 AM, Ted Yu < >>>> >>> >> > > yuzhih...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > This feature can be marked experimental due >>>> to >>>> >>> some >>>> >>> >> > > > > limitations >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > such >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > as >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > security. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > Your previous round of comments have been >>>> >>> addressed. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > Command line tool has gone through: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > HBASE-16620 Fix backup command-line tool >>>> >>> usability >>>> >>> >> > issues >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > HBASE-16655 hbase backup describe with >>>> incorrect >>>> >>> >> backup >>>> >>> >> > id >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> results >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > NPE >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > The updated doc has been attached to >>>> HBASE-16574. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > Cheers >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > On Thu, Sep 22, 2016 at 8:53 AM, Stack < >>>> >>> >> > st...@duboce.net> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 7:43 AM, Ted Yu < >>>> >>> >> > > > yuzhih...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Are there more (review) comments ? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Are outstanding comments addressed? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> I don't see answer to my 'is this >>>> >>> experimental/will >>>> >>> >> it >>>> >>> >> > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> marked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> experimental' question. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> I ran into some issues trying to use the >>>> >>> feature and >>>> >>> >> > > > > suggested >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> feature likes this needs polish else it'll >>>> just >>>> >>> rot, >>>> >>> >> > > > unused. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Has >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > polish >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> been applied? All ready for another 'user' >>>> test? >>>> >>> >> > Suggest >>>> >>> >> > > > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> you >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > update >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> here going forward for the benefit of those >>>> >>> trying >>>> >>> >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > follow >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> along >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > who >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> are not watching JIRA change fly-by. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> It looks like doc got a revision -- I have >>>> to >>>> >>> check >>>> >>> >> -- >>>> >>> >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > take >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> suggestion made above but again, suggest, >>>> that >>>> >>> this >>>> >>> >> > > thread >>>> >>> >> > > > > gets >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > updated. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Thanks, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> St.Ack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Thanks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 10:02 AM, Devaraj >>>> Das >>>> >>> < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > d...@hortonworks.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Just reviving this thread. Thanks Sean, >>>> >>> Stack, >>>> >>> >> > Dima, >>>> >>> >> > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > others >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > thorough reviews and testing. Thanks >>>> Ted and >>>> >>> >> Vlad >>>> >>> >> > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> taking >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > care >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > feedback. Are we all good to do the >>>> merge >>>> >>> now? >>>> >>> >> > Rather >>>> >>> >> > > > do >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > sooner >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > than >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > later. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > ______________________________ >>>> __________ >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > From: saint....@gmail.com < >>>> >>> saint....@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > behalf >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Stack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > st...@duboce.net> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Sent: Monday, September 12, 2016 1:18 PM >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > To: HBase Dev List >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] Merge Backup / >>>> >>> >> Restore - >>>> >>> >> > > > Branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > HBASE-7912 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 12:19 PM, Ted >>>> Yu < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> yuzhih...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Mega patch (rev 18) is on HBASE-14123. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Please comment on HBASE-14123 on how >>>> you >>>> >>> want >>>> >>> >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > review. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Yeah. That was my lost tab. Last rb was >>>> 6 >>>> >>> months >>>> >>> >> > ago. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Suggest >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > updating >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > it. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > RB is pretty good for review. Patch is >>>> only >>>> >>> >> 1.5M so >>>> >>> >> > > > > should >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > fine. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > St.Ack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Thanks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 12:15 PM, >>>> Stack < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> st...@duboce.net> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On review of the 'patch', do I just >>>> >>> compare >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > master or >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > there a megapatch posted somewhere >>>> (I >>>> >>> think >>>> >>> >> I >>>> >>> >> > saw >>>> >>> >> > > > one >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> but >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > seemed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > stale >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > and then I 'lost' the tab). Sorry >>>> for >>>> >>> dumb >>>> >>> >> > > > question. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > St.Ack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 12:01 PM, >>>> Stack >>>> >>> < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> st...@duboce.net >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Late to the game. A few comments >>>> after >>>> >>> >> > > rereading >>>> >>> >> > > > > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > thread >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > as a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > 'user'. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > + Before merge, a user-facing >>>> feature >>>> >>> like >>>> >>> >> > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> should >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > work >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > (If >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > "higher-bar >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > for new features", bring it on -- >>>> >>> smile). >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > + As a user, I tried the branch >>>> with >>>> >>> tools >>>> >>> >> > > after >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > reviewing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > just-posted >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > doc. I had an 'interesting' >>>> experience >>>> >>> >> (left >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> comments up >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > issue). I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > think >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > the tooling/doc. important to get >>>> >>> right. >>>> >>> >> If >>>> >>> >> > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > breaks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > easily >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > or >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > inconsistent (or lacks 'polish'), >>>> >>> >> operators >>>> >>> >> > > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> judge >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > whole >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > backup/restore tooling chain as >>>> not >>>> >>> >> > trustworthy >>>> >>> >> > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > abandon >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > it. