On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 9:11 PM Nathan Hartman wrote: > On Thu, Oct 14, 2021 at 12:23 PM Gregory Nutt wrote: > > >> .... The Linux Foundation and the ASF are both not-for-profit > > >> organizations, but they different significantly in their legal > > >> organizations. I forget the non-project corporation types but > > >> basically, the Linux Foundation is dedicated to free business > > >> development. Projects are controlled through management teams > > >> composed of businesses, usually by paying a fee and getting power > > >> within the project based upon the amount that the business paid > > >> (Silver, Gold, Platinum levels for example). > > >> > > >> The ASF is a different kind of not-for-profit organization, it is > > >> dedicated to the people who use the software project, not to > > >> businesses. So for the ASF it is the user community that matters, > > >> not the businesses that use the software. An ASF project is > > >> controlled by individuals in the community that have made significant > > >> contributions to the project. You will often hear ASF people say > > >> "Community over code." (I personally like code more that people, but > > >> that is just me). > > > > > > Here is the missing details: > > > > > > Linux Foundation is an IRS 501(c)(6) nonprofit organization and the > > > Apache Software Foundation is an IRS 501(c)(3) nonprofit > > > organization. According to > > > https://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=content.view&cpid=1559: > > > > > > * 501(c)(3): Religious, Educational, Charitable, Scientific, > > > Literary, Testing for Public Safety, to Foster National or > > > International Amateur Sports Competition, or Prevention of Cruelty > > > to Children or Animals Organizations > > > * 501(c)(6): Business Leagues, Chambers of Commerce, Real Estate > > > Boards, etc. > > > > > > Basically community first vs. business first. > > > > > One more anecdote then I promise to STFU > > > > As most of you know, Xiaomi sponsored and advocated NuttX to join the > > ASF. Xiaomi have been great partners and, despite my leeriness of > > businesses, it has been a pleasure working with them. > > > > But a couple of years prior to that, Samsung sponsored NuttX in a > > similar way to join the Linux Foundation. After a few weeks of > > discussions, I realized that what Samsung was advocating was not in the > > interests of the project but served only Samsung and I discontinued that > > conversation. One good thing that came from that was a clarification of > > my values and what values are necessary to retain in the project in > > order for me to relinquish control of it to others. I summarized all of > > those things in the top-level INVIOLABLES.md which is essential the > > "contract" under which I gave the project away. Most of the items in > > that list are things that Samsung wanted to change: They did not want > > to follow the standard POSIX/Unix OS interface, they wanted to change > > the coding style, they only wanted to support ARM with GCC under Linux, > > they wanted to rebrand the project to use a Samsung marketing name, .. > > > > That all makes sense if you understand the fundamental differences > > between the Linux Foundation and the ASF. > > > > > They could fork the code and do with the fork whatever they'd like provided > they respect the license, but I certainly hope that (original) NuttX always > remains POSIX-like/Unix-like, with support for multiple architectures, > multiple compilers, ... These features are among the biggest reasons I've > adopted NuttX. Getting rid of them would defeat the whole purpose! > > Cheers, > Nathan
Exactly! This is the kind of situation I had in mind to avoid.. look how Google or Samsung (Mobiles) became Microsoft (PC) with easily available but extremely low quality products based on enforced changes and limited life time (planned obsolescence).. you can tell a difference when using BSD based Apple products but they are strictly limited in customization and extremely expensive, also PlayStation using FreeBSD did not share back the video drivers in any way (that really suck here to be honest) but well BSD license allows that. I am using Open-Source for around 23 years since my first PC, before that I had Amiga (~1994) and Atari (~1988) so I saw some of those fancy 1..3 years trends and in the long run Open-Source is the only way to go! :-) I am really impressed by the Open-Source support from Espressif, thus my switch towards ESP32-C3 (RISC-V is also Open-Source), they seem to know how to hire best passionate people out there :-) Also I was really impressed by Xiami MiBand 5 with color display, smooth experience, long battery life and such a detailed manufacturing for such a small price - I did not even know it was based on NuttX. Chinese folks seems to focus on goals and achievements in the first place, not the paperwork and bureaucracy, thus their earned success. I think I may be getting close to my perfect match RTOS. But the ultimate test for platform independence and scalability will be running NuttX on my 8-bit Atari one day developed on FreeBSD workstation.. and so the journey begins :-) :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info
