Using java.time is just a convenience compared to our FastDateTime commons classes anyways. Lambdas are supportable through regular single-method interfaces. As Mikael pointed out, though, default interface methods would be tremendously useful for log4j-api. Alternatively, we could create some abstract base classes where missing and mark the interfaces as changeable. With that pattern, interfaces are for users of the the class, while the abstract classes are for implementers of the class.
On 21 April 2017 at 11:58, Ralph Goers <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> wrote: > How does that benefit a user of Log4j in Java 8. In Java 9 it is certainly > a benefit if it can provide microsecond granularity. > > Ralph > > > On Apr 21, 2017, at 9:21 AM, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > On Apr 21, 2017 7:06 AM, "Ralph Goers" <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> > wrote: > > > > What features in Java 8 do we need to take advantage of that we haven't > > already? > > > > > > How about java.time? Using an Instant instead of a long to timestamp an > > event? > > > > Gary > > > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Apr 21, 2017, at 12:44 AM, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com > > > > wrote: > >> > >> I also have a feeling that we focus too much on Java 9 and not enough on > >> Java 8. > >> > >>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2017 at 5:08 AM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > >>> > >>> I agree with Ralph that there are many environments that can't upgrade > >>> their Java version but still want to use the nice features Log4j2 > offers. > >>> I've also worked in such environments. I would prefer to support older > >>> versions as long as possible. (What that means concretely is open for > >>> discussion.) :-) > >>> > >>> Remko > >>> > >>> Sent from my iPhone > >>> > >>>> On Apr 20, 2017, at 11:32, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> I just want a plan for when we upgrade. Log4j is such low level code > > that > >>>> it's not a big deal to me for using Java 8 syntax. I'm mostly > interested > >>> in > >>>> supporting the v8 APIs, and Spring has an interesting way of doing > that. > >>>> > >>>> On Wed, Apr 19, 2017 at 18:01, Ralph Goers < > ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> I can’t agree to that. See > >>>>> https://spring.io/blog/2015/04/01/ongoing-support-for- > >>> java-7-and-even-java-6 > >>>>> < > >>>>> https://spring.io/blog/2015/04/01/ongoing-support-for- > >>> java-7-and-even-java-6> > >>>>> for Spring’s perspective on this. Log4j is such a fundamental > framework > >>>>> that, while we need to support new features in the latest JDK, we > also > >>> need > >>>>> to continue to support older Java releases for as long as is > >>> reasonable. I > >>>>> know a few of you would always like to be on more current JDKs, but I > >>> have > >>>>> worked in environments that are very slow to upgrade. In fact, we > just > >>> got > >>>>> a question from someone who is still on 2.2 because they are stuck on > >>> Java > >>>>> 6. > >>>>> > >>>>> That said, I am all for discussing what a reasonable timeframe is. I > >>> don’t > >>>>> think 2022 makes any more sense than dropping support in July. > Whatever > >>> we > >>>>> decide we should give users at least 6 months notice. > >>>>> > >>>>> Ralph > >>>>> > >>>>>> On Apr 19, 2017, at 5:18 PM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Roadmap wise, I think dropping support for Java 7 when Java 9 comes > > out > >>>>>> might make sense, though that also depends on where we are > > release-wise > >>>>> at > >>>>>> the time. In the meantime, modularizing the core more and breaking > > into > >>>>>> more subprojects may help find any desires for a semantically > breaking > >>>>>> change for version 3. I don't really see that happening with the > API, > >>> and > >>>>>> I'm not so sure how important it'd be in Core, though they could be > >>>>>> versioned separately in theory. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 19 April 2017 at 12:59, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> > >>> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 19, 2017 at 10:23 AM, Ralph Goers < > >>>>> ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I have no idea what your versions are, but 2.9 is going to contain > >>> the > >>>>>>>> first support for Java 9, but it will continue to support Java > 7. I > >>> am > >>>>>>>> assuming your numbering scheme is about what version ONLY > supports a > >>>>>>>> particular Java release? I am not in favor of that. With semantic > >>>>>>>> versioning the number should only change when the API changes. > Just > >>> as > >>>>>>> we > >>>>>>>> did when we moved from Java 6 to Java 7 we don’t have to increment > >>> the > >>>>>>>> project version number. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Yeah, that's why I said I was not in love with the version > proposal. > >>>>> What I > >>>>>>> am really after is a road-map to give our users an idea of what to > >>>>> expect. > >>>>>>> I suspect a wiki page might be best for that. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I am not worried about hanging on to Java 7 “too long”, so long as > > we > >>>>>>>> continue to find ways to support new Java features. