Rendering beautifully on mobile. This is neat as. On Tuesday, April 5, 2016, Mattmann, Chris A (3980) < chris.a.mattm...@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
> LOVE the style and of course GH pages and the work there > is superior to the CMS. > > Let’s explore this..great start. > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. > Chief Architect > Instrument Software and Science Data Systems Section (398) > NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA > Office: 168-519, Mailstop: 168-527 > Email: chris.a.mattm...@nasa.gov <javascript:;> > WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Director, Information Retrieval and Data Science Group (IRDS) > Adjunct Associate Professor, Computer Science Department > University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA > WWW: http://irds.usc.edu/ > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > > > > > > > > On 4/5/16, 7:06 PM, "Tom Barber" <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi <javascript:;>> > wrote: > > >Okay, spent an hour hacking around ideas tonight, just to get a feel for > >things. > > > >http://buggtb.github.io/oodt-website/ > > > >I've only messed around with a frontpage and basic blog listing. You can > >see what i'm trying to do in breaking it up a bunch, I still want to do > >make the text easier to digest, its all a bit "wordy" for a front page, > but > >broken up with an architecture diagram I stole from one of Chris' slides > >gives non users a quick visual representation of what it is. > > > >Of course I could have done that in CMS, but I can assure you it was 100 > >times quicker locally and pushing the changes up, but as I discussed the > >other day that's not the whole reason, as I was wanting something that > >makes it easier for non technical users to contribute news and blog stuff > >to. > > > > > https://raw.githubusercontent.com/buggtb/oodt-website/master/_posts/2016-01-04-oodt-011-released.md > > > > > >They are pretty straightforward, and as we found the other day, there is a > >github based editor for these things for those who don't want to mess with > >markdown. You can also submit blog posts in html and they'll be rendered > >just fine. > > > >I'm not trying to undo the work that was done during the rewrite and Chris > >mentioned his affection for SK's old site, I liked it to, my only gripe > >with that was the inability for easy fixes from users! Which is resolved > >sorta with CMS but personally I think its even easier for users with a > >github fork -> PR setup, which is basically what would happen with > >gitsubpub. > > > >https://github.com/buggtb/oodt-website > > > >I'll probably leave it at that for a while, I just wanted to play with > some > >stuff and share it back. > > > >Tom > > > >On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 10:02 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (3980) < > >chris.a.mattm...@jpl.nasa.gov <javascript:;>> wrote: > > > >> Understood, OK Tom. > >> > >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. > >> Chief Architect > >> Instrument Software and Science Data Systems Section (398) > >> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA > >> Office: 168-519, Mailstop: 168-527 > >> Email: chris.a.mattm...@nasa.gov <javascript:;> > >> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ > >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >> Director, Information Retrieval and Data Science Group (IRDS) > >> Adjunct Associate Professor, Computer Science Department > >> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA > >> WWW: http://irds.usc.edu/ > >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On 4/5/16, 12:10 PM, "Tom Barber" <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi > <javascript:;>> wrote: > >> > >> >Yeah, I'm not suggesting we switch any time soon. > >> > > >> >My viewpoint is thus: we can do a better job with content, look and > feel > >> >and the maintenance side. > >> > > >> >Personally, I find the CMS hard to use, maybe its just me, who knows. > So, > >> >my suggestion is purely do some POC work to come up with what may, or > may > >> >not be a better solution. If the workflow and tech is acceptable, then > >> >build out the site in the new tech, it can be demoed on GH pages or > >> >wherever in the interim, and finally, when we're happy with the > content, > >> >the theme and the ability to update it, then... and only then do we > change > >> >it. > >> > > >> >From my own opinion, I want to put some more free time into improving > the > >> >site, but I feel that it would be a much quicker and more efficient > >> process > >> >if the stuff wasn't inside CMS, that is all. > >> > > >> >Tom > >> > > >> >On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 2:27 PM, Chris Mattmann < > chris.mattm...