On Thursday 09 March 2006 17:58, Paolo Molaro wrote: > > Our app, still does not run on mono! > > Did you ever file a bug report? The Windows.Forms guys will be happy to > fix the issues you are having.
You'd be flooded with bug reports :-) I guess this really is too much to ask,
the Trumpf application is very complex and we worked for a very long time to
get it display correctly on dotGNU (minus alpha transparency). I personally
fixed a whole truck-load of SWF bugs and became quite familiar with SWF and
that beast is really complex...
I did report a few bugs to the Mono list, but quickly gave up on it,
frustrated. Patches weren't accepted because I did not had the time to write
unit tests for them (although the fixes were trivial and obvious) or they
were simply ignored... I had to resend a patch to fix a bug in DataView 3
times until I finally got a response. I hope they treat contributors better
these days...
Again, I don't like to bash Mono, those folks sure do a great job. Maybe I
just had bad luck. It's just my personal experience with the Mono developers.
> On 03/09/06 Marc Haisenko wrote:
> > I'd like to add: I don't how things look now, but back when Trumpf
> > evaluated Mono its System.Windows.Forms was only available on x86 systems
> > because of the WINE dependency, while dotGNU's System.Windows.Forms ran
> > everywhere where
>
> Again, not true for a lot of time, now. In fact, some people who used to
> use dotGNU for it's Windows.Forms support, use mono now.
Yes, last time I checked (about half a year ago or so) I saw that their SWF
implementation has changed but wasn't sure off the top of my head whether
there still is any WINE dependency.
> > The Mono folks just don't have a focus on GUI programming, their focus is
> > on the server side.
>
> This is incorrect in many ways. If it wasn't for Mono's focus on GUI
> programming, we would have not developed Gtk# and the associated
> assemblies that allowed many new Linux GUI applications to be developed:
> tomboy, beagle, muine, banshee, monodevelop among them. Mono is a
> flexible runtime that allows us to run GUI apps from embedded systems
> like the Nokia 770 to common systems using Gtk# and other toolkits
> (like Cocoa on OSX). Of course mono works well also on the server, but
> this doesn't mean we neglected the GUI stuff, since it's clear we
> didn't. We of course focused first on Gtk#, because we are free software
> programmers and wanted to provide a nice development environment for
> programmers on Linux with the preferred gUI toolkit, but we also now
> support Windows.Forms for the legacy code people coming from a windows
> background may have.
Gtk# is nice, but it doesn't help folks porting apps from Windows to Linux.
There's also Qt# as far as I know, but same thing: it doesn't really help
porting an existing app as it requires a complete rewrite of the GUI code...
depending on the app that can mean almost the complete application.
> > In Mono you're not so happy. Things are very intermixed there. Granted, I
>
> Incorrect: we implemented libgdiplus and we have a driver layer to
> support win32, X11 and OSX windowing systems.
Yes, I saw that half a year ago... but I found the separation not to be as
good as it is on dotGNU. But that is just my personal, biased view (I've
spent a lot of time in dotGNU's SWF code :-)
> > So if you need to do GUI development I'd recommend dotGNU to you. Mono's
> > SWF isn't as mature, and if you need to fix bugs you'll have a harder
> > time to do so in Mono as their SWF code is not so good, IMHO.
>
> Well, given your incorrect assesment of Mono's SWF implementation,
> it's clear you haven't seen much of the code. How about if, instead of
> personal opinions, you provide actual SWF programs that don't work
> or don't work well in mono? Missing that, my advice to you is to expose
> the advantages of dotGNU, instead of mudthrowing at mono.
> Besides, Mono's SWF is supported, so if bug fixing is needed everyone can
> just file a bug report.
> Thanks.
See above: I gave up on it. I remember reporting to Mono how they can fix a
bug in their layouting code so it behaves correctly but that wasn't taken
seriously. Again, that may just be bad luck on my side.
But you are of course right that I haven't lately seen Mono's SWF code. But I
did work my way through it one and half years ago and had a (very brief)
glance at it about half a year ago, but overall that's surely outdated so I
really don't know about Mono's SWF code nowadays.
And I didn't throw mud. I clearly marked my words as my personal opinion and
that others should actually test it for themselves, didn't I ? If it arrived
on your side as mud throwing then I'm sorry, that was not my intention.
> lupus
C'ya,
Marc
--
Marc Haisenko
http://darkdust.net
Today is Pungenday, the 68th day of Chaos in the YOLD 3172
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