Re: [DISCUSSION] JIRA notifications and reaching contributors

[Michael Brohl]

I fully agree, Scott.






Regards,

Michael Brohl

ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de


Am 25.04.19 um 21:56 schrieb Scott Gray:

We should also not forget users using mailing list archives. It would be a nightmare to follow dev@ discussions on ponymail with all these Jira notifications. I see no evidence that we attract more new contributors through Jira notifications, I assume the contrary.

The problem is that jira notification volume far exceeds dev list volume
which has the effect of stifling dev list discussions due to them being
pushed far down the list of recent emails.  The only solution to that is to
filter the jira notifications.  Right now in gmail I can see one week's
worth of jira emails and around 6 weeks worth of dev conversations.  Dev
list discussions are far more important that jira notifications, anything
important happening in jira should already have been discussed in the dev
list.  So we took the opinionated approach that dev list users should not
have to set up a filter in order to avoid being bombarded with low value
notifications.  I would much rather have contributors fully engaged in dev
list discussions than drown them in jira notifications.

Regards
Scott

On Fri, 26 Apr 2019 at 06:43, Pierre Smits <pierresm...@apache.org> wrote:

We can not prevent those not interested in what is happening to
unsubscribe. And with modern mail clients (or online solutions) anyone not
interested to see posting about specific categories (commits, JIRA
notifications) can set filters there to:

    1. have the postings of these categories automatically moved to other
    (sub-)folders, or
    2. have the posting automatically deleted


This is not about those of the community who do not want to be informed or
want to see/do less, but rather about reaching more (potential)
contributors. The implementation of the result of the vote conveniences
those not interested. If we suppose that all of the PMC members and all of
the committers have subscribed to notifications@, then only 11 out of 574
dev subscribers or out of 926 users@ subscribers see stuff regarding OFBiz
issues.

Michael makes the point that those interested should subscribe, leaving it
to them to show interest. But we should turn it around, as it was before,
in order to attract more. More parties to work with (adpoters) and/or to
contribute to have a better product faster.

Best regards,

Pierre Smits

*Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President*
*Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member*
Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer
*Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without privileges)
since 2008*
Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer


On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 1:59 PM Jacques Le Roux <
jacques.le.r...@les7arts.com> wrote:

I used to have a filter on "(OFBIZ-" to redirect to my OFBiz Jira folder.
Having a specific list is easier indeed.

Jacques

Le 25/04/2019 à 13:39, Swapnil M Mane a écrit :

I am also inline with Michael's comments.


- Best Regards,
Swapnil M Mane,
ofbiz.apache.org



On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 4:48 PM Michael Brohl <

michael.br...@ecomify.de>

wrote:

I strongly suggest to stay with the split between notifications@ and

dev@.

It makes the dev@ discussions a lot better to follow, these would

drown

in the Jira notifications. I suspect that we would make users
unsubscribe dev@ if we would have notifications@ in there also.

If people are interested in getting the notifications, they can
subscribe anytime. It might be reasonable to encourage people in the
dev@/user@ lists to subscribe there if we believe they are not aware

of

the notifications@ list.

Regards,

Michael Brohl

ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de


Am 25.04.19 um 12:20 schrieb Pierre Smits:

Hi All,

Back in 2016 it was decided that notifications go to the separate

mailing

list notifications@ofbiz.a.o. See [1]. And looking at latest numbers
reported regarding subscriptions to our mailing lists, we have:

      - user@: 926
      - dev@: 574
      - commits@: 218
      - notifications@: 78

The numbers regarding user@, dev@ and notifications@ are from

2018-06-20,

and the number regarding notifications@ is from 2018-03-20, see [2].

The numbers indicate that about 14% of our contributor potential

subscribed

to the dev@ sees these notifications about bugs and improvements,

and

less

than 9%  of our greater community  (subscribed to user@) are

reached.

And

when we factor in the impact of PMC members and committers (I can

only

guess how many of those have subscribed) on notifications@) the

ratios

are

even worse.

The effect of the low number of subscriptions to notifications@ is

that

we

don't reach our potential and that we don't see the input of dev@

and

user@

subscribers, leading to an overload of those working tickets.

Did we take a wrong turn back in 2016? And should we not revert the
resolution of the vote to have notifications go back to dev@ to get

more

contributions (potentially leading to more - active - committers that

share

and lessen the work load?

What do you think?


[1] [VOTE] Create a "notifications" mailing list
<

https://ofbiz.markmail.org/message/6hlbap7a6cam3rm2?q=%22%5BVOTE%5D+Create+a+%22notifications%22+mailing+list+%22+list:org%2Eapache%2Eofbiz%2Edev+order:date-forward

Best regards,

Pierre Smits

*Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President*
*Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member*
Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer
*Apache OFBiz <https://ofbiz.apache.org>, contributor (without

privileges)

since 2008*
Apache Steve <https://steve.apache.org>, committer

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