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Lets >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > have this happen to this feature. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > + Matteo's suggestion (with a >>>> helpful >>>> >>> >> starter >>>> >>> >> > > > list) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > there >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > needs >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > explicit qualification on what is >>>> >>> actually >>>> >>> >> > > being >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > delivered >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > -- >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > including a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > listing of limitations (some look >>>> >>> serious >>>> >>> >> > such >>>> >>> >> > > as >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> data >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > bleed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > other >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > regions in WALs, but maybe I don't >>>> >>> care >>>> >>> >> for >>>> >>> >> > my >>>> >>> >> > > > use >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > case...) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > -- >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > needs >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > accompany the merge. Lets fold >>>> them >>>> >>> into >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > user >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> doc. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > technical >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > overview area as suggested so user >>>> >>> >> > expectations >>>> >>> >> > > > are >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > properly >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > managed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > (otherwise, they expect the world >>>> and >>>> >>> will >>>> >>> >> > just >>>> >>> >> > > > > give >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> up >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > when >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > we >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > fall >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > short). Vladimir did a list of >>>> what >>>> >>> is in >>>> >>> >> > each >>>> >>> >> > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > phases >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> above >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > which >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > would serve as a good start. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > + Is this feature 'experimental' >>>> >>> (Matteo >>>> >>> >> asks >>>> >>> >> > > > > above). >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > I'd >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > prefer >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > not. If it is, it should be >>>> labelled >>>> >>> all >>>> >>> >> over >>>> >>> >> > > > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> it is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > so. I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> see >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > current >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > state called out as a '... >>>> technical >>>> >>> >> preview >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> feature'. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > Does >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > mean >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > not-for-users? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > St.Ack >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 8:03 AM, >>>> Ted >>>> >>> Yu < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > yuzhih...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Sean: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Do you have more comments ? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Cheers >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> On Fri, Sep 9, 2016 at 1:42 PM, >>>> >>> Vladimir >>>> >>> >> > > > Rodionov >>>> >>> >> > > > > < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > vladrodio...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Sean, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Backup/Restore can fail due to >>>> >>> various >>>> >>> >> > > > reasons: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > network >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > outage >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > (cluster >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > wide), various time-outs in >>>> HBase >>>> >>> and >>>> >>> >> HDFS >>>> >>> >> > > > > layer, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> M/R >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > failure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > due >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> "HDFS >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > exceeded quota", user error >>>> (manual >>>> >>> >> > deletion >>>> >>> >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> data) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > so >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > so >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > on. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> That >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > is impossible to enumerate all >>>> >>> possible >>>> >>> >> > > types >>>> >>> >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > failures >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > in a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> distributed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > system - that is not our >>>> goal/task. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > We focus completely on backup >>>> >>> system >>>> >>> >> table >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > consistency >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > in a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > presence >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> any >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > type of failure. That is what I >>>> >>> call >>>> >>> >> > > > "tolerance >>>> >>> >> > > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > failures". >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > On a failure: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > BACKUP. All backup system >>>> >>> information >>>> >>> >> > (prior >>>> >>> >> > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > backup) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > restored >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > and all temporary data, >>>> related to >>>> >>> a >>>> >>> >> > failed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> session, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > HDFS >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > deleted >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > RESTORE. We do not care about >>>> >>> system >>>> >>> >> data, >>>> >>> >> > > > > because >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > restore >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> does >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> change >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > it. Temporary data in HDFS >>>> will be >>>> >>> >> cleaned >>>> >>> >> > > up >>>> >>> >> > > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > table >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > in a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> state >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > back to where it was before >>>> >>> operation >>>> >>> >> > > started. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > This is what user should >>>> expect in >>>> >>> case >>>> >>> >> > of a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> failure. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > On Fri, Sep 9, 2016 at 12:56 >>>> PM, >>>> >>> Sean >>>> >>> >> > > Busbey < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> bus...@apache.org >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Failing in a consistent way, >>>> with >>>> >>> >> docs >>>> >>> >> > > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> explain >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > various >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > expected failures would be >>>> >>> >> sufficient. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > On Fri, Sep 9, 2016 at 12:16 >>>> PM, >>>> >>> >> > Vladimir >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Rodionov >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > <vladrodio...