@gmail.com <javascript:;>> > >> >wrote: > >> > > >> >> Tom, my comment here is that we tried to do the exact > >> >> same thing in Summer 2014 on XDATA. Just note that > >> >> “dummy site” is now what we have in our operational > >> >> site for Apache OODT. I think we have just only recently > >> >> come to a point where it’s more stable (we don’t have > >> >> people like Sebb coming externally saying our links don’t > >> >> work). > >> >> > >> >> Now you are proposing to change the site again, which > >> >> design wise is fine by me (though shows how much I know > >> >> since I liked SK’s old site even - and the new site started > >> >> by the next generation also looks nice too). However, > >> >> stability wise it’s not fine by me unless *the entire site* > >> >> is migrated, and until we run a link checker against it > >> >> long before turning on the switch to move over to it. > >> >> > >> >> No one is clamoring for a website redesign - it’s mostly > >> >> been discussion led by you and commented on by Val, and > >> >> Lewis. > >> >> > >> >> My 2c. > >> >> > >> >> Cheers, > >> >> Chris > >> >> > >> >> — > >> >> Chris Mattmann > >> >> chris.mattm...@gmail.com <javascript:;> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On 4/5/16, 8:55 AM, "Tom Barber" <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi > <javascript:;>> wrote: > >> >> > >> >> >Okay here's what I propose. Apache CMS will be retired, not any time > >> >> soon, but at some point in the medium term future. ASF Infra offer > >> >> gitsubpub/svnsubpub as the standard for website publishing and we(I?) > >> want > >> >> something more useable for non webdevs. Thats not necessarily code > free, > >> >> but certainly an easy process for people to upload new content. > >> >> >My suggestion is that I knock up a dummy replacement site in Jekyll, > >> that > >> >> migrates across a couple of the pages and some dummy blog content, > and > >> I'll > >> >> come back and demonstrate the user publishing flow, at which point we > >> can > >> >> have a discussion as to whether its something we pursue, or not. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >Sound like a plan? > >> >> > > >> >> >Of course in the mean time, if anyone else has any suggestions for a > >> >> "dynamic" static website, speak up! > >> >> > > >> >> >Tom > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 10:09 AM, Tom Barber < > tom.bar...@meteorite.bi <javascript:;>> > >> >> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >Indeed Val > >> >> >Ease of use is something I'm trying to achieve because it makes it > >> easier > >> >> for everyone to help maintain our resources with minimum effort. > >> >> > > >> >> >In Jekyll (if that was a chosen solution Markdown is entirely > optional, > >> >> you can just as easily publish HTML content as markdown, I just > >> mentioned > >> >> it as an easy barrier to get people to write blog posts, but there > are a > >> >> bunch of HTML generating apps on the market, of you could use the WP > >> >> editor, and hit the source button and copy the content from WP to > >> Jekyll, > >> >> not great always the most obvious workflow, but would do the job. > >> >> > > >> >> >Also, not tried it, but Prose.io gives you a MD WYSIWYG editor for > >> >> github, so assuming we were running the fork -> pull request model, > you > >> >> could edit the OODT site using Prose on Github and just push over a > pull > >> >> request with the changes made. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >Prose seems to support basic formatting and inserting of images, > once a > >> >> website template is designed I would expect contributers to do any > more > >> >> anyway, unless they wanted to, content should be about writing a blog > >> post > >> >> of page and hitting the go button. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >A quick google also reveals some Word to Markdown tools, I've not > used > >> >> them either, but I guess they would do a job. > >> >> > > >> >> >Tom > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 1:30 AM, Mallder, Valerie < > >> >> valerie.mall...@jhuapl.edu <javascript:;>> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >You are absolutely right, in markdown you would be missing images. > My > >> >> objection to using markdown is having to learn a new language syntax > for > >> >> styling the text. I have no objection to having a static site. I just > >> want > >> >> it to be easy to use and not require that you have to spend time > >> learning > >> >> something new. If it takes too much time to do (because you have to > >> learn > >> >> some new stuff in order to do it) you may find that people will put > it > >> on > >> >> their todo list but never end up getting to it because they are too > busy > >> >> working on higher priority tasks in their day jobs. I think your > primary > >> >> goal (when choosing what you want to do) should be to add as little > >> work as > >> >> possible to people's plates. That's all. If there are any WYSIWYG > >> editors > >> >> out there that have the option to do a "save as" to markdown format > that > >> >> would be optimal. But I don't know if there are any. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >Sent with Good (www.good.com <http://www.good.com>) > >> >> >________________________________ > >> >> >From: Tom Barber <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi <javascript:;>> > >> >> >Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2016 7:17:42 PM > >> >> >To: dev@oodt.apache.org <javascript:;> > >> >> >Subject: Re: OODT Website Changes (Redux) > >> >> > > >> >> >Also, (playing devils advocate) if it's a word doc why can't you > just > >> copy > >> >> >and paste it into a markdown file? The only major thing you'd be > >> missing > >> >> >is any images :) > >> >> > > >> >> >Another plus to a static blogging site is, if you decide it sucks > in a > >> few > >> >> >years time, you just have some html to move somewhere else, it's > >> just a > >> >> >static website, if you decide WordPress sucked or infra said they'd > >> host > >> >> >it, then down the line changed their mind, you'd have a much bigger > >> task > >> >> >on your hands. > >> >> > > >> >> >Tom > >> >> >On 3 Apr 2016 00:07, "Tom Barber" <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi > <javascript:;>> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> Hey Val, > >> >> >> > >> >> >> You can write HTML and a bunch of other stuff, but I'm trying to > >> offer > >> >> up > >> >> >> a solution that is easy for people to deploy and develop on > outside > >> of > >> >> the > >> >> >> Apache infrastructure, and markdown, being just text is easy to > >> deploy. > >> >> >> Also Wordpress etc require databases and backing infra where as > >> Jekyll > >> >> is > >> >> >> purely static HTML by the time it is deployed. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> I have no idea if Infra would support wordpress anyway, I doubt > it, > >> when > >> >> >> they said they were retiring Apache CMS, it wasn't like "oh but > don't > >> >> worry > >> >> >> folks, you can stand up a wordpress website", I could be wrong, > but > >> that > >> >> >> was my impression. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> At the end of a day, creating a blog post that looks like: > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> > >> > https://raw.githubusercontent.com/maciakl/Sample-Jekyll-Site/master/_posts/2012-02-10-code-snippets.markdown > >> >> >> > >> >> >> is much quicker than writing a bunch of HTML, but the Apache CMS > is > >> >> also a > >> >> >> bit of a lie, because if you think you don't have to write HTML > >> because > >> >> its > >> >> >> a CMS, you're sorely mistaken! ;) > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Tom > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 12:00 AM, Mallder, Valerie < > >> >> >> valerie.mall...@jhuapl.edu <javascript:;>> wrote: > >> >> >> > >> >> >>> I am not familiar with Jekyll, but I disagree with using > markdown. > >> Why > >> >> >>> must we write in any kind of markup language? That would suck. > Why > >> not > >> >> just > >> >> >>> use a better CMS? There are plenty out there. I personally > develop > >> >> websites > >> >> >>> in Wordpress. It's free and very easy to use. You can edit posts > in > >> a > >> >> >>> WYSIWYG editor. You can also copy-paste from a Word doc into the > >> post. > >> >> Just > >> >> >>> my opinion. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >>> Sent with Good (www.good.com <http://www.good.com>< > >> http://www.good.com > >> >> >) > >> >> >>> ________________________________ > >> >> >>> From: Tom Barber <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi <javascript:;>> > >> >> >>> Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2016 6:45:21 PM > >> >> >>> To: dev@oodt.apache.org <javascript:;> > >> >> >>> Subject: OODT Website Changes (Redux) > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Alright folks, > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Most peope who have been on the list for a while know we moved > from > >> the > >> >> >>> most static of static websites to Apache CMS a while ago to allow > >> for > >> >> more > >> >> >>> regular updating and maintenance of the website. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Lewis then put a bunch of work into creating a template for the > CMS > >> >> >>> website > >> >> >>> and we revamped a lot of the content, but the CMS has a bunch of > >> issues > >> >> >>> both in the ease of developing a website and also in maintenance > so > >> the > >> >> >>> Infra team are retiring it. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> My personal opinion(having done some of this in my day job, and > >> >> discussed > >> >> >>> similar on some other ASF projects) is we migrate the website to > >> >> gitsubpub > >> >> >>> and Jekyll. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> This will give us the ability to easily stand up the existing > >> website > >> >> on > >> >> >>> our own laptops, or development servers make changes and deploy > >> them. > >> >> Also > >> >> >>> without the templating system that Apache CMS enforces upon you, > >> its a > >> >> >>> far > >> >> >>> quicker development cycle. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Of course we could just use standard HTML & Javascript, but part > of > >> the > >> >> >>> reason I'd like to use Jekyll is the fact users can create > content > >> >> using > >> >> >>> Markdown syntax instead of HTML and Javascript. Jekyll is a > static > >> >> >>> blogging > >> >> >>> platform, so its designed for frequent updating, and as people > may > >> have > >> >> >>> noticed I've been blogging OODT stuff on my personal blog because > >> the > >> >> CMS > >> >> >>> is a pain to update. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Has anyone got an opinion? It feels like we did stage one which > was > >> >> make > >> >> >>> the website easier to update, but stage two is to make the > process a > >> >> lot > >> >> >>> easier, and standardised. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Cheers > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Tom > >> >> >>> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> > >> > -- *Lewis*
