Thanks. I was going to do that, but my week didn’t go as planned…
> On Mar 9, 2018, at 10:07 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
>
> I just switched to the data in
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Blank_US_map_borders.svg.
>
> I will start an RC tomorrow if there are no further issues.
>
> -Alex
>
> On 3/6/18, 9:29 AM, "Alex Harui" <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> So you want to ship with the controversial situation we have now?
>>
>> I'm not going to start a release unless we are going to get enough votes
>> and not get mired down in further debating of this situation. Also, if
>> there is a ruling that requires changes after I start the release then I
>> will have wasted time.
>>
>> IMO, safest plans are to pull the example, or switch to a different set of
>> data points that is already Public Domain.
>>
>> What do others think?
>> -Alex
>>
>> On 3/6/18, 8:42 AM, "Harbs" <harbs.li...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I figured I’d wait a couple of weeks. Like I said: I don’t think it
>>> should hold up a release if we don’t get an answer immediately.
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Mar 6, 2018, at 6:11 PM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It is March 6. How many days should we wait? Especially given that
>>>> the
>>>> current VP Legal as resigned and no replacement has been announced yet?
>>>>
>>>> Thoughts?
>>>> -Alex
>>>>
>>>> On 3/6/18, 1:03 AM, "Harbs" <harbs.li...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The path data appears to be from the CC-BY derivative and not the
>>>>> public
>>>>> domain original.
>>>>>
>>>>> I do think we need to either get clarification of replace the path
>>>>> data
>>>>> (and possibly SVG file). I’m happy doing it myself.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have opened a JIRA for an official ruling on the topic. It feels
>>>>> like
>>>>> it’s easier to just replace the data than get the ruling, but I think
>>>>> this is something which *should* have a ruling. If it’s OK to reuse
>>>>> SVG
>>>>> data in Cat B images, folks shouldn’t have to jump through hoops just
>>>>> because there’s nothing clear on the topic.
>>>>>
>>>>> I do think it’s a relatively minor issue and should be classified as a
>>>>> bug. It’s not something that should hold up a release if it can’t be
>>>>> resolved before the next release. I just created an issue on the
>>>>> topic.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Harbs
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mar 6, 2018, at 7:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Om,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Comments inline.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/5/18, 3:09 PM, "omup...@gmail.com <mailto:omup...@gmail.com> on
>>>>>> behalf of OmPrakash Muppirala"
>>>>>> <omup...@gmail.com <mailto:omup...@gmail.com> on behalf of
>>>>>> bigosma...@gmail.com <mailto:bigosma...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 2:47 PM, Alex Harui
>>>>>>> <aha...@adobe.com.invalid>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Om,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am not able to follow your logic. I think I've read your full
>>>>>>>> email
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> have looked at the links. It appears you are trying to say that
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> data
>>>>>>>> points we are using came from [1], but to me, [1] seems clearly
>>>>>>>> under
>>>>>>>> GNU
>>>>>>>> Document and CC-BY-SA. The act of removing the state names from
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> data
>>>>>>>> in [2] made it a derivative work, and it appears that the author of
>>>>>>>> [1]
>>>>>>>> says that work is not under Public Domain.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The SVG asset itself is licensed as such. We are not using the svg
>>>>>>> asset
>>>>>>> anywhere. We are only using the map data which came from some other
>>>>>>> source.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Map data is not copyrightable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please read the section under "The map wasn’t eligible for copyright
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> first place" here:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.p
>>>>>>> u
>>>>>>> bl
>>>>>>> ic
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.
>>>>>>> p
>>>>>>> ub
>>>>>>> lic>
>>>>>>> domainsherpa.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fdoma
>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>> ns
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> herpa.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7Caa8f41c3bb32452833fb
>>>>>>> 0
>>>>>>> 8d
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 583411c9b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C63655923802978
>>>>>>> 5
>>>>>>> 55
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 6&sdata=Zu9S5xPRzulIqUlZ%2FgPEGVs0yjZNiNcPuMvB%2FfirN8E%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> %2
>>>>>>> Fpublic-domain-maps.html&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.c
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> om%7Cdb3e0b405fdc43cf995108d582ee4e3b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178dec
>>>>>>> e
>>>>>>> e1
>>>>>>> %7
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> C0%7C0%7C636558882380334796&sdata=lhmEgOxJKLHmRSz5JAwCLCuAI0Iqy3cn7QQ
>>>>>>> u
>>>>>>> %2
>>>>>>> FI
>>>>>>> aaOfQ%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> " If the components of the map are “entirely obvious” the map will
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>> copyrightable. For example, an outline map of the state of Texas, or
>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the US showing the state boundaries is *not* copyrightable. (Not
>>>>>>> creative.)
>>>>>>> Ditto maps that use standard cartographic conventions, like a survey
>>>>>>> map.
>>>>>>> (Not original.) "
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right after the passage you quote, it says this:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "This is could be a tough call in certain cases
>>>>>> (I mean, come on ... “entirely obvious”?) but
>>>>>> that's the what the courts have said. Just keep
>>>>>> in mind ... what you think is entirely obvious,
>>>>>> the mapmaker might contest as creative."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Let's see what other PMC members think. To me, the quote I pasted
>>>>>> indicates that this is still a controversial area. The definition of
>>>>>> "map
>>>>>> data", AIUI, has to be tied to facts. So, GIS coordinates, or any
>>>>>> other
>>>>>> lat/lng fact that is used to create a map is not copyrightable, and
>>>>>> any
>>>>>> map image produced by the US Government is in the public domain. But
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> believe there is a gray area around the digitizing of maps. The
>>>>>> number
>>>>>> of
>>>>>> points chosen which create the level of detail of a map could be
>>>>>> argued
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> be a form of expression as well as the line-weights chosen for the
>>>>>> lines.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, the provenance/history of how the SVG file you chose became
>>>>>> public
>>>>>> domain is murky. I was unable to determine where the data points
>>>>>> came
>>>>>> from.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To me, that's one reason why folks on wikimedia are claiming
>>>>>> copyright
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> different licensing on their maps that are essentially digitized from
>>>>>> public domain US Government maps. The fact that the data points for
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> states are different in different SVG files also leads me to believe
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> data points are not facts. I think the safest and least
>>>>>> controversial
>>>>>> option is for us to use a map that is in the public domain already.
>>>>>> This
>>>>>> map [1] seems to have a much simpler public domain provenance. Then
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> think there is less surface for nitpickers to attack.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If other PMC members want to go with the current data you have in the
>>>>>> files then I'll defer to them (and you).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>> -Alex
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [1]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommo
>>>>>> n
>>>>>> s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ABlank_US_map_borders.svg&data=02%7C01%7C
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> ha
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> 4
>>>>>> ae
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> MK6cvP8U5Vw7O5WRxCHI%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> o
>>>>>> ns
>>>>>>
>>>>>> .wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ABlank_US_map_borders.svg&data=02%7C01%7
>>>>>> C
>>>>>> ah
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> 9
>>>>>> 4a
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>>>>
>>>
>>
>