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Do not worry Sean, doc is >>>> >>> coming >>>> >>> >> today >>>> >>> >> > > as >>>> >>> >> > > > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > preview >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> our >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > writer >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Frank >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > will be working on a >>>> putting >>>> >>> it >>>> >>> >> into >>>> >>> >> > > > Apache >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > repo. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Timeline >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > depends >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Franks schedule but I hope >>>> we >>>> >>> will >>>> >>> >> get >>>> >>> >> > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> rather >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > sooner >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> than >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > later. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > As for failure testing, we >>>> are >>>> >>> >> > focusing >>>> >>> >> > > > only >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> on a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> consistent >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > state >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > backup system data in a >>>> >>> presence of >>>> >>> >> > any >>>> >>> >> > > > type >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > failures, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> We >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > are >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > going >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > to implement anything more >>>> >>> >> "fancy", >>>> >>> >> > > than >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> that. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > We >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > allow >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > both: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> backup >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > restore to fail. What we >>>> do not >>>> >>> >> allow >>>> >>> >> > is >>>> >>> >> > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > system >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> data >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> corrupted. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > Will it suffice for you? >>>> Do you >>>> >>> >> have >>>> >>> >> > any >>>> >>> >> > > > > other >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > concerns, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> you >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > want >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> us to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > address? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > On Fri, Sep 9, 2016 at >>>> 10:56 >>>> >>> AM, >>>> >>> >> Sean >>>> >>> >> > > > > Busbey < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > bus...@apache.org >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> "docs will come to Apache >>>> >>> soon" >>>> >>> >> does >>>> >>> >> > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> address >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > my >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> concern >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > around >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > docs >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > at >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> all, unless said docs have >>>> >>> already >>>> >>> >> > made >>>> >>> >> > > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> into >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> project >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > repo. I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > don't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> want third party >>>> resources for >>>> >>> >> using >>>> >>> >> > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > major >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> important >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> project, I want us to >>>> provide >>>> >>> end >>>> >>> >> > users >>>> >>> >> > > > > with >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > what >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > they >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> need >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > get >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > job >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> done. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> I see some calls for >>>> patience >>>> >>> on >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > failure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > testing, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > but >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> appeal >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > us >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> having done a bad job of >>>> >>> requiring >>>> >>> >> > > proper >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> previous >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > just >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> makes me more concerned >>>> about >>>> >>> not >>>> >>> >> > > getting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> them >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > here. I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > don't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > want >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > set >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> yet another bad example >>>> that >>>> >>> will >>>> >>> >> > then >>>> >>> >> > > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > pointed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > future. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> On Sep 8, 2016 10:50, "Ted >>>> >>> Yu" < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > yuzhih...@gmail.com >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > Is there any concern >>>> which >>>> >>> is >>>> >>> >> not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> addressed ? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > Do we need another Vote >>>> >>> thread ? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > Thanks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > On Thu, Sep 8, 2016 at >>>> 9:21 >>>> >>> AM, >>>> >>> >> > > Andrew >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > Purtell < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> apurt...@apache.org >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > Vlad, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > I apologize for using >>>> the >>>> >>> term >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> 'half-baked' >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > in a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > way >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > could >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > seem a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > description of >>>> >>> HBASE-7912. I >>>> >>> >> > meant >>>> >>> >> > > > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> as a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > general >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> hypothetical. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, Sep 7, 2016 at >>>> >>> 9:36 >>>> >>> >> AM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > Vladimir >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Rodionov >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > vladrodio...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >> I'm not sure that >>>> >>> "There >>>> >>> >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > already >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > lots >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > half-baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> code >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > branch, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > so what's the harm >>>> in >>>> >>> adding >>>> >>> >> > > more?" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > I meant - not >>>> >>> production - >>>> >>> >> > ready >>>> >>> >> > > > yet. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> This >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > development >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > and, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > hence many features >>>> are >>>> >>> in >>>> >>> >> > works, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > not being tested >>>> well >>>> >>> etc. >>>> >>> >> I do >>>> >>> >> > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > consider >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > backup >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > as >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > half >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > feature - >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > it has passed our >>>> >>> internal >>>> >>> >> QA >>>> >>> >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > has >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> very >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > good >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> doc, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > which >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > we >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > provide >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > to Apache shortly. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > On Wed, Sep 7, 2016 >>>> at >>>> >>> 9:13 >>>> >>> >> AM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > Andrew >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > Purtell < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > apurt...@apache.org> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > We shouldn't admit >>>> >>> half >>>> >>> >> baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > changes >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > won't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> finished. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> However >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > this case the crew >>>> >>> >> working on >>>> >>> >> > > > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > are >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> long >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > timers >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > less >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > likely >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > than just about >>>> >>> anyone to >>>> >>> >> > leave >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > something >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > in a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> half >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > state. Of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > course >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > there is no >>>> guarantee >>>> >>> how >>>> >>> >> > > > anything >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > turn >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > out, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > but I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > am >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > willing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > take >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > a little on faith >>>> if >>>> >>> they >>>> >>> >> > feel >>>> >>> >> > > > > their >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > best >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > path >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > forward >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > now >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > merge >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > trunk. I only >>>> wish I >>>> >>> had >>>> >>> >> > > > bandwidth >>>> >>> >> > > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > done >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > some >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > real >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > kicking >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > tires by now. >>>> Maybe >>>> >>> this >>>> >>> >> > week. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > (Yes, I'm using >>>> some >>>> >>> of >>>> >>> >> that >>>> >>> >> > > time >>>> >>> >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > email >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > :-) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > but >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > type >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > fast.) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > That said, I would >>>> >>> like to >>>> >>> >> > > > agitate >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > making >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > more >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > real >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> spend >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > some >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > time on it now >>>> that >>>> >>> I'm >>>> >>> >> > winding >>>> >>> >> > > > > down >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > with >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > 0.98. I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > think >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > means >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > branching for 2.0 >>>> real >>>> >>> >> soon >>>> >>> >> > now >>>> >>> >> > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> even >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > evicting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > things >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > that aren't >>>> finished >>>> >>> or >>>> >>> >> > stable, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> leaving >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > them >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > only >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > once >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> again >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > master >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > branch. Or, maybe >>>> just >>>> >>> >> > evicting >>>> >>> >> > > > > them. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > Let's >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > take >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > case >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > by >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > case. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > I think this >>>> feature >>>> >>> can >>>> >>> >> come >>>> >>> >> > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > relatively >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> safely. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > As >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> added >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > insurance, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > let's admit the >>>> >>> >> possibility >>>> >>> >> > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > could >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > reverted >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> if >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > folks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > working on >>>> >>> stabilizing 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > decide >>>> >>> >> > > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > evict >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > because >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > unfinished >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > or >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > unstable, because >>>> that >>>> >>> >> > > certainly >>>> >>> >> > > > > can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > happen. I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > would >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> expect if >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > talk >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > like >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > that starts, we'd >>>> get >>>> >>> help >>>> >>> >> > > > > finishing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> or >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> stabilizing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > what's >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > under >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > discussion >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > for revert. Or, >>>> we'd >>>> >>> have >>>> >>> >> a >>>> >>> >> > > > revert. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > Either >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > way >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > outcome >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > acceptable. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > On Wed, Sep 7, >>>> 2016 at >>>> >>> >> 8:56 >>>> >>> >> > AM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > Dima >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > Spivak >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > dimaspi...@apache.org >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > I'm not sure >>>> that >>>> >>> >> "There is >>>> >>> >> > > > > already >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > lots >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > half-baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> code >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > branch, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > so what's the >>>> harm >>>> >>> in >>>> >>> >> > adding >>>> >>> >> > > > > more?" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > is a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > good >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > code >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > commit >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > philosophy >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > fault-tolerant >>>> >>> >> distributed >>>> >>> >> > > data >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> store. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > ;) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > More seriously, >>>> a >>>> >>> lack >>>> >>> >> of >>>> >>> >> > > test >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > coverage >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > existing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > shouldn't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > used as >>>> >>> justification >>>> >>> >> for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> introducing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > new >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > with >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > same >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > shortcomings. >>>> >>> >> Ultimately, >>>> >>> >> > > it's >>>> >>> >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> end >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > user >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > who >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > feel >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> pain, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > so >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > shouldn't we do >>>> >>> >> everything >>>> >>> >> > we >>>> >>> >> > > > can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > mitigate >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > that? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > -Dima >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > On Wed, Sep 7, >>>> 2016 >>>> >>> at >>>> >>> >> 8:46 >>>> >>> >> > > AM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > Vladimir >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Rodionov < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> vladrodio...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Sean, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > * have docs >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Agree. We >>>> have a >>>> >>> doc >>>> >>> >> and >>>> >>> >> > > > backup >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > most >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > documented >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > :), >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > we >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > release it >>>> >>> shortly to >>>> >>> >> > > Apache. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > * have >>>> sunny-day >>>> >>> >> > > correctness >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Feature has >>>> >>> close to >>>> >>> >> 60 >>>> >>> >> > > test >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> cases, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > which >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> run >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> approx >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > 30 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> min. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > We >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > add more, if >>>> >>> >> community do >>>> >>> >> > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> mind >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > :) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > * have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > correctness-in-face-of-failure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Any examples >>>> of >>>> >>> these >>>> >>> >> > tests >>>> >>> >> > > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > existing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > features? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > In >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > works, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > we >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > have a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > clear >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > understanding >>>> of >>>> >>> what >>>> >>> >> > > should >>>> >>> >> > > > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> done >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > by >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > time >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> release. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > That is very >>>> close >>>> >>> >> goal >>>> >>> >> > for >>>> >>> >> > > > us, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > verify >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > IT >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > monkey >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> existing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > code. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > * don't rely >>>> on >>>> >>> things >>>> >>> >> > > > outside >>>> >>> >> > > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > HBase >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > normal >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > operation >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > (okay >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > advanced >>>> >>> operation) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > We do not. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > Enormous time >>>> has >>>> >>> been >>>> >>> >> > > spent >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> already >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > development >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > testing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > feature, it >>>> has >>>> >>> passed >>>> >>> >> > our >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> internal >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > many >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> rounds >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> code >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > reviews >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > by HBase >>>> >>> committers. >>>> >>> >> We >>>> >>> >> > do >>>> >>> >> > > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> mind >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > if >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> someone >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> HBase >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > community >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > (outside of >>>> HW) >>>> >>> will >>>> >>> >> > review >>>> >>> >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > code, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > but >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> probably >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> takes >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > forever >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > wait for >>>> >>> volunteer?, >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > quite >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> large >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > (1MB+ >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> cumulative >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > patch) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > 2.0 branch is >>>> >>> full of >>>> >>> >> > half >>>> >>> >> > > > > baked >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > features, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> most >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > them >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > are >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > active >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > development, >>>> >>> >> therefore I >>>> >>> >> > am >>>> >>> >> > > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > following >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > you >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > here, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Sean? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Why >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > HBASE-7912 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > not good >>>> enough >>>> >>> yet >>>> >>> >> to be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> integrated >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > into >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > branch? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > -Vlad >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 7, >>>> >>> 2016 at >>>> >>> >> > 8:23 >>>> >>> >> > > > AM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> Sean >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > Busbey < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > bus...