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I suspect you still have not looked at my branch > >>>>> “java9NoMultiRelease”. I > >>>>>>>> have been planning on merging that to master but just haven’t find > >>> the > >>>>>>>> time. If you want to evaluate it before I merge it I suggest again > >>> that > >>>>>>> you > >>>>>>>> have a look. At the moment it only supports StackWalker but it > >>> allows > >>>>> us > >>>>>>>> to start implementing support for Java modules and other Java 9 > >>>>> features. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> You are correct, I have not looked. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Gary > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Ralph > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Apr 19, 2017, at 10:12 AM, Gary Gregory < > garydgreg...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Hi All, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> I like projects that have a road-map page. It can be vague or > >>> precise. > >>>>>>>> But > >>>>>>>>> we should at least discuss it here. I am bringing this up partly > in > >>>>>>> light > >>>>>>>>> of https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LOG4J2-1883 > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> How about: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> v 2.x - Java 7 > >>>>>>>>> v 3.x - Java 8 > >>>>>>>>> v 4.x - Java 9 > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Is that too weird? I am not in love with it either. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> I am just concerned that: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> - We might hang on to Java 7 a little too long. > >>>>>>>>> - We are missing on getting into Java 8. I feel like we are. > > (Jetty, > >>>>>>>>> Hibernate, Teiid, and others are on Java 8, sure they are higher > >>> level > >>>>>>>>> pieces but still, the momentum is there.) > >>>>>>>>> - Playing with an unreleased Java 9 might bite us with Ralph's > >>> double > >>>>>>>>> compile (which I'll admit I have not seen ;-) or really know if > >>> Java 9 > >>>>>>>>> compiled code would end up in our releases (which could bite us > or > >>>>>>> not.) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Thoughts? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Gary > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org > >>>>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition > >>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1617290459/ref=as_li_tl? > >>>>>>>> ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1617290459&link > >>>>>>>> Code=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=cadb800f39946ec62ea2b1af9fe6a2 > b8> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a=1617290459> > >>>>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition > >>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182021/ref=as_li_tl? > >>>>>>>> ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182021&link > >>>>>>>> Code=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=31ecd1f6b6d1eaf8886ac902a24de4 > >>> 18%22> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a=1935182021> > >>>>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action > >>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182951/ref=as_li_tl? > >>>>>>>> ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182951&link > >>>>>>>> Code=%7B%7BlinkCode%7D%7D&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=%7B%7Bli > >>>>>>>> nk_id%7D%7D%22%3ESpring+Batch+in+Action> > >>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a=1935182951> > >>>>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com > >>>>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ > >>>>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org > >>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition > >>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1617290459/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1617290459& > >>>>>>> linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId= > cadb800f39946ec62ea2b1af9fe6a2 > >>> b8> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>> 1617290459> > >>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition > >>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182021/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182021& > >>>>>>> > >>>>> linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId= > 31ecd1f6b6d1eaf8886ac902a24de4 > >>> 18%22 > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>> 1935182021> > >>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action > >>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182951/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182951& > >>>>>>> linkCode=%7B%7BlinkCode%7D%7D&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=%7B% > >>>>>>> 7Blink_id%7D%7D%22%3ESpring+Batch+in+Action> > >>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>> 1935182951> > >>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com > >>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ > >>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> [image: MagineTV] > >> > >> *Mikael Ståldal* > >> Senior software developer > >> > >> *Magine TV* > >> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com > >> > >> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this > >> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message > >> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may > not > >> copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > >> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply > >> email. > > > -- Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