@apache.org >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > On Tue, Sep >>>> 6, >>>> >>> 2016 >>>> >>> >> at >>>> >>> >> > > > 10:36 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> PM, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > Josh >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Elser < >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > josh.el...@gmail.com> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > wrote: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > So, the >>>> >>> answer to >>>> >>> >> > > Sean's >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > original >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> question >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > "as >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > robust as >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > snapshots >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > presently >>>> >>> are"? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> (independence of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > backup/restore >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > failure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > tolerance >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > snapshot >>>> >>> failure >>>> >>> >> > > > tolerance) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > Is this >>>> just a >>>> >>> >> > question >>>> >>> >> > > > WRT >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > context >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > change, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> or >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > is it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > means >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > for a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > veto >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > from you, >>>> >>> Sean? >>>> >>> >> Just >>>> >>> >> > > > trying >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > make >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > sure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > I'm >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> following >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> along >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > adequately. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > I'd say ATM >>>> I'm >>>> >>> -0, >>>> >>> >> > > > bordering >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > -1 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > but >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > not >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> reasons >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > articulate >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > well. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > Here's an >>>> >>> attempt. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > We've been >>>> >>> trying to >>>> >>> >> > > move, >>>> >>> >> > > > > as a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > community, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > towards >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > minimizing >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > risk >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > downstream >>>> >>> folks by >>>> >>> >> > > getting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > "complete >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> enough >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > use" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > gates >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > place >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > before we >>>> >>> introduce >>>> >>> >> new >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> features. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > This >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > was >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > spurred >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> by a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > some >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > getting in >>>> >>> >> half-baked >>>> >>> >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > never >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > making >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > "can >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> really >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > use" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > status >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > (I'm >>>> thinking of >>>> >>> >> > > > distributed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> log >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > replay >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> zk-less >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > assignment >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > stuff, I >>>> don't >>>> >>> >> recall >>>> >>> >> > if >>>> >>> >> > > > > there >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> was >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > more). >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > The gates, >>>> >>> >> generally, >>>> >>> >> > > > > included >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > things >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > like: >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * have docs >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * have >>>> sunny-day >>>> >>> >> > > > correctness >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > correctness-in-face-of-failure >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > tests >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * don't >>>> rely on >>>> >>> >> things >>>> >>> >> > > > > outside >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > HBase >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > normal >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > operation >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > (okay >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > advanced >>>> >>> operation) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > As an >>>> example, >>>> >>> we >>>> >>> >> kept >>>> >>> >> > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > MOB >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > work >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > off >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > branch >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > out >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > master >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > until it >>>> could >>>> >>> pass >>>> >>> >> > these >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > criteria. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > The >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > big >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > exemption >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > we've >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> had >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > this was the >>>> >>> >> > hbase-spark >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > integration, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > where >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > we >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > all >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > agreed >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > could >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > land in >>>> master >>>> >>> >> because >>>> >>> >> > it >>>> >>> >> > > > was >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> very >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > well >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > isolated >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > (the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > slide >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > away >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > including >>>> docs >>>> >>> as a >>>> >>> >> > > > > first-class >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > part >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > building >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > up >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > integration >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > has led me >>>> to >>>> >>> doubt >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > wisdom >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > decision). >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > We've also >>>> been >>>> >>> >> > treating >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> inclusion >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > "probably >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> will >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > be >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > released >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > downstream" >>>> >>> branches >>>> >>> >> > as a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> higher >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > bar, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > requiring >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * don't >>>> >>> moderately >>>> >>> >> > impact >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > performance >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > when >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > isn't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > use >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * don't >>>> severely >>>> >>> >> impact >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > performance >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > when >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> is >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> use >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > * either >>>> >>> >> default-to-on >>>> >>> >> > or >>>> >>> >> > > > > show >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > enough >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> demand >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> believe >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > non-trivial >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > number of >>>> folks >>>> >>> will >>>> >>> >> > turn >>>> >>> >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > feature >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > The above >>>> has >>>> >>> kept >>>> >>> >> MOB >>>> >>> >> > > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > hbase-spark >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > integration >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> out >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > branch-1, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > presumably >>>> while >>>> >>> >> > they've >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> "gotten >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > more >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> stable" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> master >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > odd >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > vendor >>>> >>> inclusion. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > Are we >>>> going to >>>> >>> >> have a >>>> >>> >> > > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> release >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > before >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > end >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> year? >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > We're >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > coming up >>>> on 1.5 >>>> >>> >> years >>>> >>> >> > > > since >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > release of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > version >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> 1.0; >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> seems >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > like >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > it's about >>>> time, >>>> >>> >> > though I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> haven't >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > seen >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > any >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > concrete >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > plans >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > year. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > Presuming >>>> we are >>>> >>> >> going >>>> >>> >> > to >>>> >>> >> > > > > have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> one >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > by >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> end >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > of >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > year, it >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > seems a >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > bit close to >>>> >>> still >>>> >>> >> be >>>> >>> >> > > > adding >>>> >>> >> > > > > in >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > "features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > need >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > maturing" >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > on >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > the >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > branch. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > The lack of >>>> a >>>> >>> >> concrete >>>> >>> >> > > plan >>>> >>> >> > > > > for >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > keeps >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> me >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > from >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > considering >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > these >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > things >>>> blocker >>>> >>> at >>>> >>> >> the >>>> >>> >> > > > moment. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> But >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > I >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > know >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > first >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > hand >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> how >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > much >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > trouble >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > folks have >>>> had >>>> >>> with >>>> >>> >> > other >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> features >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > that >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> have >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > gone >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> into >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > downstream >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > facing >>>> releases >>>> >>> >> without >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> robustness >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > checks >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > (i.e. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > replication), >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > and >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > I'm >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > concerned >>>> about >>>> >>> what >>>> >>> >> > > we're >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> setting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > up >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > if >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> 2.0 >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > goes >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > out >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > with >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> this >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > feature in >>>> its >>>> >>> >> current >>>> >>> >> > > > state. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > -- >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > Best regards, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > - Andy >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > Problems worthy of >>>> >>> attack >>>> >>> >> > prove >>>> >>> >> > > > > their >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > worth >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > by >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > hitting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> back. - >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Piet >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > Hein >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > (via Tom White) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > -- >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > Best regards, >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > - Andy >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > Problems worthy of >>>> attack >>>> >>> >> prove >>>> >>> >> > > their >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> worth >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > by >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> hitting >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > back. >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > - >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > Piet >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> Hein >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > (via Tom White) >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > -- >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > busbey >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >> >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > > >>>> >>> >> > > > >>>> >>> >> > > >>>> >>> >> > >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> -- >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> >> -- Appy >>>> >>> >> >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> > >>>> >>> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> > >>>> >>> >>> >> -- busbey
